travelerman

On my old-style geometry Schwinn, I could ride down the road for a comfortable distance with my hands off the handlebars; I find it impossible on my Giant Defy... Either the steering is too sensitive, or my center of gravity is too different (maybe some of both), but any time I try it, even at moderate speeds on flat, smooth surfaces, I cannot seem to get one or two strokes completed without feeling like I am about to lose control.

While the newer bike is more comfortable to ride and handle, I do find it a bit annoying to not be able to keep on pedaling if I have to adjust something or peel back an energy bar wrapper...

DerHoggz

Nope, just you. Don't blame the bike.

Campag4life

I have never owned a bike I couldn't ride no handed. The frame geometry thing has been discussed before. Some believe for example that a laid out angle bike like the Defy is hard to ride no handed. To me, its the lack of coordination of the rider. I can ride my Roubaix (similar geo to a Defy) for 10 miles no handed if I want.

Pedaleur

Practice. Your new bike is likely more 'responsive' -- you just have to get used to it.

Rowan

Already I have the : out based on the first two answers.

Cyclelogikal

Probably need to get use to the new bike. I don't think the compact has anything much to do with it. Each bike if going from one brand to another I would almost assume is slightly different geometry. I can ride for a short distance no hands but 10 miles!!!!! Never here in the mountains............too many curves and climbs

surgeonstone

No.

Daytrip

I decided early on that the best place for my hands is on the handlebars, after a gust of wind nearly caused me to crash while riding no handed down a hill. Whatever you get out of it, ain't worth the risk, IMO.

travelerman

So the consensus is that either I am unskilled, or dumb for even wanting to ride with no hands?

Glad I'm a big boy.... Otherwise, I would have to go somewhere and sulk.

I still think the twitchiness of this style of bike makes it way more difficult to maneuver sans hands...

Pedaleur

Not necessarily more difficult; just different.

Since I do the majority of my riding on my 'racing' bike, I can ride that no handed more-or-less indefinitely. Conversely, I have trouble on my commuting bike because it doesn't react to me shifting my weight around as readily.

DerHoggz

The only thing that "compact" explicitly denotes is a sloping top tube. So if anything it is simply that your bike's geometry is harder to balance, not compact bikes in general (basically every bike in production).

tagaproject6

No trouble here.

areFish

OP, I hear what your saying. Prior to my road bike acquisition in May, I rode a MTB with slicks. I didn't have trouble sitting upright on that bike and cruising with no hands for a bit. Not so with my RB. I try to sit back, but feel like the front wheel is going to jackknife on me if I don't take control of the bars. My days of "Look Ma, no hands" are probably behind me.

surgeonstone

I frequently ride hands off for many reasons,
- to give my back a break
- to give my hands a break
- to photograph or video scenery
- to take a break and eat or drink something
- because it make me feel real cool, like I just crossed the finish line in a stage in the TDF.

Rowan

Only among those who don't have a clue.

I'll give you an example of how a fork can change the nature of a bike. Sure it applies to a traditional framed touring bike, but it illustrates the point nicely. I have a Fuji Touring, which I put around 55,000km on in various styles of riding -- touring, commuting, randonneuring, fun TTs, leisure riding. But I had to concentrate on keeping it straight all the time. I had little opportunity to look up and around. No hand? NO WAY! Unless I was going downhill at over 15mh.

I checked the alignment of the frame. No problems there. It had several different sets of wheels on it. No change. Distribution of weight had no effect.

It became tedious, particularly as I had had an MTB that I could sit up on, and a Merida 900 road that I could sit up on.

Anyway, I had enough. I did my research and decided the unicrown fork on the Fuji was just wrong. So I bought a Surly replacement fork, with a cast crown and somewhat different angles. Now I can ride that bike and keep it straight while looking up and about. It has transformed the bike from being tiresome to being good.

In my book, fork and head tube angles have an influence on how floppy the front wheel can be.

Remember, too, that if you are trying to emulate the TdF guys in, say, eating, they are doing all this at speeds likely higher than 15mph when even the worst-mannered bike should behave.

oldbobcat

It's the geometry but it's nothing to do with the short seat tube. The wheelbase is shorter, especially the part behind your center of gravity, so the bike is more sensitive to weight shifts, The head tube angle is steeper, and the rake is shorter, making the bike more sensitive to handlebar input. Also, the wheels are lighter, which makes them change direction more easily. Everything happens faster.

Your choices are: keep riding and complaining, go back to the Schwinn, or get used to it, you might like it after a while. Guess which one I recommend.

Savagewolf

Different bikes absolutely are more or less difficult to ride with no hands than others. There are a number of factors, from wheel/tire size and width to saddle/handlebar differences to frame geometry, personal height/weight and how it affects riding the bike and more.

I personally believe that anyone who thinks a compact bike is just as easy to ride as his old Schwinn is either not being honest or does not have a true feeling on how bikes handles differently. Yes, yes, I know. You are a highly skilled cyclist and every aspect of cycling is simple to you.

It's certainly not as much of a skill issue as some would think. Perhaps a different skill, but not an overall skill. I've known many quite strong riders who don't ride well with no hands on the bars.

BigJeff

Measure the rake and trail on the two bikes.

Rake is the angle of the fork steerer tube/axle and
trail the distance between the projected line from the steerer tube/axle to ground measured backward to the perpendicular axle to ground.

In general, more rake decreases responsiveness and requires more input to turn, and less rake makes a bike "responsive... but twitchy"
While increasing trail makes the bike more likely to go in a straight line.

Many road bikes have very steep steerer tubes and very little rake, e.g. "straight forks", compared to C&V bikes which had bent forks for extra trail.


Most likely you Defy has far less rake and trail... very sporty, but not a very "hands free" bike... since it is compact, go 50x12 and speed up. As you increase speed it will make your trail more effective so you can be hands free.

Think of it as the "bad shopping cart wheel" it may wobble like hell unless you are pushing the cart fast.

The Roubaix is designed with more rake/trail (I believe)... I wouldn't compare the Defy to it.

Johnny Rad

What pedals are you using?

thump55

Have you tried resting your forehead on the hoods?

StanSeven

A sloping top tube has nothing to do with it (assume that's what you mean by "compact"). Every bike is different and things like wheel base, stay length, rake and trail all factor in to stability. Just practice a little and after a few minutes, you'll be good.

merlinextraligh

Sorry, but there is a whole lot of wrong in this post.

First, rake is the hub's offset from the steering axis. The angle of the fork's steerer tube has nothing to do with it. ( the angle of the fork blades to the steerer tube affects rake, but it is not the definition of it, and the angle of steerer tube itself has no effect on rake).

Second, more rake doesn't decrease responsiveness. More rake equals less trail, and all else equal make the bike more responsive.

Third, whether a fork is curved or straight does not determine the amount of rake, i.e. offset. A straight fork can have a lot of rake, depending on how the fork blades are angled to the head tube.

Fourth, given that more rake equals less trail, a bike with less rake is not going to also have less trail.


https://calfeedesign.com/tech-papers/...bike-handling/

https://davesbikeblog.squarespace.com...f-history.html

I think your basic point that the geometry of the schwinn leads to a more stable ride is likely correct, but your explanation of rake and trail is way off.

BigJeff

oops yup.

oldbobcat

It is. The movements for controlling a road bike just got a lot more subtle. Roll with it a while because new bikes take getting used to. You're trying to adapt to 20 years of change in road bike design in one purchase.

rekmeyata

Not the least bit. I just bought my first compact frame after over 40 years of traditional designs and I can ride it all day with no hands if the road conditions are good, and I'm 60 years old, I mentioned that only because as I have gotten older I cannot do track stands anywhere near as good as I use to when I was in my 20's and 30's which means my balance is not as good as it use to be yet I have no problems riding with no hands on a compact bike.