Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Question about the full-drop position

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Question about the full-drop position

Old 02-25-12, 11:28 AM
  #1  
pgjackson
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
pgjackson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gulf Breeze, FL
Posts: 3,846

Bikes: Rossetti Vertigo

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Question about the full-drop position

I don't use my drops very much, but when I do I have to keep my arms completely straight. If I bend my arms and really try to get my back flat, my thighs keep smashing in to my ribs. I do have a barrel chest and fairly large thighs. I'm not fat, but before I picked up cycling I spent about 15 solid years in the weight room. Anyway, the full drop position is impossible for me to get in to. I've been thinking about maybe picking up a TT bike, but I really don't think I could get in the proper position. Thoughts?
pgjackson is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 11:32 AM
  #2  
Specialized2k10
Pedal Warrior
 
Specialized2k10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NorCal
Posts: 486

Bikes: 2010 Specialized Allez with SRAM Force gruppo

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Get aero bars on ur current bike to see if you can handle that position.
Specialized2k10 is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 11:32 AM
  #3  
stlcards
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Southeast Missouri
Posts: 31

Bikes: 2012 Cannondale SuperSix

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
What's the drop length on your bars? I prefer a more shallow drop for similar reasons. I have fairly big legs feel really bunched up will deeper drop/ergo bars.
stlcards is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 11:38 AM
  #4  
pgjackson
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
pgjackson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gulf Breeze, FL
Posts: 3,846

Bikes: Rossetti Vertigo

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Specialized2k10 View Post
Get aero bars on ur current bike to see if you can handle that position.
It's not that I can't handle it, it's that my thighs keep smashing into my ribcage anytime I try to get in an aero position.
pgjackson is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 11:52 AM
  #5  
rpeterson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Utah
Posts: 953
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
You could try shorter cranks and a higher saddle. Or you could raise your bars and get shallower drops, though if you simply can't get flat without hitting that won't help you get flat, it'll just make them more useful all around.
rpeterson is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 12:00 PM
  #6  
digibud
Senior Member
 
digibud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Further North than U
Posts: 1,996

Bikes: Spec Roubaix, three Fisher Montare, two Pugs

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
bike fit

Have you had a serious, professional bike fitting? One thing you might look at is the type of bar. Some bikes use a bar with a very deep drop while others like my Roubaix have a much less deep drop. The vertical distance from the saddle to the bar is also much deeper in aggressive bikes than other bikes. If you have a bike with a saddle way higher than the bar and a bar with very large curves so the drops are very low it will be very different than a bike with less drop. The simple change of the bar may be all you need. Your stem may also be a bit long and a shorter stem will put you a bit more upright too. Seat height can play a role here also. Much too look at. I'm very overweight with a big belly and I can get to the drops on my Roubaix so I'm guessing it may be as much a matter of bike fit as anything.
digibud is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 12:13 PM
  #7  
jaredcasper
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Stanford, CA
Posts: 59

Bikes: Argon 18 Krypton

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
One thing that helped me with a similar problem was rotating my pelvis forward a little, thus opening up the angle between my thighs and torso and giving me more room to get aero. This video, while not talking about this problem specifically, gives a visual of what I'm talking about. Some of John Cobb's other videos may be helpful as well.

Edit: Thought of another way to describe it. When I "get aero", I can't just use my flexibility to move my torso down, leaving my hips/pelvis as they are. I need to rotate my pelvis as I move my torso down to keep the thigh/torso angle open and prevent my legs from hitting my chest.

Last edited by jaredcasper; 02-25-12 at 12:26 PM.
jaredcasper is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 12:15 PM
  #8  
njkayaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 11,678
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2200 Post(s)
Liked 215 Times in 151 Posts
Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
Thoughts?
You should post a picture of you on the bike.
njkayaker is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 01:26 PM
  #9  
Dean V
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,598
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 921 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 109 Times in 72 Posts
TT bikes have a more forward saddle position. That will give you more thigh/body clearance.
Dean V is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 01:31 PM
  #10  
znomit
Zoom zoom zoom zoom bonk
 
znomit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 4,033

Bikes: Giant Defy, Trek 1.7c, BMC GF02, Fuji Tahoe, Scott Sub 35

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 290 Post(s)
Liked 232 Times in 120 Posts
Flip it.
znomit is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 02:29 PM
  #11  
carpediemracing 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Tariffville, CT
Posts: 15,173

Bikes: Tsunami Bikes

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 297 Post(s)
Liked 24 Times in 16 Posts
Remember that proper TT position doesn't mean "flat back". It just means being as aero as possible while pedaling at some high level (FTP or higher for sub 1 hour time trials).

You can always get in the right position on a bike that fits properly (by definition). What you consider to be acceptable as a position is a totally different thing. It may be that your ideal TT position would have you sit with your shoulders higher than "status quo". Your opinion may not agree with that.

Having said that, rotating your hips forward will help you get your back more flat. Shorter cranks help because your leg doesn't come up as far.

A picture would be helpful to get an idea of what you're dealing with.
carpediemracing is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 03:14 PM
  #12  
bbattle
.
 
bbattle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Rocket City, No'ala
Posts: 12,737

Bikes: 2014 Trek Domane 5.2, 1985 Pinarello Trevisio, 1990 Gardin Shred, 2006 Bianchi San Jose

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Raise your handlebars.
bbattle is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 03:20 PM
  #13  
DaveSSS
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 5,846

Bikes: TWO Colnago C-RS w/Chorus 12

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 421 Post(s)
Liked 156 Times in 122 Posts
There is no need to bend the arms, just because your hands are in the hooks. If you're really so low that you have leg to chest interference, then you're trying to get too low.

I use a lot of saddle to bar drop (11cm), but also use shallow drop bars. When I'm riding a mountain descent, I can get plenty low without bending my arms.

Last edited by DaveSSS; 02-25-12 at 05:15 PM.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 03:42 PM
  #14  
kabex
Senior Member
 
kabex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central Mexico
Posts: 616
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
There's something wrong with your fit.

I had that problem with a bike that had too long a top tube and too short a headtube. I flipped the stem upwards and it was bliss after that.

You need either a shorter top tube, longer head tube, more spaces, flipped up stem or any combination of those.
kabex is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 04:12 PM
  #15  
Commodus
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Burnaby, BC
Posts: 4,144
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
My thighs brush my rib cage a bit in the drops, but if you have a position that is completely unusable then you clearly have a serious fit issue.
Commodus is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 06:47 PM
  #16  
climber7
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: New England
Posts: 797

Bikes: 2010 Jamis Xenith Comp

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
you could rotate your pelvis forward more, which could possibly require a new saddle. but if you're already doing that:

Originally Posted by znomit View Post
Flip it.
Originally Posted by bbattle View Post
Raise your handlebars.
this. your drops are obviously too low to be usable. bring the bars up a little. yeah, the hoods will be a little higher than you're used to, but then you'll have two usable hand positions instead of one. or three instead of two, i guess.

unless you really like the hoods where they are, in which case you need to get a shallower-drop bar or just not use your drops.
climber7 is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 06:58 PM
  #17  
Looigi
Senior Member
 
Looigi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,950
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
There're a number of things to consider but normally with this problem you'd raise your saddle and move it forward. If you know enough about fitting to do this, give it a try, but since you didn't know this in the first place, you probably don't know enough about fitting.
Looigi is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 07:23 PM
  #18  
abstractform20
Senior Member
 
abstractform20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
dont change anything except slamming the stem more...that way you can still post cool status quo pics in the 'slam that stem' thread
abstractform20 is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 07:36 PM
  #19  
Debusama
Senior Member
 
Debusama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Spokane, Washington
Posts: 684

Bikes: Elephant custom road bike, 08 Redline D440, Motobecane Fantom cross Uno.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I had the same problem before. I had other fit issues as well, but that was one of the problems I addressed when I had my custom frame built. I don’t know if it might be related, but in addition to having a large rip cage, I also a proportionately shorter torso and longer legs than most people. I don’t have the problem with my custom bike, thighs are actually nowhere close to hitting my ribs. In comparison to my old bike, which was the typical size ridden by someone my height, the new bike has a shorter top tube, and the new handle bar has a little less drop than my old one did. The crank arms are the same length and the drop from saddle to bar-top is the same. I’m sure it also has to do with some of the angles and the orientation of the crank in relation to the saddle. Either way, it sounds like a fit issue.
Debusama is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 08:30 PM
  #20  
2ndGen
CAADdict
 
2ndGen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: BF Heaven
Posts: 6,756

Bikes: 2009 Cannondale CAAD9-?

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
I don't use my drops very much, but when I do I have to keep my arms completely straight. If I bend my arms and really try to get my back flat, my thighs keep smashing in to my ribs. I do have a barrel chest and fairly large thighs. I'm not fat, but before I picked up cycling I spent about 15 solid years in the weight room. Anyway, the full drop position is impossible for me to get in to. I've been thinking about maybe picking up a TT bike, but I really don't think I could get in the proper position. Thoughts?
What bars are you using?

I never liked riding in the drops (not that I ever really had a need to anyway).
But, when I switched to a compact set, it didn't bother me to ride in the drops.
Mine BTW are FSA K-Wing Compacts (44cm). They prop you up a bit more.
2ndGen is offline  
Old 02-25-12, 11:43 PM
  #21  
daxr
Senior Member
 
daxr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: K.F., Orygun
Posts: 905

Bikes: 08 Giant Boulder, 08 Scattante XLR

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
I figure there's about 4 different positions I usually ride in - on the tops of the bars, on the hoods, forward on the knobs (shimano), and in the drops. I don't use the tops of the bars much, except toward the end of a ride where things are more social. Most of the time is on the hoods, which is a comfortable moderate position.

An aggressive position is forward on the knobs, like pulling at the front, or chasing, leaning into it a bit. In that position if I go one step more aero and straighten my back a bit, my thighs just hit my chest pedaling. Going down to the drops from there doesn't change my torso position at all, its just a little more comfortable for tired arms and easier to breath...so on the drops, with my arms a little bent, I get the knees-bumping-chest thing if I'm leaning into it, just the same as on the knobs.

I'd use that as a lowest position and adjust from there - probably you have too much drop in the bar, saddle too low, bars too low, a frame that doesn't fit you, or some other sort of problem going on. Sometimes you can't be sure of a good fit until you put a bunch of miles in - if you can do a 100 mile ride and not think about the fit, and not come back with any particular pains, then you've probably got it set up right.
daxr is offline  
Old 02-26-12, 02:05 AM
  #22  
abstractform20
Senior Member
 
abstractform20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
i cant wait to start talking to other bike ridists about using them knobs.

"whacha gutta dew is really pull on the knobs for hard effarts. just crank em up"
abstractform20 is offline  
Old 02-26-12, 02:29 AM
  #23  
pdxtex
Portland, OR, USA
 
pdxtex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: portland
Posts: 1,626

Bikes: kona paddywagon, trek 2.1, lemond nevada city, gt zrx

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
its actually suggested that you don't maintain a flat back, and instead ride with a more arched posture. its better for your lower back and helps you absorb bumps.....ask sheldon or lance.....

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/pain.html#back

https://www.livestrong.com/article/83...-bike-posture/
pdxtex is offline  
Old 02-26-12, 02:45 AM
  #24  
abstractform20
Senior Member
 
abstractform20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by pdxtex View Post
its actually suggested that you don't maintain a flat back, and instead ride with a more arched posture. its better for your lower back and helps you absorb bumps.....ask sheldon or lance.....

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/pain.html#back

https://www.livestrong.com/article/83...-bike-posture/
i sent Sheldon an email a few weeks ago and he never replied. (mod edit: removed really stupid material)

Last edited by Walter; 02-26-12 at 06:05 AM.
abstractform20 is offline  
Old 02-26-12, 02:54 AM
  #25  
JustinHorne
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Post Falls, Idaho
Posts: 436
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by abstractform20 View Post
i sent Sheldon an email a few weeks ago and he never replied. (mod edit: removed really stupid material).
I don't know if that's accidental or not, but if not:

Bad form.

Last edited by Walter; 02-26-12 at 06:05 AM.
JustinHorne is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.