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Are full fits really worth $250?

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Are full fits really worth $250?

Old 06-05-11, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
Rowan, you ignorant ****, I'm not going to research every person who writes a post. I don't give a **** what their accreditations are, sarcasm is sarcasm. 9 times out of 10 I dont even look at the username who posted. I asked a question to which he provided a reply to that in no way was relevant, nor was it in any way constructive.

Get off your high horse and stop trying to put people in thei place on the Internet. Go get laid or something. Seems like you need it. That is if you can get your nerdy fingers off the keyboard for 5 seconds.
Tone down the disrespect noob
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Old 06-05-11, 08:26 AM
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Unless you race or are having chronic fit problems, what is the point?

It took me awhile to figure my fit out, but I'm glad I did it myself. I can make adjustments as my fitness level changes throughout the year and help out friends who are having fit problems.
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Old 06-05-11, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by mazdaspeed
Tone down the disrespect noob
Tone down the thinking someone can be condescending because they have a high post count, and someone cannot react to it because they have a low one.
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Old 06-05-11, 08:33 AM
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Which thread got deleted? Bad neighborhoods?
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Old 06-05-11, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Velo Gator
Which thread got deleted? Bad neighborhoods?
I deleted the freeway thread due to the fact that it simply turned into a mud slinging contest and everyone was, simply put, trying to correct me and tell me what to do as if I'd been born yesterday.

The bottom line is that if someone has a question, you should answer it if you know the answer. If your reply is some sarcastic tongue-in-cheek response, it's probably best left unsaid, due in part to the fact that on the internet one cannot tell your tone, the way in which you'd like something intrepreted, etc.

This thread is heading down the same road, partly because some of the more experienced riders here like to treat beginners like they are asking stupid questions all the time, and partly because I won't tolerate anyone internet or real life, speaking down to me. How would you guys like it if you thought you asked a legitimate question when you were starting out, and some guy who knew it all treated you like you knew nothing? If someone is having trouble with somehing, and you know the answer, it won't kill you to be kind and give them a helpful answer and help guide them the way you think they need to be guided (in a friendly and helpful manner.) If you feel you can't do this, the answer is simple; don't ****ing post!
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Old 06-05-11, 09:30 AM
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So are you going to get the fit?
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Old 06-05-11, 09:39 AM
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I believe so. I made an appointment, but I can always cancel if I change my mind. I rode about 30 miles last night and had no issues with pain, just my toes going to sleep. I've been moving my cleat around but I seem to only be making it worse, lol. 15 seconds with my foot on the ground at a stop light brings me back to normal.

at this point, I'm worried that I'm paying $250 to make my toes stay awake and whatever else happens. There is a part of me hoping that things improve that I didn't know could improve. I want to feel justified in spending the money.
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Old 06-05-11, 09:43 AM
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That's terrific. I think you will find it a useful investment.


I went riding today and (again) noticed that many riders using higher-priced bicycles had off-sync riding styles / positions on their bikes. Stuff like goofy foot positions, knees splaying out, excess forward lean, seats and seat post weirdnesses. I attribute this to not being properly fit on their bikes.

I had a BG Fit and the technician corrected some physiological issues like wide foot, one leg shorter than the others and on the computer allowed me to see what my optimal positioning looked like on the bike. It's an investment that continues to pay out as I am able to cycle clean vs. choppy. This amounts to higher overall efficiency and I'm pretty happy about this as I didn't get passed by anyone today on the loop.
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Old 06-05-11, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
I don't think foot problems are going to go away with a fitting. Sounds more like podiatrist territory. And it's going to cost more than $250
I would counter this, if you don't have proper extension which impedes a good circular motion, you may end up curling your toes to compensate when pulling the pedals back. I lowered my seat and moved it slightly forward, problem solved. I notice I have a more fluid motion and no irritation from excess pressure on the ball/toes of my feet.

No idea's on a professional fit, however if you have a bike that you know you will be riding for the next few years, I would definitely throw down the cash for peace of mind.
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Old 06-05-11, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Diegomayra
No idea's on a professional fit, however if you have a bike that you know you will be riding for the next few years, I would definitely throw down the cash for peace of mind.
I'm under the imprssion you are given a set up that can be "transferred" to another bicycle, understanding there are differences between each bike.
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Old 06-05-11, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
I'm under the imprssion you are given a set up that can be "transferred" to another bicycle, understanding there are differences between each bike.
That hard data/ergonomic info is stored in the computer and should be able to be transferred onto any similar bike. At the shop the bike which was used to get the data was a Roubiax which was transferred to a Tarmac which is what I ride.
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Old 06-05-11, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
I'm under the imprssion you are given a set up that can be "transferred" to another bicycle, understanding there are differences between each bike.
Yup. When I bought the correctly-sized frameset I needed, I gave my LBS the sheet with the dimensions on it, and they set it up that way. It came out perfect. (The fitter was the third unconnected person to tell me I needed a larger frame...I figured the preponderance of evidence was there, so I bought another frameset.)
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Old 06-05-11, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Essex
That hard data/ergonomic info is stored in the computer and should be able to be transferred onto any similar bike. At the shop the bike which was used to get the data was a Roubiax which was transferred to a Tarmac which is what I ride.
cool! I feel like my bike has a pretty oddball geometry, but that it should still transfer just fine if I get another race geometry bike in the future, though at my age, I feel like my next bike will be a "comfort" model when my back wears out. ha
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Old 06-05-11, 10:21 AM
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At the risk of stirring things up, doesn't the perfect fit change depending on how hard you're riding, or as you get stronger, or more tired? I mean, pressing the pedals harder would mean less weight at other contact points, different force directions and seemingly different balance and position. I'm guessing that the differences would be minor for a Cat-whatever who has peaked physically or plateaued, shouldn't that be important to the guy laying out $250 a pop for exact seat placement who is not necessarily training for races? It seems like he'd have to keep going back as the parameters change.
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Old 06-05-11, 10:22 AM
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First a good fit is well worth it. Any reasonably higher-end new bike should come with one. It gives you a solid baseline from which you can make small changes, then always get back to where you started.

The fit will cover all the elements (cleat position etc.) but most critical gives you your XY coordinates that can be used on any bike - relative position of feet, hips and hands.
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Old 06-05-11, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by wphamilton
At the risk of stirring things up, doesn't the perfect fit change depending on how hard you're riding, or as you get stronger, or more tired? I mean, pressing the pedals harder would mean less weight at other contact points, different force directions and seemingly different balance and position. I'm guessing that the differences would be minor for a Cat-whatever who has peaked physically or plateaued, shouldn't that be important to the guy laying out $250 a pop for exact seat placement who is not necessarily training for races? It seems like he'd have to keep going back as the parameters change.
I asked that of my FIT specialist and there was a good discussion about comfort and anticipated abilities (as I got better) over time. That discussion led me to purchase a Tarmac vs. a Roubiax based on my current, as well as anticipated proficiency. That said - I haven't had enough time on the FIT bike to see any tweaks needed + it's glove perfect and nothing like getting it built from the ground up.

The FIT technician said to come back as necessary and if I wanted to go TRI, or other competitive I needed to get re-measured for very different bike geometries.
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Old 06-05-11, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by wphamilton
At the risk of stirring things up, doesn't the perfect fit change depending on how hard you're riding, or as you get stronger, or more tired? I mean, pressing the pedals harder would mean less weight at other contact points, different force directions and seemingly different balance and position. I'm guessing that the differences would be minor for a Cat-whatever who has peaked physically or plateaued, shouldn't that be important to the guy laying out $250 a pop for exact seat placement who is not necessarily training for races? It seems like he'd have to keep going back as the parameters change.
more or less, yes
but making changes during the actual ride is something only Merckx would actually attempt (he, quite often, would make saddle changes during an actual race! not just height, but also fore/aft - a mean trick if you're familiar with the old style Campy seatposts...)

'position' is a fluid thing.
certainly a TT position for someone would be way different from their 'road' position.

mostly, over time your body changes, for good or worse, and adjustments are often necessary. Knowing what to do is the ultimate objective. For others, going to a knowledgeable person becomes the approach.
When I started riding seriously I was lucky enough to have almost daily access to old guys who raced in Europe. Their knowledge came from thousands of hard miles on very hard roads and competition. It wasn't 'scientific', but rather experiential.
Much of it still works today - but a lot has been superceded by good studies and science - hence progress.
The 'up' side of regular access to a knowledgeable guy, who sees you riding regularly, is that they become familiar with you, your strengths weaknesses and so can help you tune and improve. A good coach - even the best in the world pay big bucks to have that person or organization.
A 'fitting' is usually doesn't allow for that.
And sometimes, getting into a better position can exacerbate some other problem...

Sadly, I no longer have those old riders to jostle me around at their pleasure. And, sadly, I never fully understood how much they helped me and passed on their 'heritage' until I no longer had their presence.
Gladly, I do remember them, and if I'm half rider many of them were, I'm good with that.

Use the tools available, sometimes they're 'free', sometimes you have to pay. If you learn something, all the better. If you appreciate the 'lifestyle' more because of it, then its all good.
If it doesn;t quite work, you'll learn something anyway - hopefully.
and keep moving to a better place.

peace out
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Old 06-05-11, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
I deleted the freeway thread due to the fact that it simply turned into a mud slinging contest and everyone was, simply put, trying to correct me and tell me what to do as if I'd been born yesterday...This thread is heading down the same road, partly because some of the more experienced riders here like to treat beginners like they are asking stupid questions all the time, and partly because I won't tolerate anyone internet or real life, speaking down to me.
I suspect the reason your threads tend to go downhill is that you have a huge chip on your shoulder and every slight (real or perceived) results in you selecting the nuclear option.

Last edited by Six jours; 06-05-11 at 12:17 PM.
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Old 06-05-11, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by cyclezen
more or less, yes
but making changes during the actual ride is something only Merckx would actually attempt (he, quite often, would make saddle changes during an actual race! not just height, but also fore/aft - a mean trick if you're familiar with the old style Campy seatposts...)

'position' is a fluid thing.
certainly a TT position for someone would be way different from their 'road' position.

mostly, over time your body changes, for good or worse, and adjustments are often necessary. Knowing what to do is the ultimate objective. For others, going to a knowledgeable person becomes the approach.
When I started riding seriously I was lucky enough to have almost daily access to old guys who raced in Europe. Their knowledge came from thousands of hard miles on very hard roads and competition. It wasn't 'scientific', but rather experiential.
Much of it still works today - but a lot has been superceded by good studies and science - hence progress.
The 'up' side of regular access to a knowledgeable guy, who sees you riding regularly, is that they become familiar with you, your strengths weaknesses and so can help you tune and improve. A good coach - even the best in the world pay big bucks to have that person or organization.
A 'fitting' is usually doesn't allow for that.
And sometimes, getting into a better position can exacerbate some other problem...

Sadly, I no longer have those old riders to jostle me around at their pleasure. And, sadly, I never fully understood how much they helped me and passed on their 'heritage' until I no longer had their presence.
Gladly, I do remember them, and if I'm half rider many of them were, I'm good with that.

Use the tools available, sometimes they're 'free', sometimes you have to pay. If you learn something, all the better. If you appreciate the 'lifestyle' more because of it, then its all good.
If it doesn;t quite work, you'll learn something anyway - hopefully.
and keep moving to a better place.

peace out
good post, thanks.

and as an aside, I'm truly jealous of the places you get to ride living in Goleta/SB. I've ridden around SB a few times and even mountain biked up around Camino Cielo. One of the most amazing places on earth.
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Old 06-05-11, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
This is a joke right?

You read foot problems from this? numbness in my left toes is almost undoubtedly caused by cleat or saddle, IM uneducated O.
And you could change either of these without spending $250. It's interesting that your problem is unilateral.
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Old 06-05-11, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Velo Gator
Which thread got deleted? Bad neighborhoods?
It was a thread about cue sheets (of all things!). I'm guessing that vicelord deleted it himself (or asked to have it be deleted). (It wasn't anything that I would have thought the moderators would have deleted (they might have P&R or trollheimed it.)

It seems that vicelord should learn to ignore advice he doesn't think is appropriate instead of getting mad and insulting people who are not being paid to give advice. He seems to be under the odd impression that this is his own private Q&A spot when many people tend to try to give answers that might be useful to other people too.

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Old 06-05-11, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by njkayaker
And you could change either of these without spending $250. It's interesting that your problem is unilateral.
you're right, I could. However, after fiddling around with the placement of each of them over and over, I can't seem to get it right.
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Old 06-05-11, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
you're right, I could. However, after fiddling around with the placement of each of them over and over, I can't seem to get it right.
Have you talked to your shop at all? They might be able to suggest something (or some approaches) without a fit. (I kind of doubt that a fit is going be a magic fix for your problem but it might help.)

Originally Posted by Vicelord
I've tried a few different socks. I'll try a friends pair of shoes and see. My shoes are pretty nice so I hope that isn't the problem.
If you use orthotics at all, you might want to see if you can try them.

Originally Posted by Vicelord
cool! I feel like my bike has a pretty oddball geometry, but that it should still transfer just fine if I get another race geometry bike in the future, though at my age, I feel like my next bike will be a "comfort" model when my back wears out. ha
The fit of a bike is related to three contact points (your feet/seat/hands) and their spacial relationship to each other. You can vary all sorts of stuff in between and get the same fit. (The shape of the bike parts at those contact points matter too.)

Anyway, the notion that there is one single perfect fit for anybody is a bit absurd. People have preferences that will make the fit different and different fits might work better for different kinds of riding (eg, hill climbing). Of course, cyclists move around on the bike which effectively changes their fit too.

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Old 06-05-11, 12:43 PM
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I do not use orthotics.

I have had them put my bike on the trainer and set up the seat and cleats according to my body's needs (or so they say, I dont yet fully understand body mechanics on a bicycle) and it hasn't helped.
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Old 06-05-11, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Vicelord
I do not use orthotics.

I have had them put my bike on the trainer and set up the seat and cleats according to my body's needs (or so they say, I dont yet fully understand body mechanics on a bicycle) and it hasn't helped.
But did you talk to them about the particular problem you are having?

You really should be specific about what shoes and pedals you are using.

And I hope you did a bit of googling too (since you don't mention what you found, it doesn't seem that you did).

https://www.cptips.com/footsyn.htm
https://www.active.com/cycling/Articl...le-Cycling.htm

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