svtmike

I just about spit coffee all over my keyboard. Please do enlighten us on what catalogs the Venge, Roubaix, and Tarmac were copied from.

unterhausen

two counts were dismissed. The non-compete got $1 damage. My guess is that if they hadn't taken the customer list that the whole thing would be dismissed

jdon

Mod poser.

Stealthammer

As I stated earlier:

"almost everything Specialized sells is made overseas, and the vast majority of these products have been copied from more innovative companies or chosen out of a catalog."

Certainly Specialized has created a few of it's own products, but for the most part they choose existing designs and re-brand them or have them copied. No big deal though, this is simply how the large bicycle companies work these days. The real innovators are mostly smaller companies like Volagi.

BTW: Trek tends to just buy up the smaller brands. Still no big deal, but they are both marketing companies, not manufacturers.

ahsposo 

ftfy

rangerdavid

some of us charge by the word, that's why we're so verbose.

rangerdavid

I actually don' own anything Specialized, although I have been looking at their saddles.

svtmike

Can you provide even a shred of evidence that you didn't pull this assertion out of the air?

surgeonstone

Hardly, I can too easily go towards the dark side. Sarcasm runs in my veins. Love the etiology of the word Sarcasm- Sarcos-of the flesh, chasm - a rent or seperation= a remark that tears the flesh.

Stealthammer

I use to work in the industry and worked directly with Asian import companies to do the same thing.

.....and yeah, its pretty simple for you to verify it for yourself. Look at the labels. Or read industry publcations like Bicycle Retailer, or visit Interbike.

svtmike

So, your answer is no, you can't provide any evidence that most of Specialized's products are pulled from some catalog. We just have to believe you or because you used to "work in the industry".

The fact is that Specialized does maintain an active design center here in the US and that they do design their bicycles.

You are welcome to go on hating them nonetheless.

Stealthammer

I don't really give a **** what you believe Mike.....


But just to answer your question regarding the Roubaix:
"On Wednesday, the defense had called Sean Sullivan, former executive vice president and second in command to Sinyard at Specialized. According to Choi, he said that Sinyard had told him that that loyalty is a one-way street. Sullivan also testified that the Specialized Roubaix bike design came from a Seven Cycles custom bike that a Specialized employee had bought because the company’s product line did not include a relaxed-geometry comfort bike with a tall head tube" (Quoted from the Velo News article)

UCIMBZ

To me, they are no more than the catalogue company they used to be a few years ago. Never liked them then, don't like them now.

Jed19

That in bold is untrue. Trek is both a manufacturer and a marketer. There are frames Trek make, and others it imports from overseas manufacturers.

Mike Sinyard is a very canny operator. He sold about seven percent or so of Specialized to Merida some years ago, thus assuring Specialized of a steady manufacturer and also keeping Merida out of the most lucrative bicycle enthusiast market in the world, the USA. The guy actually makes some good business decisions once in a while, but the Volagi one was/is a doozy.

Stealthammer

I stand corrected, Trek still does built a number of their high-end carbon framesets in the US, and does a lot of their engineering and design work here as well, but the vast majority of their bikes are manufactured in Taiwan and Europe and I would classify them as "catalog bikes".

For the past decade or so though their MO has been to buy up many of their smaller competitors such as Gary Fisher, Klein, LeMond, and Bontrager, which is far more industry-friendly than Specialized's more predatory business model. They have also been more innovative in some specialized areas of cycling like women-specific bikes.


I still maintain that Mike Sinyard is a egotistical tool whose company continues to use legal threats to limit competition, and to steal designs from other smaller builders as it sees fit.

Both companies however have very heavy-handed business relationships with their dealers.

wkg

Actually Trek is really good to their dealers.

david58

I hear you - the type of agreement they probably signed was pretty standard in our field. I have learned a tremendous amount over my 23 years with my current employer, and would certainly use that education at another employer if I changed jobs. And that is OK, and not in violation of any enforceable agreement. But I ain't taking file folders of data or Customer information if I were to change employers - unethical, thievery, plain wrong. I would expect to be pursued if it became known I did so.

95%+ of the posts here are slamming Specialized or happy they only won a buck. But there is very little conversation about the guys at Volagi. Let's say, ok, go build your bike. Fine. But they did some underhanded things to get their little startup going. I especially like the theft - yes, THEFT - of Specialized's Sales reports.

So folks here won't buy Specialized bikes because they are "bullies"? So would you purchase from unethical thieves? Would you buy a hot bike off Craigslist? What's the diff? I realize that's harsh wording, but it is what it is.

I really like the look of the Volagi - it is a beautiful bike as I see it. But I ain't shopping there - I'd buy Specialized first. But, I don't want a Specialized, so nothing changes there. But Volagi won't see my business.

ricebowl

That's if you believe the Specialized Laywer. Do I think it's true, nope. I think we can agree on this, the deeper your pockets the more "justice" you get. Specialized outspent Volagi on this suit by over a million dollars. If the Volagi guys stole anything they would've gotten reamed like a ...

david58

Not necessarily - again, if you are going to find a jury and a judge to nullify, go to trial in California. They admitted to taking the sales reports - to the press!

Psimet2001 

1. My teams are sponsored by Specialized.
2. I LOVE Specialized soft goods.
3. The Crux is a great cross frame.

...I despise what they did in this situation. Whether they like it or not they essentially attacked small businesses....the same type that their distribution network is made up of.

Also...Specialized doesn't let anyone who isn't a dealer into their booth at Interbike. So even though I am sponsored by them, have their S on a few hundred kits in a couple of states, and have spend enough money with them to essentially qualify as a good sized dealer myself....I am not allowed into their booth.

....We're riding Giant on the road season this year.

david58

I believe folks when they talk about the tools at Specialized.

Sometimes the tool, sometimes sadly, is in the right.

max power

well considering your tone of argument it's a lot easier to believe the guy from the industry over your ranting

really though what's Specialized technical claim to fame these days? The SL4 that dissapeared in the tour de france or the -latetothegame- aero road bike that was optimized by a company across the pond?

oldbobcat

Or never even considered.

patentcad

I'd like to go into the bicycle business just so I can market an aero high end road bike that I would call the Re-Venge just to piss off Specialized.

Jed19

Just go ahead and make Mike Sinyard's day.

Sinyard speaking in a Clint Eastwood like voice to pcad: Do you feel lucky, pun*?

After Sinyard is done with you, your bum knee will feel like a vacation in Hawaii