AzTallRider

Thanks for sharing that, Cleave.

Cleave

I'll be there to document it with photos.

Cleave

A few more photos of Endeavour:





I didn't know that NASA had F-18 chase planes:

https://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/n...-006-DFRC.html

sarals 

I missed the flyover here (it flew over the Monterey Bay Aquarium). Why?? I was on my bike on a back road doing some climbing. Priorities (yes, that's it!)....

Hermes

Here is some highlight action from pre-nationals racing at the Velo Sports Center Saturday night.

shovelhd

The event with the large field on the track, was that a miss and out?

nacler22

52 today.

Time for bed.

Night ya'll.

Hermes

I know they raced a Miss N Out so it could have been. I was not there.

Racer Ex 

Cleave, those are really quality shots. Congrats on the new bike, let's keep in touch on set up.

Been following the discourse on "white bike" incidents. I've come to cycling from two sports where death is part and parcel of what you accept going in. What bothers me about these occurrences is how avoidable they would be in so many cases if we stopped treating motor vehicles with the casualness that we treat our dishwashers (I'm speaking as a society, not as individuals).

It makes my head explode when cell phone trade groups lobby against things as stupidly obvious as "no texting while driving" and "hands free" laws. Or am I just crazy in thinking you should pay some attention to shooting a ton of potential mayhem down a street?

But Corporations are "people". And so it goes.

shovelhd

Ex, I think it's deeper than that. You can rail all you want about corporations but it all comes down to the people. While some car-bike accidents are due to rider idiocy or that the driver truly, really didn't see the rider, let's face it, the ones we live to tell about are blatant, in your face, "I don't give a **** about you and your stupid bike that belongs on the sidewalk out of my ******* way" situations. Drivers either not caring or just totally misjudging the riders speed while staring right at them. Gotta beat you to the Dunkin' Donuts entrance so they can be next in line for their 600 calorie Coolata. The very same people that would fall all over themselves to rescue a puppy or send anonymous donations to the family whose house burned down. We are just an obstacle getting in the way of their lives.

This is why I bought a Contour. I'm still trying to figure out the best way to mount it.

Racer Ex 

No doubt. But put them together in a group where they can dodge individually accountability and you get lobbying against society's best interests and profits put above the greater good. For years the tobacco companies lied under oath about the health risks of their product when they knew better. Any of those folks go to jail for perjury?

They set the tone, manipulate public opinion, and often stand in the way of progress. History has shown that once you get over that hump, you can actually make improvements in overall behavoir. MADD is a great example. Eventually they overcame liquor companies lobbying against stricter DUI laws, sales, server responsibility and the like, and as a result we've made a lot of progress in changing driving drunk from a joke (I grew up in those days) to something that is taken seriously. There will always be drunk drivers but the numbers are way down and most responsible people are going to hand their keys over.

It would be the same if we took driving a bit more seriously and didn't pass off running over people as a big "whoopsie". This actually works in other places BTW. But try to pass any law saying it's not OK to comb your hair and do your makeup while driving and Revlon will dump millions in Congress's pockets to stop it.

The list of malfeasance and lobbying against people's safety is really stupendously long and their influence on what's supposed to be a democratic process far too great at this point in time. And too often the result of their bad judgements or simple greed ends up coming out of my pocket in the form of bailouts. And I say this as a 1.5-2% guy who got a tax break. If the "free market" solved everything then Somalia should be heaven on earth and Libya an economic superpower, because there's no government interference in much of anything in those places at the moment.

P & R, I know. I'll shut up comrades.

nacler22

Sorry Racer Ex, but this won't fly in P&R.

It's dispassionate, succinct, and factual.

And correct.

shovelhd

Correct within context.

I won't go all P&R here. Ex and I are on opposite sides here and there's no need to debate. I'll just throw out a few comments.

The tobacco companies were sued into submission and lost, after all their lies and deceit and perjury. They paid gazillions of dollars to line politician's and attorney's pockets as well as fund smoking cessation programs. They had to fundamentally change their business model by diversification in order to survive. I'm not saying that's right or wrong, bad or good, it's just a fact.

MADD has gotten quite active around here lately since the casino bill has passed. There will be up to three new casinos in MA alone within the next 5 years. We all know how casinos like to give away liquor. To counter this, the restaurant associations have banded together to try and repeal the happy hour law. You can't have a traditional happy hour in MA. You can give away food, but not liquor. If you have a liquor special, it cannot be for certain hours of the day, it has to be all day. This is troubling. What is equally troubling is the cavalier attitude that the state judiciary has concerning drunk driving. It is not unusual at all here to have guys that were convicted for DUI several times out driving around. I know, I was on a jury that put a guy in jail for 6 months after his *fifth* DUI *conviction*. Why should anyone get five chances to kill someone?

Back on topic. We have to be diligent at all times. They hate us out there.

Racer Ex 

Well, not really. Their business model (at least RJR's) has stayed tobacco based, though they've had to stop giving out free cigs to kids. They agreed to a master settlement with states where they paid into a trust fund to obtain protection from individual lawsuits. Collectively (all the companies that were sued) they paid $12b into the fund.

To put that number in perspective RJR, just one of the signatories to the agreement paid $53m as a golden handshake to a CEO. They had to pay $20m for violating the agreement above and they had to reimburse the Canucks for $1.2b in unpaid taxes from black market sales.

With all this they've been consistently profitable. And have issued a nice dividend to their stock holders.

I want me some submission

nacler22

Thanks for correcting my "correct" comment.

Hey, it's a great day to practice falling off my bike. Think I'll suit up and slip out.

shovelhd

They diversified heavily into food products companies while the lawsuit was in court. They don't grow food, so this was diversification. Unless you consider tobacco food, which I did once as a kid. It wasn't pretty.

AzTallRider

Ex, I had no idea we had such a similar perspective. Won't even try to add to it...

Cleave

I should have been there since the race sponsor is our club's primary sponsor, but I had personal stuff to do after spending the day riding with my club and doing a highway cleanup in the afternoon. I heard the concurrent fixie show went over really well. Must have been a colorful crowd there.

Thanks for the kind words on the photos. I will definitely let you know when the Shiv arrives. I haven't gotten a shipping email yet from the seller.

As I've mentioned elsewhere and without turning this into a big A&S thing, our country (and many others) has basically redesigned our cities and suburban communities to be car centric. The conspiracy theory is that the car companies have been a major force behind this since the end of WWII. (The theory may be correct.) You can certainly see how residential arterial roads in SoCal look like freeways with stop lights on them. It's no wonder many drivers think that cyclists and pedestrians shouldn't be on "their" roads. Basically we need to get people to drive slower when they aren't on a major highway so that all of us can co-exist on the roads better.

We have to do a lot of self-reflecting and take a lot of action to make our communities more liveable and much less car centric. There is a significant positive feedback cycle for our society (economy, health, and environment) if we can make those changes.

For reference, I say this through the perspective of my dirty little secret -- I am a major motorsports fan. I have been since elementary school and I used to work on cars with my Dad all of the time. I've had some anti-Prius cars in my life. A major reason for me getting into bicycle racing was that I couldn't afford a go kart. So believe me, I'm not anti-car but I am planning on being a big part of the movement to make our communities more liveable after I retire. Enough on that topic in this sub-forum.

Racer Ex 

Spun off all the food products (Nabisco) back in 99. Actually inherited some of the stock. Sold it.

I own some energy stuff though. Every time it goes up I drive my Prius to Whole Foods and buy some more organic produce. Then I laugh at the hippies.

I'm one conflicted dude.


Much less on the urban planning front but they (along with the oil companies) were a force behind dismantling a huge amount of "people moving" rail lines. California certainly is a good example where they bought up virtually all the light rail in the SF Bay Area.

And FWIW I raced motorcycles pro and am for a long time. I was pissed when Chevron bulldozed OMS to build houses. I'm not sure, but I think the Ontario crit course might be on part of the old speedway.

Like I said, conflicted.

shovelhd

Me too. Gotta hedge your bets.

I've been a NASCAR fan since I was a little boy watching it with my Dad. I don't like the current version, though.

Racer Ex 

Busy day. Walked the dogs, MTB ride, shopping, cleaned the house, laundry. Need a nap. Pork chop marinating. Having that with some left over risotto and a salad.

ericm979

Packing for the Everest Challenge. I have two big bags of cycling clothes and one small bag of real clothes.

sarals 

Me, either...

sarals 

Formula 1. They're like Elton John, they turn both ways.

I miss Ayrton Senna.

sarals 

I start my seven day/night work shifts tomorrow. I'm deep into the process of psyching myself up (or out) for the FTP test on Tuesday. I'm up to second guessing the road I want to use. Stop that, Sara. Just go RIDE....