plpete

I'm slowly gearing up to ride my first Granfondo (Jeremiah Bishop's Alpine Loop) and I'd like to make any changes to my bike early on to avoid any issues during the ride. The ride will be about 100 miles and have about 11,000 feel of climbing, some of which will take place on compacted dirt roads and etc. Since I'm not a pure climber at 167lbs I'd like to adjust my gearing in order to handle the long and sometimes steep climbs for the ride. FYI I am running a Sram Force drivetrain with the new YAW Red front derailleur. The shifting is perfect. In the front I am running the Rotor Q Rings which I really like for climbing and will be sticking with those. They also help my knee pain. In the back I am running a Shimano 12-27 cassette. Although its fine for local hills, the long and steep at times climbs would be a bit easier with some taller gears on the top range. I know that officially the sram force RD will support up to a 28t sprocket. I have been eyeing the new Ultegra 12-30 cassette which seems like an ideal choice for the ride. The Apex 32t cassette will be a stretch but has anyone run the 12-30t cassette or the Tiagra equivalent on a Sram RD without going to a long cage Apex RD? Technically, the B screw on the RD could be adjusted to clear the RD pulley with the large cog. I've read of guys running the cassette with Ultegra RD which officially support up to a 27t cassettes. Any thoughts are appreciated

nhluhr

There have been MANY success stories of people exceeding the max cog rating of their derailleurs. I think it comes down more to your frame and how much clearance the derailleur hanger affords.

banerjek

I've seen people run 32T with a long cage RD successfully. My own attitude is why unnecessarily risk effing' up your transmission? Just slap on a 9 speed XT RD and you'll have tooth and chain wrap capacity to spare.

ericm979

He's on Sram; Shimano won't work.

Try running it. I can run a 30t cog on my '12 Red drivetrain without even touching the B screw. If it doesn't work then get an Apex or whatever.

Make sure the chain is long enough to run over the big chainring and big cog. If not, lengthen it. If it's too short and you shift there by mistake (like when you crest a climb and aren't thinking clearly) it will be very expensive and end your ride. Its better to have the chain too long in the small ring/small cogs. All that does is make noise.

MPress

Does anybody know if the Ultegra 12-30 casette would work with the standard Ultegra or Dura-Ace rear derailer?

nhluhr

I'll refer you to post#2:

banerjek

I didn't read closely enough -- he can slap on a SRAM MTB RD then (I believe cable pull is the same as road)

Although you *can* often make things work beyond listed capacities, this is generally to be avoided. An RD doesn't cost that much and it will last forever if you only pull it out for the odd ride now and then. Probably will work better too.

plpete

That sounds promising as the overall length of the cage on both RED and Force are the same. I'm trying to avoid buying extra derailleurs as this cassette will only get occasional use and its fast and easy to swap out. Would you happen to have a photo of your set-up?

ericm979

I think '12 Red is spec'd for 28t max vs 27t for the earlier ones, but I don't know the actual geometry difference between it and Force, if there is any.

I don't have any pics, I was just testing it for an upcoming race.

plpete

My Force RD is spec'd for a 28t max as well. It is the newer generation one. In this case it looks like it should work fine.

Hendo252 

Is the Ultegra 12-30 cassette available for sale? I've seen it listed in the Shimano docs, but haven't seen listed for sale.

plpete

I will ask my LBS if they can order it for me since I doubt they might stock it. I've seen it on ebay so it must be out there. I like the LBS so I'll try them first and give them my business.

volosong

I picked up two Ultegra 12-30 cassettes about two months ago. My Pinarello FP6 is Dura-Ace 7900 and other than having to adjust the limit screws, no other modifications needed to be done. Even the chain was long enough. Having to adjust the limit screws might be caused by having or not having the spacer on the old/new cassette. Can't remember. The RD-7900 is considered a mid-cage derailleur. No problems shifting. I just make sure not to go big-big. The crankset is FC-7950, (compact, 50-34).

I put the other 12-30 on my 6700 triple Trek Madone. Of course, the RD-6700-GS is a long cage, so no compatibility issues with that group. No idea if it will work with a RD-6700-SS. Haven't tried that combination.

When I went to purchase the Ultegra 12-30, I took a copy of the tech doc. Yup, the owner of the LBS didn't believe that they existed. It so happens that I went in at the right time because one of his suppliers was visiting. He also looked at the tech doc and said he would go on-line to check his stock. He said he had ten of them, so the LBS ordered two. I went ahead and picked up both of them.

Shops are uninformed. I've been into two other shops since then, (with my bike), and neither believed that the Ultegra 12-30 even exists. But, I just showed them my bike, and they couldn't deny. When you go in to a shop to order, take along a copy of the tech doc, and don't just have them look in a printed catalog, (which is sure to be out-of-date), but work with a shop who will call their supplier(s) on the phone.

The Shimano 12-30 is out there ... you just have to hunt for one. Hopefully, availability will increase soon. It's a nice cassette, and even though I don't need that 30 very often, just knowing that I have it available gives me the confidence to tackle just about any hill in SoCal.

Mithrandir

I'm not sure what the weight difference between the Ultegra and Tiagra 12-30's are, but I bought the Tiagra last week because it's all I could find available, and it shifts smooth as silk. $35 on Amazon. Can't go wrong if you don't care about the weight.

Hendo252 

Great info Volosong. I'm leery of Taiwan ebay dealers, so if I can get one via a known legit local dealer I'll do so.

-Tom in SoCal

fstshrk

I am running the tiagra 12-30T with a 105 short cage RD (5700 series).
I have also run it with the 6700 short cage RD without a problem.

In either case, I did not have to lengthen the chain.

The 6700 Ultegra 12-30 is hard to find around here and I can't find it at Nashbar/Perf Bike website either.

Amazon has the 4600 12-30T cassette for $34 which is a great price.

banerjek

Sure, but the RD swaps out as fast as the cassette. Even if you use it only one day per year, it's still worth it if you need it.

Going from 28T to 30T is barely going to be noticeable since you only drop 2 gear inches. That's hardly worth another cassette and it's not really worth bothering over. Get the right RD and then you can get a 32 or even bigger. Also, if you're going to run a pie plate in the rear, may as go wide (i.e. the small cog should be an 11). Anytime you need your bottom gear going up, you'll want the top one going down.

Werkin

I do; look at post#5 here.

mechBgon

Possibly of interest: Shimano revised the Ultegra 6700 and 105 5700 rear derailleurs recently to handle 30s on an official basis. The revised models have an A on the end, such as RD-6700A.

volosong

Thanks for the info. Good to know. So, that's what the "A" stands for.

mechBgon

Also, I was browsing a distributor's website and found that in the 105 lineup, the RD-5700A is apparently already being replaced with the RD-5701L, which is available in both short-cage and mid-cage (SS and GS) flavors.

Hendo252 

I saw the writeups on this some months ago -- March? April?

A few folks are listing the 5700A, but I have yet to find a 6700a, nor an Ultegra 30t max cog.

The one LBS I spoke to about it said their distriubutors don't have them but who knows if they really checked.

-Tom in SoCal

mechBgon

I took a quick look, and the 6700A derailleur and 12-30 Ultegra cassette are both in-stock at J&B Importers, Quality Bicycle Products, Trek and (surprise) Shimano themselves. Your LBS is a bunch of slackers

Bike Gremlin

Considering a triple crank? Or you've already done that? I run 11-28 with a 30-39-50 triple and am considering going for 12-27 in the back. 28-30 is too slow even for the steepest hills I encounter while very tired.

Hendo252 

Thanks Mech. After reading this thread I snooped around, found both the 6700A RD and 12-30 cassette at Niagara, so I put in the order.

Hopefully they'll be here before long!