Steel frame questions
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Steel frame questions
I am starting to look around for a new steed. I have looked at all the major name brand carbon bikes. While looking I found some custom steel frame builders and I am thinking that is the way i want to go. I am looking to spend a lot of money for me and i want it last as long as possible. I think steel has a better longevity and can be repaired.
I want to do some climbing with this new bike and am wondering if I am sacrificing anything by going steel instead of carbon. Also a few races here and their. I really like Rodriguez bikes. They seem to have a good rep. and a more race geometry that I am looking for. If anyone has another recommendations for a quality steel bike. My price range is about $5000 for a complete.
Thanks for any help.
I want to do some climbing with this new bike and am wondering if I am sacrificing anything by going steel instead of carbon. Also a few races here and their. I really like Rodriguez bikes. They seem to have a good rep. and a more race geometry that I am looking for. If anyone has another recommendations for a quality steel bike. My price range is about $5000 for a complete.
Thanks for any help.
Last edited by bclawrence; 09-09-12 at 01:05 PM. Reason: Forgot info
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I am starting to look around for a new steed. I have looked at all the major name brand carbon bikes. While looking I found some custom steel frame builders and I am thinking that is the way i want to go. I am looking to spend a lot of money for me and i want it last as long as possible. I think steel has a better longevity and can be repaired.
I want to do some climbing with this new bike and am wondering if I am sacrificing anything by going steel instead of carbon. Also a few races here and their. I really like Rodriguez bikes. They seem to have a good rep. and a more race geometry that I am looking for. If anyone has another recommendations for a quality steel bike. My price range is about $5000 for a complete.
Thanks for any help.
I want to do some climbing with this new bike and am wondering if I am sacrificing anything by going steel instead of carbon. Also a few races here and their. I really like Rodriguez bikes. They seem to have a good rep. and a more race geometry that I am looking for. If anyone has another recommendations for a quality steel bike. My price range is about $5000 for a complete.
Thanks for any help.
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I think steel makes a fine bike frame.
If possible, pick a builder that you can meet, in person, for fitting and to go over your needs/goals/wishes/options.
I suspect you will be very pleased with the results. Don't worry that your final weight will be a pound or two heavier than a CF bike.
If possible, pick a builder that you can meet, in person, for fitting and to go over your needs/goals/wishes/options.
I suspect you will be very pleased with the results. Don't worry that your final weight will be a pound or two heavier than a CF bike.
#5
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Consider stainless steel, nice and light. Firefly makes some beautiful custom bikes in your price range.
They are handmade out of Boston
https://fireflybicycles.com/bikes/road-stainless
They are handmade out of Boston
https://fireflybicycles.com/bikes/road-stainless
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At your price range, the Guru Sidero would be a great build.
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Seven makes one - https://www.sevencycles.com/road/resolute-slx.php
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Thanks for the info. I will do my research on the good carbon bikes and reconsider.
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Personally, I don't think you need to spend $5k to get a great bike regardless of the frame material. Are you planning on outfitting this bike with electronic gearing? Carbon wheelset?
From what you wrote I think you can get better value in an Ultegra or 105 groupset, Sram Apex or Force, Campy Centaur group. The choice of groupo and wheelset will make a big difference in the overall cost.
Have you ridden both carbon fiber and steel bikes? I just got my first carbon fiber bike this summer and I've got to say, if you want a bike that climbs well, is responsive, and lively there are some excellent carbon fiber bikes out there that fit the bill. They can be repaired but I don't expect that to be a something I'm going to need.
I rode steel from most my years. I still have a steel bike that I would never sell for sentimental reasons. But I would respectfully disagree with those that would argue that a steel bike is inherently superior to a carbon fiber bike. It depends on the steel and it depends on the carbon. Bike quality has always been highly variable depending on the manufacturer.
Highly desirable steel bikes have survived the test of time because the owners of said bikes are interested in a variety of qualities. It could be anything from the look of a lugged frame. Fillet brazing. Or a vintage attraction. It could be because they like the springiness of steel. That the savings in weight is negligible over other materials. Or they like the idea of buying a bike that is associated with an individual frame builder.
Finally, I know a man (in his 70's) that has ridden all his life and upon seeing my carbon fiber bike remarked. "Yeah, I went with titanium because it will last forever." For him, at least, he wanted to buy his last bike and ride it until he can't ride any more.
But you're talking about racing and the question is, "How competitive are you? And can you win on steel?"
From what you wrote I think you can get better value in an Ultegra or 105 groupset, Sram Apex or Force, Campy Centaur group. The choice of groupo and wheelset will make a big difference in the overall cost.
Have you ridden both carbon fiber and steel bikes? I just got my first carbon fiber bike this summer and I've got to say, if you want a bike that climbs well, is responsive, and lively there are some excellent carbon fiber bikes out there that fit the bill. They can be repaired but I don't expect that to be a something I'm going to need.
I rode steel from most my years. I still have a steel bike that I would never sell for sentimental reasons. But I would respectfully disagree with those that would argue that a steel bike is inherently superior to a carbon fiber bike. It depends on the steel and it depends on the carbon. Bike quality has always been highly variable depending on the manufacturer.
Highly desirable steel bikes have survived the test of time because the owners of said bikes are interested in a variety of qualities. It could be anything from the look of a lugged frame. Fillet brazing. Or a vintage attraction. It could be because they like the springiness of steel. That the savings in weight is negligible over other materials. Or they like the idea of buying a bike that is associated with an individual frame builder.
Finally, I know a man (in his 70's) that has ridden all his life and upon seeing my carbon fiber bike remarked. "Yeah, I went with titanium because it will last forever." For him, at least, he wanted to buy his last bike and ride it until he can't ride any more.
But you're talking about racing and the question is, "How competitive are you? And can you win on steel?"
#10
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Rodriguez (AKA R+E Cycles) in Seattle makes, IMHO, some of the finest steel bikes around. Lots of bang for your buck at premium quality. They have been in business for almost as long as I've been alive. Yes, do your due diligence, but I found them to be an absolute pleasure to work with, even long distance from down here in Mexico. Do make sure to anticipate everything you want on your wish list beforehand, run it by them and if they say "yes", those guys will deliver! They nailed everything down on my build list (I wanted quite a few braze-ons) and delivered a high quality custom bike. At your budget, you could get it with True Temper Platinum OX (they also build in beautiful stainless steel or pricey Ti), a nice campy groupset and handbuilt premium wheels, etc. They built me an altered model of their UTB for randonneuring/touring. Man, what a delight to ride both unloaded or fully loaded! Believe me, not too many builders can get that balance right.
I think carbon is really nice and the way they mold carbon to make some fantastic-looking bikes is truly amazing. At anything over USD $3500, I will, however, take a premium modern steel custom bike any day! This is mainly for the long term peace of mind a build of that caliber will offer me. BTW, the steel they use now is so much superior to even the fine steel used on nice bikes from the 70s or 80s... So much stronger while still keeping that compliant feel on the road that steel is known for.
As far as racing and climbing abilities on steel, you should have no issues. The way Rodriguez builds their racing frames (one of their specialties), you might have a small weight differential vis-à-vis carbon but nothing significant. I get the impression we are not talking about gram-counting TdF speeds and climbs here. So, the rest will be up to the rest of components you choose plus having a strong, fine-tuned engine - you!
Do not hesitate to PM me if you have any specific questions about my experience with R+E Cycles.
I think carbon is really nice and the way they mold carbon to make some fantastic-looking bikes is truly amazing. At anything over USD $3500, I will, however, take a premium modern steel custom bike any day! This is mainly for the long term peace of mind a build of that caliber will offer me. BTW, the steel they use now is so much superior to even the fine steel used on nice bikes from the 70s or 80s... So much stronger while still keeping that compliant feel on the road that steel is known for.
As far as racing and climbing abilities on steel, you should have no issues. The way Rodriguez builds their racing frames (one of their specialties), you might have a small weight differential vis-à-vis carbon but nothing significant. I get the impression we are not talking about gram-counting TdF speeds and climbs here. So, the rest will be up to the rest of components you choose plus having a strong, fine-tuned engine - you!
Do not hesitate to PM me if you have any specific questions about my experience with R+E Cycles.
Last edited by Chris Pringle; 09-09-12 at 06:21 PM.
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This is mainly for the long term peace of mind a build of that caliber will offer me. BTW, the steel they use now is so much superior to even the fine steel used on nice bikes from the 70s or 80s... So much stronger while still keeping that compliant feel on the road that steel is known for.
#13
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I would very much like to know why steel is going to give you long term piece of mind compared to other materials. Also, I would love to see some evidence that modern steel is "much superior" and "much stronger". And I agree it makes plenty of sense for a touring type bike but the paragraph I quoted is just a little strange to me.
Many out there prefer carbon, while quite a few people prefer steel and a few others prefer aluminum or Ti. One might have his own personal reasons why one likes whatever material, whether it is super duper light weight, the allure of modern super aerodynamic designs, purpose, peace of mind, resilience, budget, the feel of X material, treating oneself to a custom bike made of X material, etc. That's all fine. Different strokes for different folks. At the end, we can all coexist and be happy with our personal decisions.
The OP asked for help. In this forum we simply offer and share our opinions and experiences. I don't expect you to agree. We know the OP is intelligent to do his/her due diligence. At the end of the day, s/he'll end up with the bike S/HE wants.
Last edited by Chris Pringle; 09-09-12 at 08:04 PM.
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Full disclosure: I think kneejerk defenders of carbon have drunk the KoolAid, and all my bikes but one these days are made of steel. I've seen carbon frames and forks catastrophically destruct under forces that would merely have bent steel. It doesn't happen often, but once is too many for me. Ask (or google) around and you'll start hearing carbon horror stories. Steel is also easily repairable.
I haven't kept track of the weights of modern steel frames, but I can't imagine that it's more than a pound or two more than carbon fiber. I'm carrying more than that around my waist.
I haven't kept track of the weights of modern steel frames, but I can't imagine that it's more than a pound or two more than carbon fiber. I'm carrying more than that around my waist.
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Listen, dude! There's absolutely nothing positive you've contributed to answer the OP's original question. You came here simply to hijack the thread, which is totally uncool. So, yeah go away and continue smoking whatever you smoke.
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Full disclosure: I think kneejerk defenders of carbon have drunk the KoolAid, and all my bikes but one these days are made of steel. I've seen carbon frames and forks catastrophically destruct under forces that would merely have bent steel. It doesn't happen often, but once is too many for me. Ask (or google) around and you'll start hearing carbon horror stories. Steel is also easily repairable.
I haven't kept track of the weights of modern steel frames, but I can't imagine that it's more than a pound or two more than carbon fiber. I'm carrying more than that around my waist.
I haven't kept track of the weights of modern steel frames, but I can't imagine that it's more than a pound or two more than carbon fiber. I'm carrying more than that around my waist.
I won't be replacing it with another steel bike. If you want performance go with Carbon. If you want the retro look go with steel.
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I've had bikes from all materials and each has advantages. I still have a 20 year old steel (Waterford) that's about of current as they come (threadless headset, CF fork and CF steerer, light wheel,s etc.) and it rides nice. At the other end, I've got CF (Cervelo and Guru) and they are much lighter and quicker (stiffer yet comfortable) in terms of responsiveness and sprints.
I would suggest if you get steel, do it for a special reason such as custom where you deal directly with the builder or appearance with unique lugs, paint, etc.
I would suggest if you get steel, do it for a special reason such as custom where you deal directly with the builder or appearance with unique lugs, paint, etc.
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I just bought/build a lug steel frame (https://rikulau.com/rikulau_english/p...1=A&L2=C&L3=03) early last summer and it rides like a dream. It rides as nice as my Litespeed Tuscany Ti if not better.
When I finished with my build, my 11 yrs old daughter loves it so much and she wants one for herself. And since she is about ready for some serious riding (not just around the neighborhood riding), I might as well star her off on the right direction; so I order another Reynolds 853. After the whole summer of ridding, she is completely hooks with the bike.
Sure, there are different school of thought regarding the composition/material of the bike, but as for me, after number of years working in the aerospace industry, I have some idea of the limit/capability of CF. I could not afford a new bike for my daughter every time she lay down/drop the bike, since she is just a novice. IMHO, steel frame is the way to go. I have neither intention nor inclination to start on the forever- ending debate of what material is the best for bike construction.
As for OP’s question, at 5K price range, you sure can get something pretty fancy like Reynolds 953, 951, or even Ti. I am certain there are quite many wonderful steel frame builders out there to choose from – The list is long. As long as you don’t have some out-of-norm figure, I am sure you can find some off the shelve frame size that will work for you.
Also, IMHO, with the short chain stay, the bike can climb like a mountain goat; but with that same geometry the bike can’t really sprint (it would be very jumpy). So you have to define your own priority/balance. Good luck on your search.
When I finished with my build, my 11 yrs old daughter loves it so much and she wants one for herself. And since she is about ready for some serious riding (not just around the neighborhood riding), I might as well star her off on the right direction; so I order another Reynolds 853. After the whole summer of ridding, she is completely hooks with the bike.
Sure, there are different school of thought regarding the composition/material of the bike, but as for me, after number of years working in the aerospace industry, I have some idea of the limit/capability of CF. I could not afford a new bike for my daughter every time she lay down/drop the bike, since she is just a novice. IMHO, steel frame is the way to go. I have neither intention nor inclination to start on the forever- ending debate of what material is the best for bike construction.
As for OP’s question, at 5K price range, you sure can get something pretty fancy like Reynolds 953, 951, or even Ti. I am certain there are quite many wonderful steel frame builders out there to choose from – The list is long. As long as you don’t have some out-of-norm figure, I am sure you can find some off the shelve frame size that will work for you.
Also, IMHO, with the short chain stay, the bike can climb like a mountain goat; but with that same geometry the bike can’t really sprint (it would be very jumpy). So you have to define your own priority/balance. Good luck on your search.
#23
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Might want to look at the new Raleigh International. Most of the local steel fans around here are either riding 30-year-old frames or new Waterfords. If I were looking at a new custom steel bike, though, my first choice would be Chas Roberts of Britain. I have fond memories of years of riding on two frames made by his father in the '70s.
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I just bought/build a lug steel frame (https://rikulau.com/rikulau_english/p...1=A&L2=C&L3=03) early last summer and it rides like a dream. It rides as nice as my Litespeed Tuscany Ti if not better.
When I finished with my build, my 11 yrs old daughter loves it so much and she wants one for herself. And since she is about ready for some serious riding (not just around the neighborhood riding), I might as well star her off on the right direction; so I order another Reynolds 853. After the whole summer of ridding, she is completely hooks with the bike.
Sure, there are different school of thought regarding the composition/material of the bike, but as for me, after number of years working in the aerospace industry, I have some idea of the limit/capability of CF. I could not afford a new bike for my daughter every time she lay down/drop the bike, since she is just a novice. IMHO, steel frame is the way to go. I have neither intention nor inclination to start on the forever- ending debate of what material is the best for bike construction.
As for OP’s question, at 5K price range, you sure can get something pretty fancy like Reynolds 953, 951, or even Ti. I am certain there are quite many wonderful steel frame builders out there to choose from – The list is long. As long as you don’t have some out-of-norm figure, I am sure you can find some off the shelve frame size that will work for you.
Also, IMHO, with the short chain stay, the bike can climb like a mountain goat; but with that same geometry the bike can’t really sprint (it would be very jumpy). So you have to define your own priority/balance. Good luck on your search.
When I finished with my build, my 11 yrs old daughter loves it so much and she wants one for herself. And since she is about ready for some serious riding (not just around the neighborhood riding), I might as well star her off on the right direction; so I order another Reynolds 853. After the whole summer of ridding, she is completely hooks with the bike.
Sure, there are different school of thought regarding the composition/material of the bike, but as for me, after number of years working in the aerospace industry, I have some idea of the limit/capability of CF. I could not afford a new bike for my daughter every time she lay down/drop the bike, since she is just a novice. IMHO, steel frame is the way to go. I have neither intention nor inclination to start on the forever- ending debate of what material is the best for bike construction.
As for OP’s question, at 5K price range, you sure can get something pretty fancy like Reynolds 953, 951, or even Ti. I am certain there are quite many wonderful steel frame builders out there to choose from – The list is long. As long as you don’t have some out-of-norm figure, I am sure you can find some off the shelve frame size that will work for you.
Also, IMHO, with the short chain stay, the bike can climb like a mountain goat; but with that same geometry the bike can’t really sprint (it would be very jumpy). So you have to define your own priority/balance. Good luck on your search.
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What do you mean "broken so long"?