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Gatorskin-like protection without the harsh ride?

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Gatorskin-like protection without the harsh ride?

Old 07-08-12, 07:03 PM
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xfimpg
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Gatorskin-like protection without the harsh ride?

Hi

I'm tired of flats and I'm tired of replacing tires that shread too easily.

I've had Gatorskins before and as good as they are for flat protection, it's like riding bricks. Some of you may not agree and that's okay.

For those that do, could you recommend a tough tire near a Gatorskin but with a smoother ride?

Thanks

Last edited by xfimpg; 07-08-12 at 07:08 PM.
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Old 07-08-12, 07:26 PM
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Panaracer Pasela tour guard or RiBMO
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Old 07-08-12, 07:33 PM
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I think there will always be this tradeoff.

You can try Michelin krylion carbon, nice ride and pretty good flat protection.

I know it's fredly, but some folks SWEAR by Mr Tuffy tire liners. Worth considering.

Finally, you could also try tubeless.

Flats happen.
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Old 07-08-12, 07:36 PM
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conti 4000s. not as good flatproofness. lighter. nice tires overall.
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Old 07-08-12, 07:45 PM
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Thanks Guys. Yeah you're right about flats happening, it's the tire-shredding that happens during a flat that boils my preserves.
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Old 07-08-12, 08:01 PM
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Try a wider tire and lower air pressure
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Old 07-08-12, 08:10 PM
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Maxxis Re-Fuse 700x 23 or 25mm.
Has Kevlar bead (folding) and Aramid layer for flat prevention/protection. 120PSI.
In 2011 used them on our tandem and single bike. Rode 5,600 miles with only ONE puncture!
Yes, we live in AZ with lotsa cactus thorns and road debris.
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Old 07-08-12, 08:24 PM
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I've ridden some seriously tough tires as well as ultra-fragile, and I swear by tuffy liners.

However if you don't want to use them, I have two suggestions:

1) Michelin Pro4 Endurance 25mm. It has an incredible ride, cushy but responsive. They roll well. It also has very high volume; the sidewall says 73-109psi. Can you believe that, in a 25mm road tire? My wife rides them at 75R/85R. This is the replacement for the Krylion Carbon suggested above.

2) Conti GP4000S 25mm. I drank the BF koolaid and found out that they're one of the best performing tires I've used-- including some race-day-only tires. Plus they ride great, last a long time, and have very good puncture protection.


Notice how I suggested 25mm in either? There's no reason to use a 23mm tire if you're emphasizing ride quality. Wait-- there is one. If your frame/fork can't clear a 25mm, then use 23mm. I'd still pick one of these tires any day of the week.
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Old 07-09-12, 01:08 PM
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Thanks Guys... I'll try the Maxxis Re-fuse and the 4000S and see how they roll/last.
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Old 07-09-12, 02:48 PM
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Why not go 25's with Gators and just down in pressure. I ride some rough rough stuff around here on Gators and an aluminum frame and its not that bad as long as you're not running super high pressure.
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Old 07-09-12, 03:09 PM
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It's the flat protection that gives the harsh ride - you can't have one without the other. I guess it's just a matter of finding a tire with the right combination of compromise for you.
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Old 07-09-12, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Commodus View Post
It's the flat protection that gives the harsh ride - you can't have one without the other. I guess it's just a matter of finding a tire with the right combination of compromise for you.
This is intuitive, but my 25mm Continental GP 4 Seasons completely disagree with you. This is one of the toughest tires made, yet it rides great and soaks up bumps like few other tires its size. (It rolls like wet mud, though. )

However, it's also one of the most costly tires you can buy. Cost is likely the reason the Gatorskin rides a lot worse than the GP 4 Season.
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Old 07-09-12, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
This is intuitive, but my 25mm Continental GP 4 Seasons completely disagree with you. This is one of the toughest tires made, yet it rides great and soaks up bumps like few other tires its size. (It rolls like wet mud, though. )

However, it's also one of the most costly tires you can buy. Cost is likely the reason the Gatorskin rides a lot worse than the GP 4 Season.
GP 4 seasons can be had for $45 each plus modest shipping from Wiggle. Still not cheap, but better by far than you can do locally.
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Old 07-09-12, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
This is intuitive, but my 25mm Continental GP 4 Seasons completely disagree with you. This is one of the toughest tires made, yet it rides great and soaks up bumps like few other tires its size. (It rolls like wet mud, though. )

However, it's also one of the most costly tires you can buy. Cost is likely the reason the Gatorskin rides a lot worse than the GP 4 Season.
I haven't tried them, but I guess it depends on your frame of reference. I think it's unlikely that their speed or ride quality is really on par with a true performance tire like a Michelin Pro, an Open Corsa, or a Diamante Pro. But, maybe they hit the right compromise for many riders.

As I've suggested, I prefer to simply buy the fastest street oriented tires available and fix the flats when they occur, since I get so few even on my racy tires.
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Old 07-09-12, 05:03 PM
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I've got Specialized All-Condition Armadillo 700c x 25, they also ride hard, but I've been told that when I replace them I should consider 28s or even wider and run a few pounds less pressure to increase comfort. Supposedly going one size up won't significantly increase rolling resistance but will increase "cushiness" (sorry about the technical jargon). I did notice that when I switched from 25s to 23s on my road bike, I feel a lot more road vibration, but I also switched brands so I don't know how much was the size and how much was the tire.
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Old 07-09-12, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Commodus View Post
I haven't tried them, but I guess it depends on your frame of reference. I think it's unlikely that their speed or ride quality is really on par with a true performance tire like a Michelin Pro, an Open Corsa, or a Diamante Pro. But, maybe they hit the right compromise for many riders.

As I've suggested, I prefer to simply buy the fastest street oriented tires available and fix the flats when they occur, since I get so few even on my racy tires.
Yeah, I did that too. Except I had tuffy liners and I didn't get any flats. But I did get numerous severe cuts, and I destroyed 2 Diamante Pro and 2 Diamante Pro Light in under 2,000 miles *total*.

The Diamante Pro and Pro Light actually do not have anything on the GP4000S in terms of rolling resistance or agility, by my (not-so?) finely tuned butt-dyno. You gain no performance and lose a ton of flat protection and even more cut resistance. It appears that I go on roads far dirtier and more dangerous (to tires) than you.

The Evo Corsa does ride awesome, but cuts even easier. I've ridden the SC version, but not CX. Far, far better tire than the Diamante without a doubt.
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Old 07-09-12, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
Why not go 25's with Gators and just down in pressure. I ride some rough rough stuff around here on Gators and an aluminum frame and its not that bad as long as you're not running super high pressure.
+1. Gatorskins smooth out with some sag, harsh if over-pressured. But if they feel heavy switch to GP4000s. I ride a Gtrskn on the back and GP4000s on the front for my loaded bikes.
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Old 07-10-12, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Commodus View Post
As I've suggested, I prefer to simply buy the fastest street oriented tires available and fix the flats when they occur, since I get so few even on my racy tires.
Better road maintenance in BC? Maybe fewer good 'ole boys tossing beer bottles of windows? Over here on the other side of the imaginary line, I found myself fixing about 2-flats per week in training rides, and in open course road races I flatted out of 3 races in a row last year and swore off racy tires (the two I tried were the pro race 3 and open Corsa) in open course road races. Now that I have a second set of wheels, and the pro 3 race/krylion carbon are half price most places since the pro 4 came out, I've got the krylions on lighter box-section rims that I prefer for road races and pro 3s on deep-V rims I use for crits. Since I do a lot of switching back and forth between the two, I actually feel the long-wearing/puncture resistant Krylions ride smoother than the than the pro 3 race tires, but that may be attributable to the different wheels. The cornering grip of the racy tires is better though.
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Old 07-10-12, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by xfimpg View Post
Hi

I'm tired of flats and I'm tired of replacing tires that shread too easily.

I've had Gatorskins before and as good as they are for flat protection, it's like riding bricks. Some of you may not agree and that's okay.

For those that do, could you recommend a tough tire near a Gatorskin but with a smoother ride?

Thanks
You're asking for something that doesn't exist. If it did, everyone would ride them. Everyone.

It is kind of like when people ask for a golf ball that's straight off the driver and spins like a ProV on the green. It just doesn't exist. If it did there would be one, and only one, golf ball on the market. Same thing with tires. I use to buy Armadillo tires, ran over everything you could possibly imagine, and had zero flats in thousands of miles. The ride was horrible, though, so I bought a set of GP4Ks and my body & bike thanked me. I will put up with a few flats for that.

Until some future millionaire engineer figures out how to make a tire like you're looking for you'll have to either take a harsh ride, or a comfortable one and change a tube once in a while.
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Old 07-10-12, 09:57 AM
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I have had good luck with Panaracer Pasela Tourguard and Maxxis RE-Fuse. I also recommend a wider tire with lower air pressure.
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Old 07-10-12, 10:07 AM
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Conti GP4000. Ride is very smooth, good rolling resistance yet grippy in the turns with only one flat per year.
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Old 07-10-12, 10:39 AM
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I guess I'm lucky to have an insensitive butt, because I went from open corsa cx tires to gatorskins, both 23mm, and I haven't really noticed much of a ride quality degradation. No flats at all with these, so mission accomplished.
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Old 07-10-12, 10:48 AM
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Another vote for Panaracer Pasela TGs. I use them in 700x32s on my cross bike (which is my daily training bike), and they roll really well and are very puncture resistant.
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Old 07-10-12, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan333SP View Post
I guess I'm lucky to have an insensitive butt, because I went from open corsa cx tires to gatorskins, both 23mm, and I haven't really noticed much of a ride quality degradation. No flats at all with these, so mission accomplished.
interesting. do you happen to inflate to max pressure by preference or necessity (heavy rider)?
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Old 07-10-12, 10:59 AM
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GP4000s seem fine to me. Honestly I don't have much faith in the Gatorskins -- I'm in a goathead-infested area, and when it's in season you hit 'em when you hit 'em. Other times you go for months w/o a single flat.
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