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Issues - Compact Crank on a FREEWHEEL Ultra7?

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Issues - Compact Crank on a FREEWHEEL Ultra7?

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Old 07-07-05 | 11:19 AM
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Issues - Compact Crank on a FREEWHEEL Ultra7?

apologies if this isn;t the right forum...

age and what seems to be massive geologic uplifting of the hills and mountains around here necessitate some smaller gearing. I'm a bit of a retro-grouch cause everything I own is at least 15 yrs old or more.
My 'go-to' machina is a std crankset (52-44) and Ultra 7 freewheel (13-21) 126 rearend.
I have too much stuff to change everything on this machine, I have too little DOSH to get another machina.
A 'varied' ride in my area will take me for miles of rolling terrain with small climbs and up 7-8 miles of continuous climbing in the 9% to 13% range and an equal amount of descending... (Santa Barbara County CA)
Which means I need a good gear mix in the high 70s to low 90s, and now also good mix in the low 60s to 40s.
A Compact Double - 50-34, seems the real solution. No desire to go triple. My current crank is Campy SR .
SO
*** My 1st 'Q' - what considerations should I give in putting a Compact crank to my older Ultra Freewheel based machine.***

No, I won't be spreadin the rear triangles, no new wheelz (meaning cassette), prolly stay with the 13-21 freewheel for now. BB shell is 68 Eng. Front and rear derailleurs are Shimano Indexed stuff of uncertain vintage.
I have a nice Campy BB (SR) that is just about broken-in.

*** Q2 - Are there Compact Cranks that will fit this square taper axle?***

Otherwise a good value Compact crank and maybe ISIS BB recommendation is appreciated.
I'm an olde pharte, but well seasoned in the art of sufferin, so the mid to low 40s is about the bottom I need to hit.
Thanks for any thoughts/comments/recommendations.
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Old 07-07-05 | 12:30 PM
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Stronglight are a good brand to have on old-school bikes.
The Impact uses a standard 110 BCD. The Escapade uses a smaller one and works as a double or triple down to 28t.
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Old 07-07-05 | 03:16 PM
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Bikes: Early 1980's Ishiwata 022 steel sport/touring, 1986 Vitus 979, 1988 DiamondBack Apex, 1997 Softride PowerWing 700, 2001 Trek OCLV 110

If you really want to go compact on the cheap, you could look at picking up an old MTB crankset. That's what I did with my old 6-speed bike. I used an old Deore crankset with 110mm/74mm BCD, took off the granny ring and removed the 5 3mm spacers that were between the granny and the crank. The Deore originally took a 122m BB axle, but without the granny and spacers, it fits perfect on my Dura-ace 112mm BB. Shimano cranks shouldn't be put on Campy BBs though since the axle tapers don't match. For most stuff, I use a 13-21 FW but change to 13-23 for stuff >~12%.

edit: Another option is a new freewheel - I just found out that Shimano now makes the 7-speed FW in 11-28! https://harriscyclery.net/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=1724

Last edited by Gonzo Bob; 07-07-05 at 03:23 PM.
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Old 07-07-05 | 04:51 PM
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You'll probably want to get a Campy crank to fit onto your Campy bottom bracket.
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Old 07-07-05 | 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
You'll probably want to get a Campy crank to fit onto your Campy bottom bracket.
Even at that it's not a given the spindle length will be correct.
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Old 07-07-05 | 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by sydney
Even at that it's not a given the spindle length will be correct.
This is precisely the problem I have had swapping older cranks and BBs. Older Campag. cranks took asymmetrical spindles and were pretty much interchangeable with Stronglights, Ofmegas, TAs, etc. In the late 1980s (help me with the date, Sydney or anyone else), Campag. went to symmetrical spindles and a change in the right crank design, rendering new Campag. cranks incompatible with old spindles. (I played around briefly with putting an early 1990s Veloce crankset on the old Nervar Star BB on my Capo, and the new Campag. crank sat just about far enough outboard to accommodate a third chainring.)
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Old 07-07-05 | 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by John E
This is precisely the problem I have had swapping older cranks and BBs. Older Campag. cranks took asymmetrical spindles and were pretty much interchangeable with Stronglights, Ofmegas, TAs, etc. In the late 1980s (help me with the date, Sydney or anyone else), Campag. went to symmetrical spindles and a change in the right crank design, rendering new Campag. cranks incompatible with old spindles...
I suspected as much...

Then the only other real option is to go with a crankset/BB combo.
Another consideration is chainring 'spread'. An Ultra 7 is prolly set with more distance between cogs than the newer 8-9-10 spd cassettes (assumption...) and now that I'm on my last Sedis Sport chain from the stockpile I put away over 12 years ago, I'll be needing to buy a new chain.
I'm clueless as to what chain will work with freewheels and still shift okay on the front, if that might be a consideration.
Might I have to 'shim' one of the front rings to make the 'compact crank' compatible with the older cog spacing? What chain might give the best opportunity to make this all work?
More recommendations are really welcome here.

20 years ago I was on top of the tech side of cycling. Now I feel like a 'vacum tube' engineer in the age of nanoprocessors.

I'm not hanging onto the old steed cause itz so 'special', or as some statement of 'retro' or individuality.
I'm staying with the 'not-so-old' machine cause it fits me purrfect, is a joy to ride and offers no real reason for me to abandon it. It has served flawlessly for 12+ years (4 of which I didn't do any cycling at all). So flawlessly that aside from a new freewheel, a few cables, a few chains from my stockpile, and regular new rubber, I've not had to pay any attention to replacing parts. Its reliability is probably the reason I've not even looked at newer tech stuff.
Anyway, I need to get the lower gearing and the 'compact' - 50/34 gearing spread is exactly what I need. I imagine I'll eventually break down and retire the Campy LF hubs, spread the rear (of the bike) and get a new wheelset or 2, but that'll be hard to do. I may not go up hills like I used to, but I almost never lose a coasting contest on those wheels.

Help me Obi Wan, you're my only hope
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Old 07-07-05 | 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by cyclezen
I suspected as much...

Then the only other real option is to go with a crankset/BB combo.
Another consideration is chainring 'spread'. An Ultra 7 is prolly set with more distance between cogs than the newer 8-9-10 spd cassettes (assumption...) and now that I'm on my last Sedis Sport chain from the stockpile I put away over 12 years ago, I'll be needing to buy a new chain.
I'm clueless as to what chain will work with freewheels and still shift okay on the front, if that might be a consideration.
Might I have to 'shim' one of the front rings to make the 'compact crank' compatible with the older cog spacing? What chain might give the best opportunity to make this all work?
More recommendations are really welcome here.

20 years ago I was on top of the tech side of cycling. Now I feel like a 'vacum tube' engineer in the age of nanoprocessors.

I'm not hanging onto the old steed cause itz so 'special', or as some statement of 'retro' or individuality.
I'm staying with the 'not-so-old' machine cause it fits me purrfect, is a joy to ride and offers no real reason for me to abandon it. It has served flawlessly for 12+ years (4 of which I didn't do any cycling at all). So flawlessly that aside from a new freewheel, a few cables, a few chains from my stockpile, and regular new rubber, I've not had to pay any attention to replacing parts. Its reliability is probably the reason I've not even looked at newer tech stuff.
Anyway, I need to get the lower gearing and the 'compact' - 50/34 gearing spread is exactly what I need. I imagine I'll eventually break down and retire the Campy LF hubs, spread the rear (of the bike) and get a new wheelset or 2, but that'll be hard to do. I may not go up hills like I used to, but I almost never lose a coasting contest on those wheels.

Help me Obi Wan, you're my only hope
Just use a sram 8 speed chain, with the new crankset. You are overthinking the whole thing.
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Old 07-08-05 | 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by sydney
Just use a sram 8 speed chain, with the new crankset. You are overthinking the whole thing.
Yeah, and I've always been an over-torquer also

Thanks, I'll get the SRAM chain and new 15 & 16 cogs for the freewheel
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Old 07-08-05 | 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by cyclezen
Yeah, and I've always been an over-torquer also
Try this: www.sheldonbrown.com/tork-grip
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Old 07-11-05 | 06:29 PM
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I needed lower gears on my old road steed ,especialy after I crashed & snapped the hip-joint off my femur.The bike had a 6 speed screw-on f/wheel 23-13 ,to cut a long story short I changed it out for a 7 speed s/on f/wheel but a city /mountain bike version, a 28-14 & with the 52-42 c/rings on the front it made a big differance, the rear mech. handles it ok but you have to get the chain length right !
I can get up all the hills ok with these ratio,s ,My next mission will be to change the 42t inner ring for a 39t. to make those hills a little less steeper on the bad days
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