And you're switching the setup. This started out as a comparsion of a 53/39/26 11-23 setup to a 50/34 11-28 setup
But the chart you posted is a 12-27 cassette not an 11-23. |
Originally Posted by Barrettscv
(Post 13492231)
You really are stuck on the "a double is better than a triple" concept that the industry pushes to reduce SKU's. BTW,
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Originally Posted by X-LinkedRider
(Post 13487279)
Because people that own triples RIDE triples. They don't don't photo shoot as much as double riders who think the more pictures you have, the faster you can go.
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 13492390)
And you're switching the setup. This started out as a comparsion of a 53/39/26 11-23 setup to a 50/34 11-28 setup
But the chart you posted is a 12-27 cassette not an 11-23. I'm comparing two common compact and triple road set-ups. This is for the benefit of others following the thread. Your mind is already made up and you’re not using logic at this point. But, to keep you happy; http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...levcompact.png |
Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 13492398)
And I'm not stuck on a double is better than a triple. Triples have their place. If you need the very wide range, a triple is your best option. If you don't need below a 34/28, then a compact double has advantages.
Besides, most of the time it's 53/39 11-23, with an extra chainring stuck on unused. http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...wart/zipp2.jpg |
Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 13492429)
My small chainring is used less than 0.5% of the time. But It allows me to go up any hill, even after 150km on a 200k event or longer. I've had a number of double cranks during the last two years. A 110 bcd Ultegra Compact. The 34t is too low for flat routes and not low enough for 20% climbs. The 50 is best when going more than 22 mph. The gap between the two is too big. http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...tXcrankset.jpg A 130 bcd 50 & 39t chainring Shimano crank. Nice group-ride crank when used with a 11-23 cassette. http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ictures004.jpg These are Cyclocross cranks. Below is a 110 bcd with 46 & 36 chainrings. http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...t/IMG_0125.jpg I had a 46 & 38t Sram crank that was great with a 12-27 cassette when used on the flat roads in my area. If I never took my bike out-of-state, that's the crank I would want. http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...asilver022.jpg I'm a spinner and not a masher. With the 50,39 & 26t I can spin from 90 to 100rpm an always have tight cog spacing from 15 mph to 36. I also can climb any hill without concern. |
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 13492371)
The screen shot from the website I'm using gives you a good graphic that shows the range and the spacing are pretty comparable:
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...earchart-1.jpg The gap between the 17t and the 15t cog with a 11-28 cassette is in a bad spot. Using the 50t chainring, the 11-28 cassette creates a cog spacing gap right in the middle of the 19 to 24 mph speed range. Using a 34t chainring creates cross chaining issues in the same speed range. Also, the 34t chainring and 11t cog can cross-chain and rub the chain against the 50t chainring on many bikes. You are always changing chainrings and double or triple shifting in the important 19 to 24 mph range. These problems are solved on a triple. - A 12-27 (or 11-23) cassette includes the useful 16t cog. The 17-16-15 cog group is very important on the 50t chainring. - The 39t chainring can use all 10 cogs with a good chainline and without rubbing the chain against the 50t chainring. The 17-16-15-14-13-12 cog set can fight a headwind at 17 mph and hold 25 mph with a 100 rpm cadence without changing chainrings. - The 39t Chainring and a 12t cog can travel at 25 mph at 100 rpm cadence. If I am traveling in the important 17 to 25 mph speed range I can make small 7-9% changes in cadence. Try that on a Compact double with an 11-28t cassette. |
What about the extensive shifting required to get similar cadences when you drop from the 39 to the 26 chainrings? You would need between 4-5 shifts to get back into the same range.
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What I think is even better than a compact or a triple is a triple than combines both concepts.
A 50/36/26 has perfectly even spacing between the chainrings (unlike a 50/39/26), has smaller gaps between the chainrings than a compact, and gives you wider range than both. If my knees were OK with a wider Q-factor, I'd be on a 50/36/26 with either a 12-23 or an 11-26 depending on the ride. |
This thread sickens me.
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Heh...here's my triple drivetrain...
Six Gap Criterium, downtown Dahlonega the night before the Six Gap Century. http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6120/...14956ca725.jpg Flickr pics |
Originally Posted by redlude97
(Post 13493073)
What about the extensive shifting required to get similar cadences when you drop from the 39 to the 26 chainrings? You would need between 4-5 shifts to get back into the same range.
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Originally Posted by rat fink
(Post 13492403)
That's not a very nice thing to say. :(
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*sarcasm!
However, the assumption that people who are riding with triples ride in the mountains and everyone else doesn't is ridiculous. I live in the mountains, and do significant climbing every time I go out. I use 53-39 to 11-28 and haven't really felt a need for any lower gearing. Sure, I love riding a corncob, but it's not hard to make up the gap between cogs if you have a good cadence range. Beside that, I actually prefer to vary my cadence fairly often, else-wise, I get a weird pain in my knees. I'm curious, how often do you, who prefer a triple, stand? I get the impression that most triple riders spend a lot of time sitting. Serious question, I'm not trolling. |
Originally Posted by X-LinkedRider
(Post 13494735)
Seriously, this bothered you? It had nothing to do with ones ability to ride. It was merely explaining why people with Triples don't take as good a photo as most of the doubles. The bike I ride MOST often is my double setup. But believe me, I take a hell of a lot more pictures ff that bike than my triples. More pictures = better opportunity for good ones. Add that to the fact that most triple riders are either in the mountains/hills, you are just not going to have the opportunity to stop and take millions of pictures.
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Originally Posted by rat fink
(Post 13495362)
I'm curious, how often do you, who prefer a triple, stand? I get the impression that most triple riders spend a lot of time sitting. Serious question, I'm not trolling. I use a triple to give me the option of sitting or standing at while climbing at low speeds. I'll stand while on the middle ring (or while using a cog in the middle of the cassette while on the small chainring) and reduce my cadence to 40-60 rpm. I also have the option to sit and continue to climb at low speed with a faster 60-75 cadence. If a cyclist uses a narrow gear range, standing becomes the best and sometimes only way up a steep climb. |
Here is my triple....Shimano 105 FD, crank, shifters and Ultegra read. I also have a double and a single!
Salsa in commuter mode... http://www.watsonfx.com/vaya1.jpg The setup also works very well for touring. This is on the Katy trail riding across Missouri. Check out the 700X37 all terrains. I also have some 42c as well. http://www.watsonfx.com/katy2.jpg |
I stand quite a bit while climbing. My main cassette is 11-26 with the standard 52/39/30 up front. I view the 30 the same as the 34 on my compact crankset bike but it has one gear lower (30x26) which would be the same as 34x29 (used to have this on a Campy bike). With the 6703 front derailleur I can shove the gearing around from 30x21 to 39x26 or 30x19 to 39x23. This might be a moot point for other riders but it helps me on Strava segment days. With a Campy triple going from granny to middle doesn't work nearly as well.
If I'm going to use a triple I want a 52 or 53 outer ring for the added gear inches. Trying to keep up with a tandem or my other friends that are taller and stronger, 50x11 gets spun out quickly on the descents where I live in Silicon Valley. I also cross chain the heck out of it. I run the 52 ring up to the 23 and the 39 through all 10 cogs. |
Originally Posted by Barrettscv
(Post 13485036)
While the triple haters sit at home playing this: http://www.tourdefrance-thegame.com/?xtor=AD-1
Triple users are out completing century rides that include 5000 ft of climbing. Have a triple on your road bike? Show it here; I run a 50, 39 & 26t triple with a 11-23t cassette. Using the large and middle chainring, I have tight 7 to 9% changes in cadence from 17 to 36 mph. If I need to climb a long, steep hill: I have the gears to do it. |
Originally Posted by rat fink
(Post 13495362)
I'm curious, how often do you, who prefer a triple, stand? I get the impression that most triple riders spend a lot of time sitting. Serious question, I'm not trolling.
Civil engineers seem to do a good job picking out routes and turning them into switch backs if necessary so most paved roads aren't that steep. Long climbs don't seem to run over 5% like the 20 and 30 mile up-hill slogs up Grand Mesa and Mt. Evans in Colorado. At a 175 Watt endurance pace as a 145 pound cyclist atop a 20 pound bike that nets 79 RPM using 34x23 which is a very comfortable seated cadence and the hot ticket for that. Shorter climbs can be steeper with the worst running about 9% for a few miles reaching double digits in the switch-backs (the 4 miles up Magnolia Road in Boulder, CO) and are 60-65 RPM standing grinds; flatter rides like Flagstaff mountain in Boulder, CO at 6.5-7.5% are seated 75-90 RPM affairs. |
Originally Posted by redlude97
(Post 13493073)
What about the extensive shifting required to get similar cadences when you drop from the 39 to the 26 chainrings? You would need between 4-5 shifts to get back into the same range.
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Originally Posted by rdtompki
(Post 13495855)
One word (well two): Campy Shifters
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 13491160)
If you used a 50/34 and an 11-28, you'd have the same high end, almost the same low end (just at 2 gear inches difference) and the progression between gears would be just about as tight.
What you wouldn't have is the number of redundant gears. http://www.gear-calculator.com/# does a nice job of showing this graphically. having one gear combo between 87 and 69 inches would be totally unacceptable. having 5 gear combos in the 59 to 69 range is ridiculous. 50x13 @ 100 rpm = 30 mph 50x14 @ 100 rpm = 28 mph 50x15 @ 100 rpm = 26 mph I don't think the vast majority ride at those speeds on the flat, wheel suckin or otherwise. For a non-racer this is 'fail'. For descents, 50 x 11 thru 14 can all be compressed into 2 gears, 50x11 & 13 Most rec riders will find gears in the 70's to mid 80's plenty for rollin on the flats. that compact & 11-28 give one option in that range fail |
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