halfspeed

Utter nonsense. When manufacturing went overseas, prices didn't drop, margins just increased. If manufacturing came back, prices wouldn't increase much (if at all), margins would just decrease. Price is primarily a function of supply and demand, not cost.

pallen

yeah, that may have less to do with China and more to do with high volume manufacturers gambling on enough sales to justify another high volume production run.

Ikarios

I'm not an expert in this matter at all but I recall reading a couple years ago, Japanese laborers do not get the benefits that American workers do - all the insurance, benefits, pension, 401k, etc etc. Sure it costs more to manufacture things in Japan, but costs compared to the US is still somewhat lower. Again if I'm wrong on this matter please say so.

pallen

I think some of both happened. If you can sell your Trek $100 cheaper than the equivalent Specialized and do twice the volume, you'll discount the price for a competitive edge.

badbikemechanic

I know right!

I have had plenty of coffee that is probably part of the problem.

Commodus

This is a good point too. To me, personally, it's okay if the CEO of a company only has one Ferrari to drive instead of two. Which is why I try to support companies that pay their workers fairly, wherever the factory may be.

DropDeadFred

yeah...i don't think its that we don't buy american made...unions and minimum wages as well as environmentalist are what drive productions overseas...even if you make the complaint that american workers are hungry for jobs they arent hungry enough to do whatever it takes...during the REAL depression of the early 1930s people worked for food or basically what would be considered well below the standard minimum wage today.

Americans have become spoiled and lazy and believe middle to upperclass living is a privilege rather than something that should be worked for. I myself refuse to let something as silly as an economic slump get me down. As a former business owner I saw well in advance when it was time to sell off my business and move on to something else. I've saved up considereable amounts to reinvest into a new business that will hopefully create more jobs. I'm not going to wait on the government to do that for me. The business is out there. people just need to make the sacrifices.

If you want to build bikes stateside...do it...promote it...be prepared to suffer and not make huge profit gains if any...
If you want to buy american..make the sacrifice and pay more and live without other things that might be better afforded if you were buying foreign made products....frankly i don't care where it's made...my buying it is putting food in somebodies mouth and I feel fine about it.

Clipped_in

I'm curious about this statement. I'm not claiming to know a lot about manufacturing, but I do work for a company that has designed and built six different facilities that produce the raw carbon fiber material. Four facilities here in Utah, one in Alabama, and one in Spain.

What is it about the manufacturing that is so much worse for the planet than the material production?

JAJ0404

I disagree - shareholders do not take kindly to decreased margins, your stock would drop faster than you can descend down a mountain.

Mithrandir

As someone else pointed out, prices never drop when manufacturing moves overseas; the only thing that happens is the company executives make more money.


Regardless, continuing to offshore production is starting to cause an issue with our entire economy. The more jobs that are offshored, the less GDP is generated in the states. The less GDP generated, the less people buy. The less people buy, the less companies sell. Offshoring leads to situations where in the long run, no one can afford to buy anything anymore... which is far more catastrophic than what you think will happen if we move the jobs back here.

One day we will wake up though. Hopefully before it's too late.

patentcad

Uh-huh.

What's with the whining? STFU and ride your bike kid.

DropDeadFred

+1 only poor people whine

Commodus

This is just classic far right propaganda.

spock

Poor don't whine in the cycling industry. They wanna make the bike for $50 and sell it for $3000. Poor wanna to get rich baby. It's the land of opportunities that come from overseas..

rbart4506

Really...I do believe someone needs to give their head a shake...

badbikemechanic

Ok right winger you were way ahead of the bell curve, and you work so freaking hard as you are sitting here bull ****ting on bike forums all morning.

I am humble enough to admit that the immigrant laborer who empties my trash at my office building is working way harder than I am even though I am making 3x what he/she is making. Repukes are disgusting.

badbikemechanic

I don't care who is making a profit. If you put all of the bike companies together I doubt their profits would break the DOW 500.
I just want to purchase a bicycle frame that is advertised for sale.

I doubt that it is a materials issue since aluminum is everywhere. The reason I can't purchase this particular bicycle is because Specialized is being overly prudent with their manufacturing orders. All that I ask is that they provide enough bicycles to meet their demand. They have failed to do this for the past couple of years. Yet Specialized has been increasing prices by 20% every year. Perhaps the price increase is meant to stifle demand.

Commodus

I'm not an expert in carbon manufacturing, but black carbon dust is bad for everything.

I read an interview with "Mr. Ellsworth" - I don't know if that's his name, but the guy who owns Ellsworth - where he talked about it quite a bit. Find it on their website probably.

JAJ0404

You don't get paid for working hard, you get paid for creating something of value that someone else is willing to pay for . . . . . . I work my a$$ off on my bike, but I'm not creating anything of value for anyone but myself . . . . . and I'm too cheap to pay myself what I'm worth.

dstrong 

Oh...is that all.

IBMTP&R

badbikemechanic

I work for the federal gov so I think I am more of the exception then the rule....but prior to this job I worked at bike shops for the past 15 years and didn't make anywhere near enough to afford the bikes I worked on. I am a damn good bike mechanic, and I worked much much harder than I do here.

Now that I can afford to buy bikes why can't I purchase the specialized ****ing crux. My original question/rant has never been directly addressed. Instead I got a giant theoretical and ambiguous argument about how bikes are supplied from china.

This guy just wants to buy the bike he wants so he can participate in the cross season this year. I feel that isn't very selfish.

And i don't understand all acronyms being thrown around. Like IBMTP&R for instance. If they are meant to be insults they are falling flat. I get enough ****ing acronyms with the feds.

spock

So it's just about you. "The bottom line is I GOTTA HAVE WHAT I WANT" Like a little spoiled 3 year old.

Then it's the fault of people like you that they moved overseas and are enable to meet the demand due to lack of resources probably. You know, there are other bike companies that will gladly sell you a cross bike... They may not be a huge name like specialized, but they might make a bike that is just as good and even made in America.

Costumer is definitely not always right.

badbikemechanic

I feel like I should address this directly spock. Currrently I have an American made Lysnkey pro29er and a independent fabrications crown jewel- both very much american made. What I ride has to have soul. Usually I find that the big ****ing four makes bike that lack soul. This bicycle is the exception so I gotta have it.

Can you tell me again why it is selfish to purchase a bike that is being advertised as available. According to Blaze Davies- a specialized inside rep- the bike not even be available at all. If specialized can't produce the bike they should simply take it off the website.

Why is it selfish again?

I got the money so I should be able to buy it.

Why is it selfish again?

himespau 

indeed.

RJM

What a load of b.s. from a condescending tool. The only whining I hear nowadays is rich white people loosing their stock money, complaining that the *******s are ruining the country. In fact your whole rant is one big lame crybaby whine.

You got that right, probably a Bachmann supporter.