A not-so-happy Cervelo S5 owner
03-06-12, 12:36 AM
#176
Mr. Dopolina
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Still like Cervelos, regardless. A lot of successful companies have bad customer service experiences. If I had $3k to spend on a frame, I'd know where to go.
There was chatter about whether the LBS sold a knock-off a few pages back. That just seems like a bit of a reach IMO. LBS has a lot to lose in that scenario and the margin just doesn't make sense. If the s5 MSRP is $3k for frameset, you figure the LBS is paying much less for cost($1500-$2000) and likely on a net-30 basis.
Whereas a knock-off will still run between $600-800 cash and shipped from a retailer without guarantees of when it will arrive, if ever. So, potentially losing an entire high-end brand to make around $1k more? Just doesn't sound reasonable to me.
There was chatter about whether the LBS sold a knock-off a few pages back. That just seems like a bit of a reach IMO. LBS has a lot to lose in that scenario and the margin just doesn't make sense. If the s5 MSRP is $3k for frameset, you figure the LBS is paying much less for cost($1500-$2000) and likely on a net-30 basis.
Whereas a knock-off will still run between $600-800 cash and shipped from a retailer without guarantees of when it will arrive, if ever. So, potentially losing an entire high-end brand to make around $1k more? Just doesn't sound reasonable to me.
Also, the OP ordered it on-line, non?
The incentive for the seller to try a fake is the difference between a risk and no sale at all (if they couldn't get the item in time, or at all). There are plausible scenarios where the seller might go this route but there is no hard evidence either way.
My point was that, aside from the quality in the lay-up, there were masking and painting issues that simply couldn't occur during normal production because of how things are done.
Something was very off about that frame other than the quality but we are left to speculate as to what the cause might be.
03-06-12, 07:44 AM
#177
Draught
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Bob, are you leaning towards a knock off frame passed as a real one? If that turns out to be the case what do you think Cervelo should do for the buyer and to the seller? If I were them I'd immediately out it as a fake and throw the selling shop under the bus. Then maybe throw some good will towards the buyer. I'd be really curious to know what Cervelo finds out about that frame once they get it in house.
03-06-12, 08:33 PM
#178
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I don't think it was a Chinese knockoff. The CEO said that they're going to correct the inspection process. It was probably bad quality control on their part.
03-06-12, 10:49 PM
#179
VeloSIRraptor
The margin on bicycles is really, really thin. In point of fact, given the customer's time with sales staff, a fitting, mechanics giving free tuneups, et al... the margin on bikes is just pretty darn impossible.
Other stuff in the shop - sure, the margins aren't in the single digits, but in bike-shop saturated markets, the shop's lifetime cost margins on the some models can easily be single digits.
In response to your comment - the shop's cost for a bike has only begun when they pay the manuf/distributor for it.
A highly qualified wrenches time to assemble the bike
Rent/floor space for the bike
Devaluation amortized against the bikes that won't be sold that year... gotta account for those costs with the profits from the bikes that do sell
Sales Staff
Overhead
and on, and on, and on
03-07-12, 01:53 AM
#180
blah blah blah
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Bob, are you leaning towards a knock off frame passed as a real one? If that turns out to be the case what do you think Cervelo should do for the buyer and to the seller? If I were them I'd immediately out it as a fake and throw the selling shop under the bus. Then maybe throw some good will towards the buyer. I'd be really curious to know what Cervelo finds out about that frame once they get it in house.
03-07-12, 04:13 AM
#181
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I have an older aluminum "Cervelo" that is constructed from cut extrusions. Basically, lawn furniture in the world of bicycle tubing. If they produce only high quality frames, mine is also a fake. It's not defective or poorly made. It's cheaply made.
Last edited by ftwelder; 03-07-12 at 04:19 AM.
03-07-12, 09:58 AM
#182
Despite all my rage, I am
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Wait - so he got his money back and is still crying about it? He won - somebody needs to let things go...
Last edited by rooftest; 03-07-12 at 10:09 AM.
03-08-12, 08:07 AM
#183
Mr. Dopolina
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I am curendtly at the Taipei Bike Show and had a conversation witb a very good friend who works for the factory that assembles Cervelo.
This came up...
It seems I may have been wrong on my original call. He was more than a little familiar with the frame and had some interesting things to say. This is a small community so I will only paraphrase but it seems like this one may have slipped through at Cervelo and, possible due to the VERY poor communication skills of the guy in the video, his complaint was bown off.
Regarding the issue of the waviness of the very large carbon panel on the side of the frame: First, it is very difficult to mold perfectly so to make it look flawless requires some FILING and FILLING. What I was told is that Cervelo believes that this process will add weight and weaken the structure of the frame for purely asethetic reasons and that, although imperfect in appearance, the slight waves are par for the course and the frame is structurally sound.
IN THIS INSTANCE, however, once Cervelo had a good look at what was going on they felt it fell outside their bounds of what was acceptable and took the frame back.
Take that for what you will.
From my perspective there were other issues with this frame that should have set off alarm bells but didn't.
All said and done I'd probablystill ride one given the chance.
This came up...
It seems I may have been wrong on my original call. He was more than a little familiar with the frame and had some interesting things to say. This is a small community so I will only paraphrase but it seems like this one may have slipped through at Cervelo and, possible due to the VERY poor communication skills of the guy in the video, his complaint was bown off.
Regarding the issue of the waviness of the very large carbon panel on the side of the frame: First, it is very difficult to mold perfectly so to make it look flawless requires some FILING and FILLING. What I was told is that Cervelo believes that this process will add weight and weaken the structure of the frame for purely asethetic reasons and that, although imperfect in appearance, the slight waves are par for the course and the frame is structurally sound.
IN THIS INSTANCE, however, once Cervelo had a good look at what was going on they felt it fell outside their bounds of what was acceptable and took the frame back.
Take that for what you will.
From my perspective there were other issues with this frame that should have set off alarm bells but didn't.
All said and done I'd probablystill ride one given the chance.
Last edited by Bob Dopolina; 03-08-12 at 08:13 AM.
03-08-12, 10:27 AM
#184
Token Canadian
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due to the VERY poor communication skills of the guy in the video, his complaint was bown off.
It's one thing to be a real customer with a valid complaint. It's quite another to be a giant jerk of a real customer with a valid complaint. And very frequently, you wind up dealing with the giant jerk trying to pull a fast one.
I have seen, for example, people try and warranty turbos that were run without the oil line being connected, or that clearly injested FOD.
There are two edges to the "premium" sword. On one hand, people expect a superior product in all metrics. On the other, some customers feel that because they paid a premium price, they are entitled to act like utter ******bags when dealing with the company in question.
DG
