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Pioneer Electronics enters cycling computer market place

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Pioneer Electronics enters cycling computer market place

Old 09-26-12, 06:15 AM
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Aushiker
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Pioneer Electronics enters cycling computer market place



Pioneer Electronics has taken its first step into the world of performance cycling with the launch of its new Cyclocomputer and Pedaling Monitor at this year's Interbike show in Las Vegas. In addition to displaying speed, distance, time, power and cadence, the computer can also show exactly where power is lacking within the monitored pedaling rotation. The crank-based monitor system is designed to work with Shimano DURA-ACE crank sets and is made up of sensors and ANT+ wireless transmitters that feed data back to a paired computer.


Further details in the Gizmag article.

Andrew
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Old 09-26-12, 07:47 AM
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That is amazing! This thing could help improve pedal stroke imensely!
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Old 09-26-12, 08:20 AM
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Interesting that no cycling site seemed to have picked it up (I didn't see anything about this at least). The pricing seems okay for a two sided system. I find it interesting that they went with ANT+ vs Bluetooth - I wonder what the data granularity is, i.e. frequency of sending data to the head unit.
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Old 09-26-12, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by renton View Post
That is amazing! This thing could help improve pedal stroke imensely!
I'm not that excited by the power measurement for both sides. The new Quarq basically does this, albeit by an extrapolation. I've yet to see anything useful in the 2 sided data.

I discussed this with Chris Carmichael, and several other CTS coaches, who said, unless your power balance is really out of wack don't worry about it, and if it is way out of wack you'll know it without a power meter.

So to me, the Panasonic unit, looks like a relatively heavy, clunky, unproven system, that's priced above more elegant, proven, power meters. I don't see it taking off at that price.
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Old 09-26-12, 08:28 AM
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oh, and in before PCad:

friggin vaporware.
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Old 09-26-12, 08:36 AM
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"Crankset compatibility" on a system that uses zip ties?
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Old 09-26-12, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by tagaproject6 View Post
"Crankset compatibility" on a system that uses zip ties?
Ha - first thing I noticed, too.
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Old 09-26-12, 09:25 AM
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I'm just looking forward to bike computers with 42 identically sized and shaped buttons with tiny illegible text.

Next up, a remote control with 42 identically sized and shaped buttons with tiny illegible text.
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Old 09-26-12, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
Interesting that no cycling site seemed to have picked it up (I didn't see anything about this at least). The pricing seems okay for a two sided system. I find it interesting that they went with ANT+ vs Bluetooth - I wonder what the data granularity is, i.e. frequency of sending data to the head unit.
Typically, the data is recorded every second. I know of no power metrics that requires a resolution greater than 1 second.
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Old 09-26-12, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by bikepro View Post
Typically, the data is recorded every second. I know of no power metrics that requires a resolution greater than 1 second.
Well if the idea is to map power around the different phases of the pedal stroke, wouldn't you need quicker than one second, given that a full pedal stroke happens in less than a second?
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Old 09-26-12, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
Well if the idea is to map power around the different phases of the pedal stroke, wouldn't you need quicker than one second, given that a full pedal stroke happens in less than a second?
This is what Look found when doing their pedals. There were 16? (I think) readings per revolution on each side, maybe it was 16 per revolution total? Anyway it was some crazy number of readings a second - at 60 rpm that would be whatever readings a second (16) but if you're sprinting at 120 rpm it's double that.

My understanding is that they wanted to make the thing bluetooth compatible, whatever that protocol is. In the meantime it talks "Polar".
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Old 09-26-12, 12:49 PM
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cool now i can train with power and have some 12" woofers to boot
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Old 09-26-12, 01:35 PM
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Looks like an expensive set of tinkertoys. I don't see any reason to go away from the proven meters from SRM, Quarq or Powertap.

The left/right balance appears to be a gimmick with no proven benefits.
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Old 09-26-12, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
Well if the idea is to map power around the different phases of the pedal stroke, wouldn't you need quicker than one second, given that a full pedal stroke happens in less than a second?
You may be right. I wasn't thinking about that metric.
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Old 09-26-12, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by tagaproject6 View Post
"Crankset compatibility" on a system that uses zip ties?
Humans would be back in the Stone Age without zip ties.
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Old 09-26-12, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by oilman_15106 View Post
Humans would be back in the Stone Age without zip ties.
It's the duct tape of the 21st century
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Old 09-26-12, 04:25 PM
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At $700 for the crank and $2000-2500 for the power meter, you'd think that they would be able to do better than zip ties to hold it all together. I'll pass.

--EDIT--

Beyond being fugly, they're in just the perfect spot to be knocked loose or damaged by your foot. Good lookin' out there, Pioneer.

Last edited by MegaTom; 09-26-12 at 04:28 PM.
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Old 09-26-12, 04:41 PM
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Nice job of market research, Pioneer. We've been dying for something that combines the price of an SRM with the beauty of a Polar chain tension power meter, the useless left/right power data of the Garmin Vector pedals, a computer to make us trash our Garmin 500s, a custom bottom bracket and a three piece design with multiple batteries.
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Old 09-26-12, 05:00 PM
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I really do wonder how many $2000+ power meters the market will support.
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Old 09-26-12, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
I really do wonder how many $2000+ power meters the market will support.
Professionals who ride $10K+ bikes maybe? You have to wonder how good a BB made by an A/V electronics company can be, though.
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Old 09-26-12, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by PatrickGSR94 View Post
Professionals who ride $10K+ bikes maybe? You have to wonder how good a BB made by an A/V electronics company can be, though.
I'm not questioning the fact that some people do buy them. I'm questioning whether there's room in the market for SRM, Quarg, Pioneer, Look, and Garmin to all be selling powermeters in that price range, at the same time, profitably. There's a limited number of those pros and the amateurs with the coin to buy a powermeter, and these things, to my understanding, tend to last a while. How many units do these five companies need to sell to break even? Or make a profit? Are there that many buyers in the market, total, every year?
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Old 09-26-12, 08:08 PM
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Oh okay, shows you how much I know. I didn't know the other companies also had units in that price range.
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Old 09-26-12, 08:14 PM
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uh....."The system is designed to be an after-market addition for Shimano DURA-ACE 7900, 7950, and 9000 crank-set owners," said Pioneer. "We feel this is the largest group. As we evolve, we will add more crank-set compatibility." fail and 2000-2500 for zip ties? rather have an SRM or Quarq
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