Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Forgot how good CO2 is

Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Forgot how good CO2 is

Old 06-22-13, 10:17 PM
  #1  
StanSeven
Administrator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Posts: 13,079

Bikes: Cervelo C5, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 582 Post(s)
Liked 32 Times in 29 Posts
Forgot how good CO2 is

I haven't had a flat in months until today. I was hot, dehydrated, sweaty and weak and almost forgot I had CO2 and started with my mini pump. Then I remembered and it took maybe 4 seconds to inflate to 100 lbs.

It can't be beat especially when it's very hot or very cold and you want to just keep going.
StanSeven is offline  
Old 06-22-13, 10:34 PM
  #2  
Sean Gordon
Slam That Stem.
 
Sean Gordon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Brooklyn, NY; Portland ME
Posts: 47

Bikes: Quattro Assi DBS, Cannondale XR800, Felt Breed

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
My riding buddy got four flats today on a 60mi ride, he tried to hold out on the CO2 for the first two. But yeah, we were tired and hot.
Sean Gordon is offline  
Old 06-22-13, 10:46 PM
  #3  
Cat4Lifer
Velo Club La Grange
 
Cat4Lifer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: MDR, CA
Posts: 1,215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I'd be lucky to inflate to 80psi with mini or frame pump.
CO2 is the way to go
Cat4Lifer is offline  
Old 06-22-13, 11:18 PM
  #4  
RoadMike
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 355
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sean Gordon View Post
My riding buddy got four flats today on a 60mi ride, he tried to hold out on the CO2 for the first two. But yeah, we were tired and hot.
Somebody who knows voodoo must hate your friend. 4 flats on 60 mile ride is absurd.
RoadMike is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 08:23 AM
  #5  
Looigi
Senior Member
 
Looigi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,951
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Agree it's hard to beat 4 seconds to inflate a tire. With my Lezyne Road Drive it takes me 128 seconds. That's 32 times longer!
Looigi is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 08:25 AM
  #6  
Cookiemonsta
Senior Member
 
Cookiemonsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 533
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
In circumstances where speed is crucial I think CO2 is great (even when you do not want others to wait for you). Outside of those circumstances I have been using a mini-pump (Topeak racerocket) and have been pretty satisfied with the ease of use and the time it took to get a decent pressure in them. I have also used minipumps that were absolute trash.
Cookiemonsta is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 08:28 AM
  #7  
Bah Humbug
runner
 
Bah Humbug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 13,180

Bikes: Cervelo S1

Mentioned: 111 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3572 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sean Gordon View Post
My riding buddy got four flats today on a 60mi ride, he tried to hold out on the CO2 for the first two. But yeah, we were tired and hot.
On what tires? And how old?
Bah Humbug is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 08:39 AM
  #8  
ahsposo 
Thoroughbred Member
 
ahsposo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Santa Anita
Posts: 7,087

Bikes: A Home Built All Rounder, Bianchi 928, Specialized Langster, Dahon Folder

Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3028 Post(s)
Liked 94 Times in 64 Posts
Yeah, I can't quite get these people that won't even consider CO2.

I will say, however, that if I were to decide on a long solo out of home area ride, I'd probably spring for a Lenzyne. If I'm in my home area and somehow use both of my cartridges I'm gonna make the call of shame.
ahsposo is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 08:39 AM
  #9  
hhnngg1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 3,456
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Looigi View Post
Agree it's hard to beat 4 seconds to inflate a tire. With my Lezyne Road Drive it takes me 128 seconds. That's 32 times longer!
Most people take 5+ minutes with a typical portable pump. I'm not weak at all and my portable pump works fine, but anything over 80psi is a royal pain. It also takes me 5+ miuntes if I want to get up to 100psi.

CO2 - 3-4 seconds.

No contest. It's also wayyyy easier to put the CO2 in - between the arm pumping on the portable pumps, the darn thing keeps falling off the valave (I've broken 2 tube valves from that alone.) With CO2 it's even easier than a home floor pump.
hhnngg1 is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:03 AM
  #10  
Fox Farm
Senior Member
 
Fox Farm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Posts: 2,545

Bikes: Merlin Extra Light, Orbea Orca, Ritchey Outback,Tomac Revolver Mountain Bike, Cannondale Crit 3.0 now used for time trials.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 57 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I use a mini pump made by Carbo-One. It will pump up my tubular tires or clinchers to 120psi if I wish. I have used CO2 and had mixed results, probably because the head was not correctly screwed onto the valve. So, from a sustainability point of view, I find using CO2 cartridges and discarding them after one use to be stupid. Why ride a bike and say to yourself that you are making yourself more healthy and lessening carbon emissions to the environment while throwing away spent CO2 cartridges???
Fox Farm is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:31 AM
  #11  
Carbon Unit
Live to ride ride to live
 
Carbon Unit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 4,896

Bikes: Calfee Tetra Pro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Fox Farm View Post
I use a mini pump made by Carbo-One. It will pump up my tubular tires or clinchers to 120psi if I wish. I have used CO2 and had mixed results, probably because the head was not correctly screwed onto the valve. So, from a sustainability point of view, I find using CO2 cartridges and discarding them after one use to be stupid. Why ride a bike and say to yourself that you are making yourself more healthy and lessening carbon emissions to the environment while throwing away spent CO2 cartridges???
CO2 cartridges are recyclable.
Carbon Unit is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:37 AM
  #12  
Bah Humbug
runner
 
Bah Humbug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 13,180

Bikes: Cervelo S1

Mentioned: 111 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3572 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Pretty sure the CO2 is compressed out of the atmosphere anyway, so the only factor is the bit of power used for the extraction and compression. Which, for a little 16g canister, has to be a tiny amount compared to, say, driving to the start of a group ride. Or running the AC in your house in the summer. I'm sick of that reasoning for not using CO2.
Bah Humbug is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:39 AM
  #13  
ahsposo 
Thoroughbred Member
 
ahsposo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Santa Anita
Posts: 7,087

Bikes: A Home Built All Rounder, Bianchi 928, Specialized Langster, Dahon Folder

Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3028 Post(s)
Liked 94 Times in 64 Posts
Originally Posted by Fox Farm View Post
I use a mini pump made by Carbo-One. It will pump up my tubular tires or clinchers to 120psi if I wish. I have used CO2 and had mixed results, probably because the head was not correctly screwed onto the valve. So, from a sustainability point of view, I find using CO2 cartridges and discarding them after one use to be stupid. Why ride a bike and say to yourself that you are making yourself more healthy and lessening carbon emissions to the environment while throwing away spent CO2 cartridges???
At risk of angering the flat-gods, CO2 concerns like you mention are really minimal for me because I manage to ride a long time between flats. Last flat on the road bikes I remember was maybe 3 years ago. I ditched the Zefals because the last time I had to use that pump (not my last flat but close) the lubrication on the piston had dried up. I had to unscrew the thing and spit on it to get a seal and that fix wasn't very good.

Every time a car is cranked more CO2 goes into the air in the atmosphere first few seconds than is contained in that cartridge.

And speed can be important. Who wants to lose a group or keep them waiting while you futz around pumping up a tire.
ahsposo is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:44 AM
  #14  
gregf83 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 8,751
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 895 Post(s)
Liked 21 Times in 15 Posts
I've been carrying CO2 for the past year because my last mini-pump fell out of my back pocket and I hadn't got around to replacing it. I recently bought a lezyne pump that mounts under the water bottle cages. It seems to work well and takes about 150 strokes or so to pump up the tire. I didn't time how long it takes but even at 5 min it's immaterial to me. If I'm on a group ride and flat I send the group on and don't want them waiting as I can't stand waiting for others to fix their flats.

I don't mind an extra 5 min of upper body workout when I'm out exercising.
gregf83 is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 09:49 AM
  #15  
Carbon Unit
Live to ride ride to live
 
Carbon Unit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 4,896

Bikes: Calfee Tetra Pro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
When you pump up a bike tire with a mini pump, you are exhaling CO2.
Carbon Unit is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 10:06 AM
  #16  
hhnngg1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 3,456
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
I've been carrying CO2 for the past year because my last mini-pump fell out of my back pocket and I hadn't got around to replacing it. I recently bought a lezyne pump that mounts under the water bottle cages. It seems to work well and takes about 150 strokes or so to pump up the tire. I didn't time how long it takes but even at 5 min it's immaterial to me. If I'm on a group ride and flat I send the group on and don't want them waiting as I can't stand waiting for others to fix their flats.

I don't mind an extra 5 min of upper body workout when I'm out exercising.
I definitely mind. It's not just the 5 minutes of pumping - it's the whole annoying experience of pumping a tire to 100psi with a minipump. Drives me nuts.

I used to feel the same as you, using nothing but a minipump for 3 years and thinking CO2 was a total elitist overkill solution because you're not in a time rush on training rides. Trust me - after 4-5 more flats with CO2 pumping, you'll never go back to that annoying minipump, even if it's a really good one. It's no comparison. Totally, utterly effortless to refill in 3 seconds. There really is no downside if you bring 2 cartridges so you don't run out if you have more than one flat.
hhnngg1 is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 10:19 AM
  #17  
gregf83 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 8,751
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 895 Post(s)
Liked 21 Times in 15 Posts
Originally Posted by hhnngg1 View Post
I definitely mind. It's not just the 5 minutes of pumping - it's the whole annoying experience of pumping a tire to 100psi with a minipump. Drives me nuts.

I used to feel the same as you, using nothing but a minipump for 3 years and thinking CO2 was a total elitist overkill solution because you're not in a time rush on training rides. Trust me - after 4-5 more flats with CO2 pumping, you'll never go back to that annoying minipump, even if it's a really good one. It's no comparison. Totally, utterly effortless to refill in 3 seconds. There really is no downside if you bring 2 cartridges so you don't run out if you have more than one flat.
I've used dozens of CO2 cartridges over the years mainly because I didn't have a mini-pump with me. I'm used to suffering on the bike and pushing a pump 150 times doesn't compare to the discomfort I put myself through on the bike.

I don't think CO2 is environmentally bad or elitest or anything else. I just don't mind pumping them up manually. If it's wet and cold I may still use CO2.
gregf83 is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 10:41 AM
  #18  
chasm54
Banned.
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Uncertain
Posts: 8,651
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
Pretty sure the CO2 is compressed out of the atmosphere anyway, so the only factor is the bit of power used for the extraction and compression. Which, for a little 16g canister, has to be a tiny amount compared to, say, driving to the start of a group ride. Or running the AC in your house in the summer. I'm sick of that reasoning for not using CO2.
The fact that you are sick of it doesn't make it wrong. CO2 cartridges have to be manufactured, like everything else. And the fact we waste energy in other ways doesn't legitimise wasting more.

My lezyne pump is rated to 160lbs. Getting 100 lbs into a tube isn't perticularly hard work. It isn't as vulnerable to operator error, and it never runs out of gas. Unless you carry lots of cartridges CO2 is inherently less reliable, as well as wasteful.
chasm54 is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 11:03 AM
  #19  
TromboneAl
Senior Member
 
TromboneAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Far, Far Northern California
Posts: 2,874

Bikes: 1997 Specialized M2Pro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I'm a recent convert to CO2, as long as I have a backup pump.

This is my new setup, and I am Jonesing for a flat so I can try it out.



I've experimented in the garage, and the 12 gram air-gun cartridges fill the tire to just the right amount.
TromboneAl is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 11:11 AM
  #20  
Carbon Unit
Live to ride ride to live
 
Carbon Unit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 4,896

Bikes: Calfee Tetra Pro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
The fact that you are sick of it doesn't make it wrong. CO2 cartridges have to be manufactured, like everything else. And the fact we waste energy in other ways doesn't legitimise wasting more.

My lezyne pump is rated to 160lbs. Getting 100 lbs into a tube isn't perticularly hard work. It isn't as vulnerable to operator error, and it never runs out of gas. Unless you carry lots of cartridges CO2 is inherently less reliable, as well as wasteful.
If you Lezyne mini pump is like my Lezyne CNC floor pump with a screw on chuck then it is more prone to operator error than my Innovations Air Chuck that pushes on. I have never had a problem with my Air Chuck. I carry 3 or 4 cartridges depending on where I ride. This still weighs less than an a Road Morph.
Carbon Unit is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 11:18 AM
  #21  
Carbon Unit
Live to ride ride to live
 
Carbon Unit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 4,896

Bikes: Calfee Tetra Pro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/cgi-bin/...i?post=1526555;

"A 12 gram CO2 cylinder has the same amount of CO2 found in a one liter bottle of soda."
Carbon Unit is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 11:32 AM
  #22  
Dunbar
Senior Member
 
Dunbar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,081

Bikes: Roubaix SL4 Expert , Cervelo S2

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
The fact that you are sick of it doesn't make it wrong. CO2 cartridges have to be manufactured, like everything else. And the fact we waste energy in other ways doesn't legitimise wasting more.
It's just crazy to worry about the environmental impact of using a couple CO2 cartridges per year. It's probably the equivalent to driving less than a mile in a car.

Last edited by Dunbar; 06-23-13 at 11:39 AM.
Dunbar is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 11:36 AM
  #23  
Bah Humbug
runner
 
Bah Humbug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 13,180

Bikes: Cervelo S1

Mentioned: 111 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3572 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
The fact that you are sick of it doesn't make it wrong. CO2 cartridges have to be manufactured, like everything else. And the fact we waste energy in other ways doesn't legitimise wasting more.
Actually it pretty much does. If you're going to get sanctimonious to me about "wasting" energy in CO2 canisters (at the rate of approximately 1 per year) you'd better be sure you aren't wasting far more than that in the rest of your life or, by your logic, I can sit here and judge you for having your AC set to 78 instead of 82, driving anything that doesn't get 40mpg, eating lots of imported fruit, watching a large TV... I mean really, CO2 cartridges are the wrong thing to try to make an environmental point on.

And I carry three with me, and I've never had a failure. I have, on the other hand, had a Road Morph head blow apart on me, so there's that.
Bah Humbug is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 12:09 PM
  #24  
AdelaaR
Senior Member
 
AdelaaR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Vlaamse Ardennen, Belgium
Posts: 3,898
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Fox Farm View Post
... and lessening carbon emissions ...
Hahaha
AdelaaR is offline  
Old 06-23-13, 12:23 PM
  #25  
chasm54
Banned.
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Uncertain
Posts: 8,651
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
Actually it pretty much does. If you're going to get sanctimonious to me about "wasting" energy in CO2 canisters (at the rate of approximately 1 per year) you'd better be sure you aren't wasting far more than that in the rest of your life or, by your logic, I can sit here and judge you for having your AC set to 78 instead of 82, driving anything that doesn't get 40mpg, eating lots of imported fruit, watching a large TV... I mean really, CO2 cartridges are the wrong thing to try to make an environmental point on.

And I carry three with me, and I've never had a failure. I have, on the other hand, had a Road Morph head blow apart on me, so there's that.
Well, I agree they're hardly the most pressing threat to the environment. Though as it happens I don't have AC (unnecessary where I live) do drive (rarely) a car that gets more than 40 miles to a US gallon, try to eat as locally-sourced as I can (though the carbon consequences of importing foodstuffs are often less severe than of heating the growing environment in cooler climes) don't have a large TV, and still have a carbon footprint bigger than I'd like.

I just think CO2 is unnecessary, that's all. And I have a slightly puritanical streak.
chasm54 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.