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Colnago C59 or Pinarello Dogma ....?

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Colnago C59 or Pinarello Dogma ....?

Old 08-07-13, 11:35 PM
  #51  
eja_ bottecchia
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Originally Posted by Peiper1 View Post
That's awesome, mine is a 2013 Diamond White C350 with the red leather interior !! Nice bike too !!
Thanks...a white car with red interiors is a very unusual color combo...but I like it.

Here is another picture...

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Old 08-07-13, 11:47 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by bikerjp View Post
Fine. Standardized production (although it looks like you can also get it custom). Point is, unless you buy custom, you get a bike that uses the same bits and pieces as it's put together and is for all intents and purposes the same as the next one off the line. Cannondale makes a limited number of CAAD10s each year but no one is arguing they are not mass produced.
This is the Internet and we can go on arguing about the meaning of mass produced or hand made. I just don't want to waste your time or mine arguing something that is beyond argument.

You already stated that if you could, you would get a C59...that is good enough for me.

Ride safely!

https://www.colnago.com/building-a-c59-italia-the-art-of-bike-building/ https://www.colnago.com/the-colnago-painting-process/
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Old 08-07-13, 11:54 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by fauxto nick View Post
I'll make angels cry and enjoy my bomb proof reliable Dura Ache.
I got rid of the DuraAce long time ago--it looked ugly and it never worked well enough for me. Now I have Campy on all my bikes. All is good in God's heavens.
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Old 08-08-13, 12:00 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
I got rid of the DuraAce long time ago--it looked ugly and it never worked well enough for me. Now I have Campy on all my bikes. All is good in God's heavens.
To each their own, and I love Campy, I've considered it, but I've spent a good amount of time working with it. I chose Dura Ace.
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Old 08-08-13, 12:06 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by fauxto nick View Post
To each their own, and I love Campy, I've considered it, but I've spent a good amount of time working with it. I chose Dura Ace.
It's all good bro. Enjoy the ride and ride safely.
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Old 08-08-13, 06:00 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by SANTE POLLASTRI View Post
excuse me but I have to disagree.
Our Mother of ghisallo was happy when Museeuw,Tafi,Zabel etc.etc.etc.etc. won everywhere,and mr Ernesto too.
And,but this is subjective,Shimano is better than Camoagnolo,I'm changing all my groupsets from Italian to Japanese technology.
Tullio won't be happy.
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Old 08-08-13, 08:17 AM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by SANTE POLLASTRI View Post
r.i.p.
His spirit lives on....I wouldn't mess around with the ghosts of old Italian icons. Bad joo-joo!
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Old 08-08-13, 09:03 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
You understand that whenever someone hangs Shimano parts on a Colnago, angels in heaven cry! Why would anyone want to make angels cry? I will light a candle at the Madonna de Ghisallo chapel and pray for your soul.

I think the angels are perfectly happy at the sound of perfectly crisp and precise shifts made by the Di2. I think the angels have gotten over their Campy bigotry since accepting that Campy has only won like what, 1 Tour in the last 12-15 years? But I am sure it's just all marketing dollars, race teams don't care about function or reliability..

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Old 08-08-13, 09:58 AM
  #59  
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With ride, fit and finish out fo the way, Colnago! Plus there are just too many Pinarello fakes out there.
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Old 08-08-13, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by tagaproject6 View Post
With ride, fit and finish out fo the way, Colnago! Plus there are just too many Pinarello fakes out there.
Ugh, we had someone bring in a "Chinarello" as he called it recently. Looked like an unpainted Dogma but nothing worked right. He said it was really flexy in the bottom bracket and asked if that was characteristic of a Dogma. "Uhhhh, no, it is not."
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Old 08-08-13, 10:03 PM
  #61  
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The overwhelming consensus seems to be the Colnago C59, and Colnago it will be. Going this weekend to order the two bikes. Thanks everyone for all your input, it has been a great help !!
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Old 08-09-13, 07:28 AM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by Peiper1 View Post
The overwhelming consensus seems to be the Colnago C59, and Colnago it will be. Going this weekend to order the two bikes. Thanks everyone for all your input, it has been a great help !!

Get ready for the wait if you can't find what you want in stock anywhere.
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Old 08-09-13, 07:47 AM
  #63  
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I saw two C59s in a Seattle bike shop by UW a couple of weeks ago. They were nice.
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Old 08-09-13, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by matthewk459 View Post
Get ready for the wait if you can't find what you want in stock anywhere.
Not a problem, we already know my wife's bike needs to be a custom order due to the small frame size and she also wants a custom paint job, so we are not looking to get the bikes until next April. Until then, our current bikes should still be quite acceptable .
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Old 08-09-13, 08:10 AM
  #65  
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$5900 for a lugged frame weighing 1200 grams? I'll pass.

The appeal here seems to be mostly the cache of the name. IMHO, technology is passing Colonago by, at least on the C59.

For the same money, you can get a lighter, stiffer, more comfortable, and more impact resistent frame, also with an italian name,

or you can get lighter, stiffer, more comfortable, more impact resistent frame, with an american name on it, and save about $3000
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Old 08-09-13, 10:30 AM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
$5900 for a lugged frame weighing 1200 grams? I'll pass.

The appeal here seems to be mostly the cache of the name. IMHO, technology is passing Colonago by, at least on the C59.

For the same money, you can get a lighter, stiffer, more comfortable, and more impact resistent frame, also with an italian name,

or you can get lighter, stiffer, more comfortable, more impact resistent frame, with an american name on it, and save about $3000
Hmmmmmmmm...interesting opinion.

I guess that at the time that you wrote the above, you missed this review:

https://www.bikeradar.com/gear/catego...talia-12-45586

And this review:

https://www.the-bike-expert.com/colnago-c59-disc-review/

Or this review:

https://www.pezcyclingnews.com/page/l...news/?id=87539

Or maybe perhaps you did not have time to read this other review from an actual owner:

https://browse.feedreader.com/c/Orange_Pulp/25445490

Or maybe you did not see the May 2013 article in Road Bike Action magazine comparing the C59, the Storck Aernario and the Carrera Erakle TS. (BTW, the C59 beat out, by a very wide margin, the other two bikes in the article).

In summing up their impressions of the C59, the writers at RBA magazine stated:

Few bikes possess the characteristics that make them comfortable and just downright fun to ride without reducing their capacity for performance. The C59 happens to be one of the few. Yes, the price makes it completely unrealistic for most people, but for those fortunate souls who are seeking a bike in this range, going with anything else just wouldn't make any sense. Not only is the C59 a modern performance-oriented bike, but each frame represents a piece of frame-building technique and history unlike any other in the planet. That the C59 remains one of the few truly Italian-made-frames left is worthy enough of celebration. That the name on the downtube reads Colnago simply puts the bike in a league of its own.

Road Bike Action magazine. May 2013, p. 67

Yep, you must be right. People buy the C59 solely for its name....

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Old 08-09-13, 11:49 AM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
People buy the C59 solely for its name....

Nah, they buy it for the paint job...

I wish I could too...
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Old 08-09-13, 11:54 AM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by gsa103 View Post
Nah, they buy it for the paint job...

I wish I could too...
Your Infinito in Celeste is a very good bike and the paint job is very attractive. (I have one also.)

I bought a C59 with the most boring color scheme (PR 99). But I like the "classic" look.
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Old 08-09-13, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
Your Infinito in Celeste is a very good bike and the paint job is very attractive. (I have one also.)

I bought a C59 with the most boring color scheme (PR 99). But I like the "classic" look.
Oh I completely agree, but a C59 definitely strikes me as an excellent "bucket list" bike.
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Old 08-09-13, 12:43 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by gsa103 View Post
Oh I completely agree, but a C59 definitely strikes me as an excellent "bucket list" bike.
Or a "mid-life crisis" bike.
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Old 08-09-13, 12:46 PM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
Hmmmmmmmm...interesting opinion.

I guess that at the time that you wrote the above, you missed this review:

https://www.bikeradar.com/gear/catego...talia-12-45586

And this review:

https://www.the-bike-expert.com/colnago-c59-disc-review/

Or this review:

https://www.pezcyclingnews.com/page/l...news/?id=87539

Or maybe perhaps you did not have time to read this other review from an actual owner:

https://browse.feedreader.com/c/Orange_Pulp/25445490

Or maybe you did not see the May 2013 article in Road Bike Action magazine comparing the C59, the Storck Aernario and the Carrera Erakle TS. (BTW, the C59 beat out, by a very wide margin, the other two bikes in the article).

In summing up their impressions of the C59, the writers at RBA magazine stated:

Few bikes possess the characteristics that make them comfortable and just downright fun to ride without reducing their capacity for performance. The C59 happens to be one of the few. Yes, the price makes it completely unrealistic for most people, but for those fortunate souls who are seeking a bike in this range, going with anything else just wouldn't make any sense. Not only is the C59 a modern performance-oriented bike, but each frame represents a piece of frame-building technique and history unlike any other in the planet. That the C59 remains one of the few truly Italian-made-frames left is worthy enough of celebration. That the name on the downtube reads Colnago simply puts the bike in a league of its own.

Road Bike Action magazine. May 2013, p. 67

Yep, you must be right. People buy the C59 solely for its name....
You can find positive reviews for any bike, particularly when you include sources that sell the bike they're reviewing, and or take advertising from bike manufacturers.

And if you read the reviews you quote, one of them has the 1200 gram weight figure, I was basing my post on.

1200 grams for a CF frame these days is a boat anchor. I stand by my opinion that I don't get $5900 for dated technology for a heavy frame.


And you do realize the irony of your reliance of a review of actual owner of a C59 to discredit my opinion, that a Wilier Zero 7 is a better option.

Virtually all bike owners , myself included, are going to tell you why their bike is great.

I'm sure the C59 is a fine bike. For $5900 it better be. However, I'm also pretty sure there are a number of other bikes that offer more for the same or less money.

Thus the case for the C59 appears to come down to things like name, looks, italian heritage.

And BTW, other than quoting reviews, you didn't address any of the points I made in my post.
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Old 08-09-13, 12:57 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
You can find positive reviews for any bike, particularly when you include sources that sell the bike they're reviewing, and or take advertising from bike manufacturers.
The May 2013 edition of RBA magazine did not contain a single ad for Colnago. Next theory????


Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
And BTW, other than quoting reviews, you didn't address any of the points I made in my post.
There is no need for me to address your "points." People with far greater expertise have already discussed the merits of the C59. Your points, such as they are, are quite irrelevant.

You are just a guy who: (1) hates losing arguments, (2) is trying to make a case for your bike of choice, and (3) must always have the last word.

I can understand #2 ; but I have no patience (or use) with #'s 1 and 3.

I prefer to be riding my bikes than writing about them.
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Old 08-09-13, 01:04 PM
  #73  
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Hmm. ALways thought the Colnage C59 was in the $15k upward range... At 5900 bucks I would think it doesnt compare to a dogma which is $10k +.. (to my knowledge I've only seen Dogma think 2s at 13 grand a piece)
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Old 08-09-13, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
The May 2013 edition of RBA magazine did not contain a single ad for Colnago. Next theory????
Seriously, Road Bike Action is the gold standard?

Have you ever read a negative review in RBA?




Originally Posted by eja_ bottecchia View Post
There is no need for me to address your "points." People with far greater expertise have already discussed the merits of the C59. Your points, such as they are, are quite irrelevant.

You are just a guy who: (1) hates losing arguments, (2) is trying to make a case for your bike of choice, and (3) must always have the last word.

I can understand #2 ; but I have no patience (or use) with #'s 1 and 3.

I prefer to be riding my bikes than writing about them.
I don't see any answer in a cursory review of those links that addresses the point of why one would buy a 1200 gram today, given that it's a pound heavier than the high end standard today.

And as to the point of dated technology, the only real justification of the lugged construction is that it allows custom sizing, which would be a point for a custom sized C59.

As for justifying my own bike purchase, I'll own that, I think a Wilier Trestina Zero 7 is a better choice, for multiple reasons. However, I also think a Canondale EVO, several Cervelos, Scotts, Specialized and Treks are better choices as well.

On objective terms, I don't get the C59 today, and nothing in any of those articles makes a case for it, other than aesthetics, italian craftmanship heritage, etc.

Which are all fine reasons if they matter to you. My point is that there are objectively better performing bikes that utilize newer technology, which in my opinion are better choices. You obviously have a different opinion to which you're entitled, but you haven't given us any basis upon which to evaluate that opinion, other than appeal to the authority of Road Bike Action.

Finally, the "last word argument" is inherently argumentative. By asserting I have to have the last word, you create a catch 22; you can say whatever you want, and I have to leave it unrebutted, or I'm gulity of having to have the last word. Thus by raising the isssue, you yourself are angling to have " the last word."
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Old 08-09-13, 01:12 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by lsberrios1 View Post
Hmm. ALways thought the Colnage C59 was in the $15k upward range... At 5900 bucks I would think it doesnt compare to a dogma which is $10k +.. (to my knowledge I've only seen Dogma think 2s at 13 grand a piece)
$5900 for the frame.
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