Hill Climbing..What matters most?
 

My ride is a 2004 Giant OCR2 and I do nearly all of my recreational riding in East TN. This area has a lot of hills (I moved from FL about 4 years ago and I still haven't gotten used to them). Anyway, my bike is a triple, but I'm wondering what makes the biggest difference when you're riding in an area with lots of hills. Some guys in this area say that you can't tell the difference between a double with a light frame and a triple with a heavier frame. True? Is there a road bike that is manufactured specifically for hill climbing?

The lighter the better. Find a cadence that is right for you and go for it. I've seen many triple riders that can clibb with the best of them.
Weight is the biggest factor in a climbing bike. But having the right gear is essential.

I lived in East KY for several years. I know the hills you are talking about. What is your goal? You claim recreational riding so is your goal to get to the top of the hill and improve on that or are you doing time trials? I personally think the bike has little to do with it. The training is the most important factor. As a recreational rider I don't feel you will see any significant difference between what you have and any thing else. Keep riding those hills. That will make the biggest difference. I promise they will get easier.

I don't know what you ride, but if you are the type of guy to normally use a 53/39 with 12-25 think about getting a 50/34 with 11-21.

It's just better combo....you get more sweet spots.

Good point...my goal is to have to walk up them as little as possible...for now. On an average week, I commute 9 miles each way (relatively flat) 3 days/week and then do a 30-50 mile weekend ride through the rural hilly areas. I plan on doing a MS150 in the spring...in the hilly part of TN. I just want to be able to make it u the hills and keep a good cadence on those rare moments when it's flat.

low gearing is the most important factor then......what is your lowest gear right now?

Less weight helps. The right gear helps. But your biggest payoff is still train, train, train. If you are not in hill climbing shape it doesn't really matter what bike or gear ration you are riding.

True enough, but This guy doesn't want to include walking in that training.

The reason I'm asking about gearing is because it if he has a 39-23 as his lowest gear going to a 39-27 isn't that much lower. If you are walking hills.....going from 39-23 tro 39-27 isn't going to save you.

If this guy is walking hills he should go for lower gearing than he really think he needs....then tighten the cassette as fitness improves. In fact get a mtn cassette in you really need one.....12-34 has big gaps, but plenty of low-end.

And you have made my point exactly. Thanks.

"If you are walking hills.....going from 39-23 tro 39-27 isn't going to save you."

cassette SRAM PG-950 12-26T, 9 speed
cranks TruVativ Touro, 30/42/52T

three things you can do.....

1. Put a smaller granny gear on...24T is the lowest you can go (this is the cheaper alternative)
2. Get a cassette with a bigger rear cog set.....12-34 XT is possible (though you will need to put a mtn rear derailleur on).

3. Both.....Combing both options is often done by people who ride in the marklesville death ride (129 miles...17,500 ft gain in elevation). LOw gear of 24-34 is the lowest you can go....compared to your 30-26.

Don't be ashamed to run a pie plate.....Once you are fit you can run whatever you want. At least this keeps your training all cycling (instead of cycling and walking)

53-11, good advice, but...

Doug, are you walking your bike up these hills? If not, don't bother changing anything unless you've got the money. If you're spinning up a hill in the easiest gear, then you're doing good.

Power-to-weight ratio is the only thing that matters.Depending on how big a guy you are, let's say for argument's sake that the weight difference between the bike you ride now and an even lighter one is 6-7lbs. If you're like most people, it would be more benficial to you in all respects to drop 6-7lbs. rather than drop another x$'s on a lighter bike. Other than that, just keep climbing and you'll see consistent improvement. True, it is less complex to shift a double as opposed to a triple, but the most important thing is that you get your cadence to consistent level and try to anticipate the hills and shifting so that your cadence doesn't vary wildly depending on the terrain. As you work on this and if you push yourself, you should see an improvement in the gearing that you need to attack the same hills (i.e., you will not need as low a gear to get up the same hills). Good luck and have fun! I had a chance to get to East TN on biz and went to the Smokies - it is a beautiful place.

Hahaha.....A typical macho post in this forum. Thank God I don't contribute to that.

Absolutely true though from a physics standpoint....Maybe I'm wrong, but I though he said he wanted to avoid walking at times. So unless he wants to take steroids or loose a lot of weight....probably the best thing in his future is a gear change.

Maybe I missed his point (thought I read it after his initial post)

[QUOTE=Steelriderthe most important thing is that you get your cadence to consistent level and try to anticipate the hills and shifting so that your cadence doesn't vary wildly depending on the terrain. [/QUOTE]

True words.....But how is that guy going to keep his cadence up if he doesn't have enough gear? ( i think he said he was walking some hills)

P.S. I agree with a lot of the things you say, BTW. Yes, Keeping you cadence in the sweet spot in all terrain will conserve energy so when you get to hills you are not "blowing up". But sometimes you just need enough gear.

Depends on the grade...and I'm not sure how to guage it in terms of % grade (interstate signs say 5%), but you'll go over a hundred feet in elevation in less than a half mile. I can make it about a quarter to a half mile before I have to stop and hoof it...it just depends on the degree of incline and the distance. Steep inclines over a short distance (1 mi or so) are the worst for me, but they make for a screaming run (40 mph+) coasting down the back side. :D

Sorry, not meant to be "macho" in any way/shape/form - straight physics. He never said that he was walking up any hills, just that he hasn't gotten "used" to the hills (vs. flat-as-pancake florida). If he already rides a triple, chances are good that he doesn't really want to go substantially lower. Especially (assuming) he's not yet in hillclimbing shape, the best thing that he can do without dumping money unnecessarily on lower gearing (which he'll probably regret once he does get used to doing hills) is work on technique, cadence, and sticking to routes that are sufficiently challenging, but won't make him run out of gears.

I dunno man, if your knees are fine, try standing -- if you haven't tried that yet. If you think you can improve your fitness level, I'd suggest suffering a bit until you can climb it.

If you don't think you'll be able to climb it ever with your current gears, then do what 53-11 suggested and get some new ones... either mt.bike cranks or mtb cassette... probably need new derailuer depending upon which direction you go.


But I have to ask, if you're walking some of these hills in the front small ring and the back big ring... what the heck are the people you know doing recommending a double up front? Go ask 'em to clarify... then report back to us :)

>> Power-to-weight ratio is the only thing that matters.
> probably the best thing in his future is a gear change.

Whereas aerodynamic position(ing) makes a great deal of difference on the flats, power-to-weight makes is the difference maker on the hills. I've seen plenty of "girth-endowed" riders hammering their way down PCH (well over 24+) on their aero bars. But as soon as they hit a hill (of note, down here in Orange County that might be San Joaquin Hills or Newport Coast), they get spit out the back. Aero doesn't help when you're not goin' fast.

I like to spin btw 70-90 rpm on hills. If I stand, I have to go one or two gears higher and drop the cadence. I mix seated forward (towards nose of saddle), seated back, and standing ... with standing being the least used "time-wise".

I think he should try to find "whatever gearing" works for him ... such that sustained, seated climbs of 80+ rpm can be achieved. Forget what gearing other people use ... they're all just reference points anyways. I use a 59-39 w/ a 12-25. Everybody's seen someone muscling their way up on a 12-23 and someone else flying up on a 12-27.

Whatever you do, don't destroy your knees trying to be "macho". Just not worth it ...
Best.

Try training. I works.

Hey sdouglaslt, are you running out of wind before you're running out of strength? or is it just that on the hills where you need to walk that you're just not able to turn the cranks over anymore? And even though you moved to TN 4 years ago, have you been riding/training consistently enough that you can draw any conclusions about your rate of improvement/likely improvement. Do you have any hills/routes that you can ride consistently and guage your improvement over time by speed/ease/time? and finally, do you have a cyclecomputer that helps you with this?

P.S. - are you riding clipless or platform? This would make a huge difference as well. Don't want to assume too little or too much.

I never considered that the people that are riding a double could have lower gearing...or they could be doing all their riding in the valleys and not the faces. I'm 39, 225 and in pretty good shape, but I was just trying to see if I'm already doing everything right to tackle those hills and get ready for a charity ride.

i think the least scientific way to go about is just to get out there and do it. it doesn't matter how slow you are as long as you're doing it. you will eventually improve, and as you improve you will want to challenge yourself more and more.
whenever i have come back to the bike after not riding for a while, i find that for the first few months, i just cruise around and get my legs "bikeworthy" until i start feeling better.
just take your time, enjoy yourself, and pretty soon you'll be refusing to get off and walk. and soon after that, the thought of walking won't even enter your mind, no-matter what hill you're on.

Try to use your legs mostly in the climbs too. Focus on putting your engergy into your legs, and don't have a lot of upper body movement going on, because I've found that it just wastes energy. So when I'm climbing, I just try to focus my posture, breathing, and direct the energy I'm using into my legs.

To the first question...both. Sometimes I just can't push the cranks over even if I'm near standing. Most of the time, I probably run out of steam first, though. I've been riding up here for about a year, and I'd say I'm improving my straightaway time and speed. I can't say whether I've improved on hills because I vary my routes. I do have a computer and I ride Look clipless. Most of the replies I'm seeing are leading me to thinking that strength training is what I need.