mikepwagner

Do we all understand that "garnishment" is not some magic asset-creating weapon?

Posters keep dropping that word as though it was a powerful weapon - the truth is that in many states, it's pretty puny.

Years ago, when I lived in Indiana, I had a friend who owned a small business, and he looked into garnishment as a way recover some money owed him. The reality is that the results were pretty dismal.

1. The person who's wages are being garnished has to make a fair amount of money - a significant portion is protected.
2. You have to find the employer, and find the new employer if the person changes jobs.
3. The employer has to cooperate. Some do, some don't.

If someone makes very close to minimum wage, or switches jobs a lot, or has an uncooperative employer, then you are very likely to get nothing for your effort.

If you think about it for a minute, why do we need ever more powerful laws to go after "deadbeat dads" who skip out on child support. If garnishment worked as many posters think it works, garnishment alone would be powerful enough - we wouldn't need those laws. When a deadbeat dad (or mom) didn't make a payment, the spouse who's owed money would say the magic word "garnish", and - SHAZAAAM! - they would have their money. Never another deadbeat dad in the history of the country! It pretty much doesn't work that way.

Sketchy people tend to be what lawyer's call "judgment proof" - we don't have debtor's prisons in this country, and you can't take assets someone doesn't have.

My guess is that the OP's lawyer looked at the driver's assets and employment history, and concluded that the insurance company's $15K was about all that the OP was going to be able to collect. The lawyer could have been wrong, but lawyers are pretty well trained when it comes to sniffing out assets - they are pretty much bloodhounds when it comes to other people's money.

MDfive21

yes.

do you understand that there is the possibility that the driver may in the future have money? and that some of us would like to know that if that ever happens, we'd like to collect. i can respect that a lot of people would just let it go, but a lot of people wouldn't. it's a contingency that i wouldn't forgo, especially considering the bodily harm done.

she might be judgement proof right now, but that could change. who knows..

HBxRider

Bikers always seemed to get screwed when it comes to compensation. I used to pick and choose situations when I felt it appropriate to wear a helmet. These days, I don't ride without one.

hammond9705

In hindsight did you really need a lawyer? Seems she was clearly liable, would her insurance company have just paid the $15k without much difficulty?

mikepwagner

I suspect the issues you'd face in this are

1. Getting a lawyer to represent you when the defendant has no assets - maybe you could pay the lawyer up front, and
2. The likelihood that in the case of a successful suit, the defendant declares bankruptcy (I am pretty sure that unless there is DUI involved, or willful intent, the judgment can be discharged)

I could be wrong about that. What I know that I am not wrong about is that lawyers are not lining up in droves to sue people with little/no assets.

boggy

Without lawyer I would have been royally screwed. Driver claimed she was going on green and I was the one running the red light. Her insurance company initially had all intention to tell me to go and screw myself. I had no witnesses, and if you think city will just provide you with traffic light camera pictures without attorney - yeah right.

boggy

mikepwagner knows what he is talking about. Attorney is not interested in chasing money that is not there to chase. And for low income person with crappy assets (in my case NO assets) declaring bankruptcy is an easy way out of judgement.

mikepwagner

If the driver had no assets, it sounds like the lawyer did the best that could be done, and moved on.

And so did you.

A legal system implements an approximation of justice - and any legal system has holes. It happens that when you live in a legal system where the means of redress for unintentional harm is mostly economic, if someone with no economic assets accidentally harms you, there is little or no redress.

I have lived under a legal system that had its roots in sharia (N Yemen in 80's), and there the means of redress was often "eye-for-an-eye". Under that system, you could have asked that the driver be injured exactly as you were injured (for her leg to broken, etc).

There are holes in that system as well -for example, when I was there, a patient in a hospital lost an arm, and a court decided that nurse was liable. The patient's family demanded that the nurse's arm be amputated. Whatever you think of the justice of that situation, it's pretty hard to develop a medical system when you play by those rules.

elkootcho

I ride through that intersection 10 times per week (commute to work). It's probably the most dangerous one that I ride through. That "cross street" is just a bus way (no cars allowed) and the OP is riding along the MUP. I always wait quite a long time before crossing as cars run that light all the time.

OP - Wishing you a speedy recovery. Take care.

boggy

No, I certainly don't wish that driver should have her leg broken, this is crazy. But look at how severe punishment is for DUI. Whether you have assets or not, you will get a punishment for DUI. I think person that runs a red light and injures another person should at least get something similar to DUI. It's not as bad as broken leg, but it'd make me feel better.

hhnngg1

Man that's terrible re:insurance (or lack of it on their end.)

Unfortunately, in today's economy I suspect that's a majority of the people on the road, driving uninsured.

It's horrible that the driver didnt have any financial or legal fault in this affair. Not with an open fracture. If you did that to someone unintentionally with anything besides a car, you'd be looking at jail time. (I'm not recommending jail time, just there should be some shared fallout.)

mikepwagner

Do you have some examples in mind?

Bobsled

All these people in their cars who had a front row seat and no one stopped to offer help or stepped forward and offer to be your witness?? You need to move to a better neighborhood. Not attacking you, just sayin.

danmc

That's LOL-worthy! (Says someone who was hit by a car where the driver was 100% at fault.)

Seattle Forrest

What the **** is wrong with the world????

Bobsled

I know. In a perfect scenario, the OP would have won his lawsuit and the driver would have lost their car and been forced to ride a bike everywhere.

boggy

One of the cars in the first picture had doctor for a driver, in hospital outfit, coming back home. He did not witness the crash, but he did stop and help. He blocked the traffic with his car, kept my head up using what was left of my camelbak, called paramedics, called my wife, checked my injuries, and called the next day to find out my status.

Driver that hit me never bothered to come out of the car to check how I was, and never called afterwards.

Dilberto

My friend is an insurance adjuster and told me 90% of car-to-bike accidents are caused by female drivers.....which makes me shudder.

OP got a new Pinarello Dogma2 with Zipp 303s coming soon....

NWS Alpine

Doesn't sound like it as he has a bunch of medical expenses that unfortunately will not be recovered.

DaveWC

Why is that? The fact that he may have the cash for an expensive bike has nothing to do with his unreimbursed expenses. I guess you could make the case that you don't feel sorry for someone with unreimbursed expenses if they can turn around & buy a Dogma 2, but that's on you, not him.

NWS Alpine

Huh. Did you read the thread? The post I was replying to made it sound like he was making out by getting hit and collecting a settlement to upgrade to an expensive bike with nice rims. When in reality the situation is a nightmare.

"Simple. Insurance pays 15k in liability, and I only get a little bit over 9k of that after attorney fees. Insurance also pays for property damage, that's separate from liability (my bike and gear - fully compensated, keep in mind that bike was DOA and my gear was cut to ribbons by firefighters on the spot). My medical bills amount to over 90k. My own medical insurance pays most of that, but I end up paying over 10k in out of pocket co-payments. I use the 9k from liability to cover most of my out of pocket expenses, but not all of them.

So, I get replacement bike and gear, get in the negative with my medical bills paying my own money, and I don't get jack **** for anything else. Oh, and I sign papers and let the driver go. No trouble for driver. Life is fair! Hey, at least I did not hit the windshield. That would probably not end as well."

DaveWC

Yeah, I read it. I don't see how his ability to pay for a new bike is related to whether he lost money due to unreimbursed medical bills. Even if a wealthy man is hit by a car it's a shame.

The post you were replying to simply stated that he bought a new, expensive bike. It didn't state that he was paying for it with insurance proceeds.

DaveWC

btw, I misread your first post... thought you had said "Doesn't sound like he has a bunch of...". My mistake. Still, if I had lost money in an accident that wouldn't mean I could not afford a Dogma2. I wouldn't necessarily choose to buy one.

Scummer

100% agreed.
I had the same experience last week when I rode with my 9yr old daughter to school for summer cello lessons. 4-way stop intersection. Car coming from the left, still a long distance away. I tell my daughter to go and I go. I make it through the intersection, not noticing my daughter is still stopped. Car is closer, but still far enough so my daughter can make it across. She still hesitates. Now time has run out and the car is too close, normally my daughter could still be going, because she was first at the 4-way stop intersection and had the right of way. She thankfully did not go! The driver of the car tapped the brakes and blew her stop at 15-20mph. I was flabbergasted and pissed off. Driver turns the car around 150ft down the road and parks the car. Game On! I'll tell my daughter to stay put as I want to talk to the woman who just blew the stop.
Her answer after I asked her, if she hadn't seen my daughter at the intersection wanting to cross: "I thought she was waiting for me, so I waited for her as well and then went." I'm like :saywhat?: You f'n **** just blew the god damn stop sign at 15mph and you call this waiting, while a child is trying to cross an intersection with the dad being on the other side of the intersection. I so wanted to kill her at this point, but I didn't even drop the f-bomb, I just calmly let her now that she was being very stupid for pulling such a move with a kid in traffic.

I'm still shaken up by this whole experience, my daughter could have been dead.

Elduderino2412

That sux, but it's cool to have pics. Wish i had pics of my motorcycle wreck, b/c i was unconscious til i got to the hospital. Whole thing is a blackout. The bits and pieces i remember in first few hours are rather odd.
Hope you get better. i shouldn't have survived, but i'm healthy enough to ride bike now. My running days are over though