OK,

So I'm pretty much throwing in the towel after trying clincher tires again. They suck. Don't get me started....

Now that I am going back to Tubulars I want to build a dedicated tubular wheelset.....I want it to be lightweight.

So what does am Elite Level clincher wheelset weigh?....I'm thinking I should be able to easily beat that with the lighter tubular wheel design (less metal cuz there doesn't need to be lips to grap tire). Great thinh about tubular wheels is that most of the weight savings is at the rim.

What hubs should I use?.....There has got to be some nice aftermarket ones that are light.

P.S. If you think Tubulars are in pain in the ass....think again. I just read up on the Tufo tape and I looks easy to use (unlike messy glue)

And the sealant makes the tires nearly flat proof ( I know this already)

get you some Zipp Z2s. lightest production wheels on the market.

Are those tubular or clincher? You know how much they weigh?

Another question is If I build the wheels custom (using tubular rim) which hubset should I use?

I don't think DA hubs are really going to be that light.....probably need an aftermarket hubset.

the zipp Z series weighs 1067 g for the Z3, 1270 g for the Z4, and a whopping 995 g for the Z2. Z4 is the deepest most areo rim, Z3 is in the middle, and Z2 is normal depth rim. they have some sort of really low friction ceramic bearings. check 'em out at competitivecyclist.com. all of them are tubular. the wheels themselves may be really light, but they won't be on your wallet.

That's awesome!!!!! under 1100 grams. I bet you those accelerate nicely.

I don't necessarily need something that light. If I can settle for something 1300-1500 gram range It should be a lot affordable as well as easier to obtain with a tubular rim and whatever hubset I need.

tell me again why clinchers suck? besides weight.

I thought you rode Tufo Tubulars? Now they suck?

As for wheels in the 13-1500 gram weight range, there are many, including lots of clinchers. 2 sets that come to mind are the Rolf Prima Vigors (1455) and the American Classic 350's (1276). Both of which are sitting right here in my office waiting for a bike to go on.

55/Rad

I said don't get me started...but OK.

1. low pressure
2. if tire blow-out your screwed! Tire comes off rim and scraping metal on ground.
3. You can get snake bite flats with inner tubes. Impossible with tubulars.
4. Flat more often......don't know why, but seems like most people agree.
5. Ride worse....although this gap is closing with modern clinchers.
6 . Weight....(yeah yeah I know you said don't mention, but I did!!)

Used to ride tufos....now I ride Vredestein 23mm (145 psi)

1. You can get vredesteins and Schwalbe's that go to 145 PSI. i figure any higher than this would be like riding on rocks.
2. if you roll a tubie off the rim you're equally screwed.
3. maintain proper inflation pressure and don't ride through potholes.
4. don't ride through crap.
5. subjective. though price wise, a $30 clincher is going to ride nicer than a $30 tubie.
6. i'll give you that one. Though 1300 gram clincher wheelsets abound. as do sub-200gram clincher tires.

Get yourself a set of Lightweight Obermayer's. 1050g for the set, 53mm deep, and unmatched stiffness for your super human strength! Only $5k for the set. But you could always skimp and buy the regular $3.5k 1120g set. No need to add a heavy magnet either, there's one laminated right into the rim for you.

wow, an 1050 gram wheelset.

I wonder if a combination of those wheels, 53-11's Massive Thighs, and one of his trademark 60mph descents would lead to his departure from this board?

Yeah I got the vredesteins.....

Back when I had the Tufos I used to run them at 180 psi......smooth as silk. Tufos at 180 psi owned to vredesteins at 145 psi as far as smoothness goes.

Don't know about Tubies rolling off regular tubie rims, but those tufos tubular clinchers would never have come off the rim!!

Good point.

Anyway it shouldn't be that tough to make a strong wheelset that isn't tooooooo light. If I can save a pound (454 grams) off my current wheelset I would be happy enough. It shouldn't be that expensive to do since the tubular rims are lighter by their very nature (construction requires less metal)

I feel much safer doing fast stuff with tubulars underneath me. With clinchers I might end up like this during 50-60 mph descents----->http://www.cripplefight.com/smileys/wheelchair.gif

allow me to restate my position more vigorously. there is no production wheel on the planet lighter than the tubular Z2. they are smoking fast. they are stupid light. they look pretty next to a 55 tooth chainring...

let's all be like the cool kids and get tubulars!

You guys don't know what you are missing.....just like me with bicycle shorts (apparently).

you don't know what you're missing either
you've never actually used tubulars yourself.

tubular clinchers != tubulars

Well I have.

The Tufo tubular clinchers are true tubulars in that they have no inner tube....they are also high pressure (220 psi).....ride smooth also. They do mount to a clincher rim though.

Good thing about the regular Tufo elite tubulars is that if you get a flat you can ride it home (apparently). It doesn't come off the rim easily.

The way I look at it is I like the tufo Elites........ why not just use the regular tubular rim (save some weight).

The next question is ......If you were making a custom wheel what hubset would you use?

well you haven't experienced the joy of gluing or taping a tire to the rim. or actually sewing up a tire.

What was so bad about the tubular clinchers that made you go for the full tubular experience? and what's wrong with going for a standard 1300-1500 g clincher wheelset with the same tufo elites? I guess money is no option for you.

Now i've got a stupid question too. Can you use the tufo sealant with regular clincher tubes?

tubulars are what the dinosaurs used to put on their bikes.
if i make ANY change, it will be to the new tubeless technology that will be coming out later this year. and even that is not likely. for training and regular fun riding purposes, i'll take my clinchers and slime liners over any of that crap.

Don't know......I'm guessing that it should work as long as you can remove the valve core from your inner tube. never tried it though.

The Rolf Vigor wheels seem pretty light weight. Not as light as the Zipps or other wheelset listed above but yo said you didn't want something that light.

How is that any different that what is already available. A tufo tubular clincher has that already.

You do know that most tubular tires already come with a tube sewn in right?