Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Help me pick my new STEEL ride! Budget within...

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Help me pick my new STEEL ride! Budget within...

Old 02-23-13, 09:50 PM
  #26  
chaadster
Thread Killer
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 11,754

Bikes: '15 Kinesis Racelight 4S, '76 Motebecane Gran Jubilée, '17 Dedacciai Gladiatore2, '12 Breezer Venturi, '09 Dahon Mariner, '12 Mercier Nano, '95 DeKerf Team SL, '19 Tern Rally, ‘21 Breezer Doppler Cafe+, ‘19 T-Lab X3

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2210 Post(s)
Liked 1,279 Times in 785 Posts
Originally Posted by DayGloDago View Post
Lots of people still riding 30 and 40 year-old steel bikes. How many of today's carbon bikes will still be on the road ten years from now? How many 10 year-old CF bikes do you on the road now?

There's something very un-nerving about carbon......
Man, there's tons of 10 year old carbon, out there, from old Giant Cadexes (which are probably 20 years old at this point), to Specialized Epics, to Trek whatever-thousands. I mean, you're kidding, right?
chaadster is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 09:53 PM
  #27  
Scooper
Decrepit Member
 
Scooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Rosa, California
Posts: 10,489

Bikes: Waterford 953 RS-22, several Paramounts

Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 629 Post(s)
Liked 61 Times in 50 Posts
Originally Posted by rebel1916 View Post
Only for people who are ignorant about how strong it is. Watch this video.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/santa-c...-test-lab.html
It's not about strength or strength-to-weight ratio. It's about CF's low elongation and failure mode that's un-nerving.

The OP is asking about steel (>15% elongation).
__________________
- Stan

my bikes

Science doesn't care what you believe.
Scooper is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 09:55 PM
  #28  
thirdgenbird
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,107
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Fred B View Post
These bikes were each built for the price you are contemplating -



For details on the components - https://www.flickr.com/photos/7645270...in/photostream





For details on the components - https://www.flickr.com/photos/7645270...in/photostream
You have good taste
thirdgenbird is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 10:00 PM
  #29  
rebel1916
Senior Member
 
rebel1916's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked 80 Times in 42 Posts
Originally Posted by Scooper View Post
It's not about strength or strength-to-weight ratio. It's about CF's low elongation and failure mode that's un-nerving.

The OP is asking about steel (>15% elongation).
Yep, but it's th internets. And when you silly gooses say silly things, I reserve the right to talk sense. It's 11 PM, my wife is sleeping (and gassy) what else do I have to do.
rebel1916 is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 10:07 PM
  #30  
Scooper
Decrepit Member
 
Scooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Rosa, California
Posts: 10,489

Bikes: Waterford 953 RS-22, several Paramounts

Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 629 Post(s)
Liked 61 Times in 50 Posts
Originally Posted by rebel1916 View Post
Yep, but it's th internets. And when you silly gooses say silly things, I reserve the right to talk sense. It's 11 PM, my wife is sleeping (and gassy) what else do I have to do.
Your sense is nonsense. The low elongation and consequential failure mode of CF is a physical property of the material, and that's a fact.
__________________
- Stan

my bikes

Science doesn't care what you believe.
Scooper is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 10:16 PM
  #31  
rebel1916
Senior Member
 
rebel1916's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked 80 Times in 42 Posts
Yep, but it is also a fact that it is ridiculously strong up to the point of failure. Hell, I've ridden a motorcycle with carbon wheels at 160 on the track. Ducati's MotoGP bike is carbon. Boeing, blah blah blah. But luddite haters gonna hate.
rebel1916 is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 10:22 PM
  #32  
StanSeven
Administrator
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Posts: 13,505

Bikes: Cervelo C5, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 997 Post(s)
Liked 1,553 Times in 1,077 Posts
Originally Posted by chaadster View Post
Man, there's tons of 10 year old carbon, out there, from old Giant Cadexes (which are probably 20 years old at this point), to Specialized Epics, to Trek whatever-thousands. I mean, you're kidding, right?
The only problem old CF frames is the glued CF tube/al lugs. The glue in the lugs like on Epics didn't hold but that has nothing to do with the material. Yep, there are tons of old Treks around.
StanSeven is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 10:24 PM
  #33  
GaryinLA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
How about a Surly Pacer and save the remainder of your money?
GaryinLA is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 11:16 PM
  #34  
MetalPedaler
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wherever u see a fred, I am there.
Posts: 1,068
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by rebel1916 View Post
Yep, but it is also a fact that it is ridiculously strong up to the point of failure. Hell, I've ridden a motorcycle with carbon wheels at 160 on the track. Ducati's MotoGP bike is carbon. Boeing, blah blah blah. But luddite haters gonna hate.
I think the CF they use on motorcicle wheels and aeroplanes is a tad beefier than what they use on featherweight bicycles.......

Couldn't ghet the earlier-referenced vid to play....but in all the "lab tests" I've seen, they're always very careful apply the force in compression...never laterally- which is precisely where carbon will fail, and is also the type of force to be most-often encountered in the real world. Maybe your CF frame won't fail if you have an elephant balancing on one leg on your steerer tube.....but give a little side impact to that fork......and CLICK!

All I know, is I've seen tons of broken carbon frames. Don't think I've ever seen a broken steel frame- except perhaps if it got ran over by a semi.
MetalPedaler is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 11:26 PM
  #35  
rebel1916
Senior Member
 
rebel1916's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked 80 Times in 42 Posts
Originally Posted by DayGloDago View Post
I think the CF they use on motorcicle wheels and aeroplanes is a tad beefier than what they use on featherweight bicycles.......

Couldn't ghet the earlier-referenced vid to play....but in all the "lab tests" I've seen, they're always very careful apply the force in compression...never laterally- which is precisely where carbon will fail, and is also the type of force to be most-often encountered in the real world. Maybe your CF frame won't fail if you have an elephant balancing on one leg on your steerer tube.....but give a little side impact to that fork......and CLICK!

All I know, is I've seen tons of broken carbon frames. Don't think I've ever seen a broken steel frame- except perhaps if it got ran over by a semi.
Man, at the end of that vid, they are whacking a frame off a concrete pillar. And carbon motorcycle wheels exist because they are the lightest possible option. Not only have I seen broken steel frames, but I broke a steel motorcycle frame back in the day. A slow, heavy motorcycle at that. If you prefer to ride steel, God bless ya, it is a great choice. But so is carbon. And a carbon frame is gonna be able to be a bit lighter, while still being stronger.

Here's that link again. I hope it works this time
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/santa-c...-test-lab.html
rebel1916 is offline  
Old 02-23-13, 11:34 PM
  #36  
Bacciagalupe
Professional Fuss-Budget
 
Bacciagalupe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,487
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 25 Post(s)
Liked 18 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by DayGloDago View Post
Lots of people still riding 30 and 40 year-old steel bikes....
I don't recall seeing that many 1970s and 80s bikes out there. And I ride one.


How many of today's carbon bikes will still be on the road ten years from now? How many 10 year-old CF bikes do you on the road now?
I don't know the stats, but CF wasn't very common 10 years ago, and even today I don't think it sells in anywhere near the same numbers as metal. It's only just beginning to hit similar price points as aluminum.


There's something very un-nerving about carbon......
Not really, it's exceptionally strong and light. Any impact that's going to damage a CF frame would almost certainly do the same amount of damage to a metal frame.

The memes about frame materials just won't die, will they?
Bacciagalupe is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 02:17 AM
  #37  
Bob Dopolina 
Mr. Dopolina
 
Bob Dopolina's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 10,205

Bikes: KUUPAS, Simpson VR

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 145 Post(s)
Liked 115 Times in 39 Posts
Originally Posted by DayGloDago View Post
Lots of people still riding 30 and 40 year-old steel bikes. How many of today's carbon bikes will still be on the road ten years from now? How many 10 year-old CF bikes do you on the road now?

There's something very un-nerving about carbon......
Lots and lots.

Carbon bikes have been around since the 80's. and there are literally MILLIONS of carbon forks out there. I think it's a proven material at this point.

This stuff is hot: https://www.englishcycles.com/
__________________
BDop Cycling Company Ltd.: bdopcycling.com, facebook, instagram



Bob Dopolina is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 03:43 AM
  #38  
Chris Pringle
Senior Member
 
Chris Pringle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: The Pearl of the Pacific, Mexico
Posts: 1,308

Bikes: '12 Rodriguez UTB Custom, '83 Miyata 610, '83 Nishiki Century Mixte (Work of Art), '06 Specialized Epic Marathon MTB

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked 27 Times in 16 Posts
Many very nice steel builders out there, but finding one that meets your requirements is not an easy task. Went through this exercise (of choosing a custom builder) for my significant other a little less than two months ago. At your $5,000 budget (same as ours), I would suggest looking for a builder that prices his frame & fork that's about USD $1,500-$1,800 base. You'll be surprised by how extras (e.g., nicer paint schemes, extra braze-ons and other aesthetics requirements) quickly add up. Then about $2,500 should be budgeted for wheels and nicer components. One thing that we found in the process is how long the delivery times were for "solo” builders (a few mentioned here.) We just couldn't believe how many people are building steel custom bikes given the responses. 6-9 months was the average, but some were even longer. Deposit of up to 50% of the price of the frameset is required while you just wait anxiously for months or years. Some builders would just build the frameset while others would take care of putting together the entire bike for you (for a fee.) The latter made the most sense for us to insure everything worked seamlessly. We spent weeks carefully interviewing builders by phone (we live outside the U.S.) We chose an outfit in Seattle, WA for this custom randonneur bike -- a bike suitable for long distance comfort (non-competitive.) This outfit offered good lead times, good communication, reasonable pricing, good steel quality, all the extra features we wanted and offered the most flexibility in choosing our own components while they'd take care of the entire assembly.

You can PM me if you have further questions about the builder we chose.

Last edited by Chris Pringle; 02-24-13 at 03:49 AM.
Chris Pringle is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 07:57 AM
  #39  
Fred B
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kentucky, USA
Posts: 47

Bikes: 2013 Cinelli Super Corsa, 2013 De Rosa Nuovo Classico, 2011 Mercian Strada Speciale, 1980 Andre Bertin Model C-132

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by HBxRider View Post
Can someone school a newbie on what the benefits are of a steel frame on that high end budget? I'm assuming its for durability, longevity and people like classic looks. But how much difference is there between a $300 steel frame and a $3000 steel frame?
"A Rose Is A Rose Is A Rose, right?

Not when it comes to steel tubing for bicycle frames. Does it make a difference, whether it’s Cro-Mo, double butted, heat treated, etc.? You bet.

If you intend to actually ride a road bicycle (fixed or geared) for some distance, for the pleasure of riding, it’s really no different than with other products. Cars are probably the best analogy. Is there a difference between how a Honda Civic rides and handles, and how a BMW 3 series rides and handles? They both get you to where you’re going. Again, yes there is a difference. The Honda is a great car, but the Beemer is a lot more fun. That’s the point with the better quality tubing- the bike is just more fun to ride. It can get confusing, with so many types of steel tubing. Through various alloying strategies, heat treatments, etc., steel tubing sets produced by Reynolds, Columbus, True Temper, Kaisei (formerly Ishiwata) and others have gotten progressively stronger and lighter.

In general, you can look at it this way- as the tubing tensile strength increases, the wall thickness of the tubing can be decreased without a sacrifice in strength, producing decidedly lighter tube sets. For the cyclist there are 2 main benefits. The first is obvious, the frame will be lighter. The second is not so obvious until you actually ride the bike using the better quality tubing. The ride feel, the liveliness of the bike, and the ride comfort will all be noticeably improved. IMHO, this is the far greater benefit to the average cyclist, even more so than the weight loss.

So, what is the hierarchy in the world of steel tubing for bike frames? Here’s a generalized overview/ranking (low to high), using the popular Reynolds line to represent the higher quality steels:
- Hi Ten: very inexpensive, and very heavy, the lowest quality level of steel used for adult bicycle frames
- Cro-Mo: higher quality alloyed steel, lighter weight than Hi Ten
- Butted Cro-Mo: lighter still, probably the most widely used tubing for mid priced ($650- 750) steel fixed gear bikes. It comes in many, many names, and is usually what’s used in “proprietary” tube sets from many bike manufacturers, to give it a less generic sounding name.
- Reynolds 520 (note- all of the Reynolds tubing listed is butted): a step above the standard butted Cro-Mo, Reynolds entry level butted tube set
- Reynolds 631: the next level up, air hardened, with higher strength and thinner wall thicknesses available
- Reynolds 725: next level up, air hardened and heat treated, with thinner wall thicknesses available
- Reynolds 853: very high end steel, thinner still, and lighter
- Reynolds 953: a variant of stainless steel, this one rivals Ti and carbon fiber on weight, but with the ride of steel
- Columbus Spirit Niobium: similar in weight to the 953, the Spirit is one of the lightest steel tubes sets available

I guess the point of this is, when you’re looking at the various bikes out there (and this seems to be especially true of the fixed gear segment where a lot of steel is used), pay attention to the differences in the steel used for the frame. If it doesn’t say Reynolds, Columbus, True Temper, etc., then you can be very certain it is a medium grade of tubing at best. This does not imply that it is of low quality, but simply that the bike just will not be as light or ride as pleasureably as one made with a higher quality tubing. Also, note that even though the higher quality tubing is lighter, in most cases it’s actually stronger than the heavier steels. The only down side (besides cost, of course) is that the thinner walls will dent more easily. So, if your bike will be abused to some degree, it would be better to use the thicker walled tubing."

From the following web site - https://www.wabicycles.com/steel_tubing_info.html

Also, here is a good source for even more detailed information of the various steel alloys used in bike frames -
https://www.strongframes.com/more_stu...ls_tech/specs/

Last edited by Fred B; 02-24-13 at 08:28 AM.
Fred B is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 08:09 AM
  #40  
BillyD
Administrator
 
BillyD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Hudson Valley, NY
Posts: 31,061

Bikes: Merlin Cyrene '04; Bridgestone RB-1 '92

Mentioned: 315 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10371 Post(s)
Liked 4,440 Times in 2,432 Posts
Originally Posted by rebel1916 View Post
Yep, but it's th internets. And when you silly gooses say silly things, I reserve the right to talk sense.
You don't reserve the right to call names, pal. "Silly" is your opinion, we've been down this road before.

Besides, this thread is about STEEL, so let's keep the cf comments out if it's going to start age-old, useless conflicts.

Keep it STEEL, everybody, thank you.
__________________
See, this is why we can't have nice things. - - smarkinson
Where else but the internet can a bunch of cyclists go and be the tough guy? - - jdon
BillyD is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 08:14 AM
  #41  
BillyD
Administrator
 
BillyD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Hudson Valley, NY
Posts: 31,061

Bikes: Merlin Cyrene '04; Bridgestone RB-1 '92

Mentioned: 315 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10371 Post(s)
Liked 4,440 Times in 2,432 Posts
Originally Posted by Fred B View Post
These bikes were each built for the price you are contemplating -

That bike is HOT AS HELL!

The DeRosa is no slouch either, but the Mercian is off the chain!
__________________
See, this is why we can't have nice things. - - smarkinson
Where else but the internet can a bunch of cyclists go and be the tough guy? - - jdon
BillyD is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 08:16 AM
  #42  
Fred B
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Kentucky, USA
Posts: 47

Bikes: 2013 Cinelli Super Corsa, 2013 De Rosa Nuovo Classico, 2011 Mercian Strada Speciale, 1980 Andre Bertin Model C-132

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by DayGloDago View Post
I'm with Fred B.! Get yourself a nice vintage Eye-talian or Frog bike with modern components. You can buy a darn nice vintage steel bike for $1500-$2000....so buy two!
I should have been more clear in my descriptions. Though the frames look vintage, they were brand new when my bikes were assembled. The Mercian is from a custom frame shop in England (https://www.merciancycles.co.uk/), and the De Rosa is a limited production off the shelf frame that I purchased through a dealer in Switzerland (https://www.bellatisport.com/shop/cat..._Classico.html). Both companies were great to work with and can also provide great prices on components for a bike build because of favorable monetary exchange rates. In addition, bike frames and parts shipped to the U.S. are not subject to the Value Added Tax (VAT) charged in Europe.

In case anyone is interested, the Mercian frame is made from a Reynolds 853 steel tubeset, and the De Rosa is made from a Dedacciai SAT 14.5 steel tubeset.

Last edited by Fred B; 02-24-13 at 12:41 PM.
Fred B is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 09:16 AM
  #43  
Bob Dopolina 
Mr. Dopolina
 
Bob Dopolina's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 10,205

Bikes: KUUPAS, Simpson VR

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 145 Post(s)
Liked 115 Times in 39 Posts
There was a thread from the hand built show a day or so ago. Link anyone?
__________________
BDop Cycling Company Ltd.: bdopcycling.com, facebook, instagram



Bob Dopolina is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 09:36 AM
  #44  
mymojo
Senior Member
 
mymojo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Plano, Texxas
Posts: 517

Bikes: '10 Specialized Allez, '09 Cervelo S1, '93 Trek T200 (tandem), Rocky Mountain Metro 30

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I hear there's this Italian fella named Ernesto that makes a pretty sweet steel frame.
mymojo is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 09:58 AM
  #45  
surgeonstone
Senior Member
 
surgeonstone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: South Bend IN
Posts: 11,218

Bikes: 1976 FRESCHI, 2004 Crumpton.

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 925 Post(s)
Liked 21 Times in 10 Posts
Originally Posted by mymojo View Post
I hear there's this Italian fella named Ernesto that makes a pretty sweet steel frame.
Sadly, Ernesto stopped making them a long, long time ago, another victim of the emerging global market and workfoce.
surgeonstone is offline  
Old 02-24-13, 11:21 AM
  #46  
MetalPedaler
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wherever u see a fred, I am there.
Posts: 1,068
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Fred B View Post
I should have been more clear in my descriptions. Though the frames look vintage, they were brand new when my bikes were assembled. The Mercian is from a custom frame shop in England (https://www.merciancycles.co.uk/), and the De Rosa is a limited production off the shelf frame that I purchased through a dealer in Switzerland (https://www.bellatisport.com/shop/cat..._Classico.html). Both companies were great to work with and can also provide great prices on components for a bike build.

In case anyone is interested, the Mercian frame is made of Reynolds 853 steel, and the De Rosa is made of Dedacciai SAT 14.5 steel.
WoW! I had no idea that they were still making those bikes! LOVe the chrome lugs on the De Rosa! I like retro, myself- my next bike is going to be retro steel [Largely because I'm too cheap to buy modern steel!] - I have my good "modern bike" now ('97 Klein]...now I need a vintage steel!

Also, I enjoyed your explanation, above, of the joys of steel.
MetalPedaler is offline  
Old 02-25-13, 12:23 PM
  #47  
vinfix
Steel80's
 
vinfix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NJ
Posts: 636

Bikes: Breezer Venturi, Breezer Lightning Pro, Schwinn Peloton

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 8 Posts
Originally Posted by Fred B View Post
"A Rose Is A Rose Is A Rose, right?

Not when it comes to steel tubing for bicycle frames. Does it make a difference, whether it’s Cro-Mo, double butted, heat treated, etc.? You bet.

If you intend to actually ride a road bicycle (fixed or geared) for some distance, for the pleasure of riding, it’s really no different than with other products. Cars are probably the best analogy. Is there a difference between how a Honda Civic rides and handles, and how a BMW 3 series rides and handles? They both get you to where you’re going. Again, yes there is a difference. The Honda is a great car, but the Beemer is a lot more fun. That’s the point with the better quality tubing- the bike is just more fun to ride. It can get confusing, with so many types of steel tubing. Through various alloying strategies, heat treatments, etc., steel tubing sets produced by Reynolds, Columbus, True Temper, Kaisei (formerly Ishiwata) and others have gotten progressively stronger and lighter.

In general, you can look at it this way- as the tubing tensile strength increases, the wall thickness of the tubing can be decreased without a sacrifice in strength, producing decidedly lighter tube sets. For the cyclist there are 2 main benefits. The first is obvious, the frame will be lighter. The second is not so obvious until you actually ride the bike using the better quality tubing. The ride feel, the liveliness of the bike, and the ride comfort will all be noticeably improved. IMHO, this is the far greater benefit to the average cyclist, even more so than the weight loss.

So, what is the hierarchy in the world of steel tubing for bike frames? Here’s a generalized overview/ranking (low to high), using the popular Reynolds line to represent the higher quality steels:
- Hi Ten: very inexpensive, and very heavy, the lowest quality level of steel used for adult bicycle frames
- Cro-Mo: higher quality alloyed steel, lighter weight than Hi Ten
- Butted Cro-Mo: lighter still, probably the most widely used tubing for mid priced ($650- 750) steel fixed gear bikes. It comes in many, many names, and is usually what’s used in “proprietary” tube sets from many bike manufacturers, to give it a less generic sounding name.
- Reynolds 520 (note- all of the Reynolds tubing listed is butted): a step above the standard butted Cro-Mo, Reynolds entry level butted tube set
- Reynolds 631: the next level up, air hardened, with higher strength and thinner wall thicknesses available
- Reynolds 725: next level up, air hardened and heat treated, with thinner wall thicknesses available
- Reynolds 853: very high end steel, thinner still, and lighter
- Reynolds 953: a variant of stainless steel, this one rivals Ti and carbon fiber on weight, but with the ride of steel
- Columbus Spirit Niobium: similar in weight to the 953, the Spirit is one of the lightest steel tubes sets available

I guess the point of this is, when you’re looking at the various bikes out there (and this seems to be especially true of the fixed gear segment where a lot of steel is used), pay attention to the differences in the steel used for the frame. If it doesn’t say Reynolds, Columbus, True Temper, etc., then you can be very certain it is a medium grade of tubing at best. This does not imply that it is of low quality, but simply that the bike just will not be as light or ride as pleasureably as one made with a higher quality tubing. Also, note that even though the higher quality tubing is lighter, in most cases it’s actually stronger than the heavier steels. The only down side (besides cost, of course) is that the thinner walls will dent more easily. So, if your bike will be abused to some degree, it would be better to use the thicker walled tubing."

From the following web site - https://www.wabicycles.com/steel_tubing_info.html

Also, here is a good source for even more detailed information of the various steel alloys used in bike frames -
https://www.strongframes.com/more_stu...ls_tech/specs/
Once you get above the hi-ten & generic cro-mo steel, you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference. I've owned many steel bikes with cromoly, tangalloy, 4130, 502, 725, etc. There are much greater factors in determining ride quality, particularly geometry, wheels, & tires, and using a carbon fork/seatpost. But I doubt you could get on otherwise identical bikes and tell the difference between 520 and 725 steel.
vinfix is offline  
Old 02-25-13, 04:07 PM
  #48  
eippo1
I like beans
 
eippo1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Meffa, MA
Posts: 3,353

Bikes: Tarmac Pro, Bianchi Zurigo, Raleigh Gran Sport, Fuji Del Rey, Ironman Centurion

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Love how these threads always degenerate into CF fail threads. Lolz. There's been lots of good stuff already mentioned, but just check out the NAHBS website since it just ended and check out the stuff there. Lots of amazing builders. A newer builder that makes really nice, yet affordable frames is Dornbox. I will most likely be picking up a Cielo at some point because the Sportif is pretty much exactly what I want.
eippo1 is offline  
Old 02-25-13, 04:39 PM
  #49  
pdedes
ka maté ka maté ka ora
 
pdedes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: wessex
Posts: 4,423

Bikes: breezer venturi - red novo bosberg - red, pedal force cg1 - red, neuvation f-100 - da, devinci phantom - xt, miele piste - miche/campy, bianchi reparto corse sbx, concorde squadra tsx - da, miele team issue sl - ultegra

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 25 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
If I were to get new steel, I would consider an Elephant. Put on an Enve fork, sram red, and boyd's new carbon clinchers.
pdedes is offline  
Old 02-25-13, 05:50 PM
  #50  
Grambo
Senior Member
 
Grambo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: S.E. Chester County PA
Posts: 602

Bikes: IF Ti Crown Jewel, Moots Mooto X RSL 29er, Fat Chance Yo Eddy, Lynskey Pro Cross

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
How about this bad boy ... Indy Fab SSR

https://www.ifbikes.com/OurBikes/Road...s_Steel_Road)/

Grambo is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.