mconlonx

Parents should be held responsible for the actions of their minor offspring, but aren't; this is another step removed from that.

Digital_Cowboy

I agree, even if ones state doesn't, then at the very least they need to enlist the family members doctor.

Digital_Cowboy

Marc,

Instead of "hoping" that she fails her next test, and being as she can't admit to herself that she can no longer safely drive. Why haven't you and the rest of the family say her down and tell her that she can't drive?

What if while your waiting for her to be retested and "hoping" that she fails. She hits and kills someone, how would you feel then?

Isn't it better as her family to take her keys? Rather then wait and "hope" that she fails her next test?

This is also as others have said EVERYONE should retested more frequently than they currently are.

Digital_Cowboy

Wasn't there a time when that was true, i.e. a parent WAS responsible for their children's actions.

mprelaw

There's a distinction between criminal and civil liability. Parents can be held civilly responsible for their children's actions in many states. Your car insurance rates will likely at least triple if you add a teenaged boy to your policy. Vicarious liability is widespread in tort law. Rental companies won't rent a car to a driver under 25, in most situations.

As far as elderly drivers go, re-testing after a certain age (let's pick 75, arbitrarily) should be mandatory. Airline pilots are forced into retirement at age 60, I believe. I don't think there has been any change, although I could be mistaken. This is an archaic holdover from days where the average life expectancy for a male was 62. Most of them are in excellent health. They're thoroughly re-tested, for both flying skill and medically, every 6 months. Yet the FAA says that at 61 they're too old to be trusted flying passengers on the ATP ticket. I'm closing in on 60, and I have absolutely no problem advocating re-testing for elderly drivers.

SlowNeasy

Wouldn't that be great. Had I lived in Ca. instead of Fl. Had I known the middle aged ladies name the other day while driving wondered over into my lane and back into her's several times,while aparently texting or reading something on the seat beside her as she drove (till I "beeped" my horn) . I could have just called in and had her retested?

Does Cal. have a test for stupid ?

telkanuru

Yes, but it doesn't work the way you think.

downtube42

I took my mom's car and keys away, probably two years later than I should have. That accelerated her physical and mental decline, and probably shortened her life by 5 years. Or may have prolonger her life and the lives of others; I'll never know. I wish the BMV had revoked her privilege to drive, but it was clear that wasn't going to happen. It was the right decision, but it would be foolish to think you can take a person's car away without impacting their life.

It's short-sighted to think of the elderly as "them". They are us, just a bit further down the road. If you want to face this issue with honesty and integrity, first face it with yourself. My observation is that those who are disdainful of the elderly become the elderly who are disdainful of the young. Meaning, if you don't give a crap about some blue-hair today, you probably aren't going to give a crap about some blue-haired kid when you're old, and you aren't going to give up your keys without a fight.

B. Carfree

When I checked a couple years ago OR had a similar policy. Unfortunately, one could not register a complaint about an incompetent driver over the phone or online; it had to be done by coming into the DMV and filling out a form. I didn't ask specifically, but the process appeared to not be anonymous (which I agree with). They said that it would be sufficient to have the plate number and a description of the driver, which is good because if one needs any more than that the only people who could get an incompetent driver off the road would be his/her friends and relatives.

Nowadays, it is difficult to tell if a motorist has lost physical ability to control his/her car or if it is weaving all over the road because the driver is too stupid to stop playing with some toy while driving. Self-driving cars really can't come to market soon enough for me.

Digital_Cowboy

I never said that it would be easy. And sadly not only the lack of affordable public transportation but the way that so many US cities are so spread out, doesn't make it any easier.

Just that sooner or later and for whatever reason, be it age, physical or mental/emotional health we all will become a danger not only ourselves but to others. Hopefully we'll have family members who are willing to make the tough decision to stop us before we either hurt ourselves or someone else.

I'm sorry about your mother, but I think that you also need to ask yourself how many innocent lives do you think you saved by taking her keys? And again if our cities weren't so spread out, and we had better and more affordable public transportation options then it wouldn't be that big a problem to take someone's keys.

Bekologist

I bet a lot of places like the greater Tampa area are decidedly unfriendly for most seniors to do anything BUT drive well past being fit to do so.

What could shift seniors out of their cars would be a change in urban density, infrastructure design and transportation patterns in order to facilitate a car-lite life for seniors.

maddyfish

For me a test every 2/4 years, including written, driving and eye test, would do the trick.

GraysonPeddie

I really do not seem to have patience with seeing driverless cars coming into market.

I talked to my mom and she said that I can take her keys for the car when she turns 80. My mom's feelings were not hurt and she thanked me for thinking about it as I've read the thread. That's about 30 years down the road, though.

But by that time, there will be driverless cars and I'm hoping that there will be a change in urban density.

I-Like-To-Bike

She may change her mind in 30 years and she may not be thanking you if you confiscate her keys over her objections.

GraysonPeddie

Well, my mom wants me to do so.

Education and knowledge is power and she knows that.

I-Like-To-Bike

At 80 (and other ages as well), possibly alone and without other means of transportation, control of car keys can be power too.

mtbikerinpa

The doctor is not always a given. When my 94 yr old great grandmother couldn't lift her feet, walk significantly, broke her hip twice, and stated directly that she didn't care if she died while driving, and hit the cinder block house twice, went to the doctor for an evaluation...

He said he couldn't bring himself to taking her medical clearance because it would be too mean. I do not know who the doctor was, but apparently bedside manner overcame logic/objectiveness. We ended up taking the keys and buying the truck from her. It did not hurt her psyche since she barely drove 10 miles in a week and we were already driving her places anyway.

B. Carfree

If we build to true high density, the test is whether the roadways are substantially closed to cars, then I agree that such a change could make it easier for seniors and others to live car free. If we're talking about the typical medium density that gets built in the name of densification, then I strongly disagree. A simple doubling of residential density in an urban area results in a 1.95-fold increase in car density and that is a step backwards. No one increases the amount of walking they do when the traffic density is increasing. Unfortunately, in these low-tax times, it is a lot easier to just allow developers to take the half-step that increases car density and then we make it even worse by failing to improve (or even build at all, in some cases) public transit.

I actually think what will have the greatest impact on getting seniors out of cars will be cohort replacement in about forty years. The current crop of old folks brought us the car-dependent mentality and the current crop of youngsters are leading us away from that. I think something like 20% of all 25-year-olds have chosen to not have a driver's license. Hopefully between now and then the boomers will largely side with the youngsters. We are alleged to have never grown up, so that should come naturally.

I-Like-To-Bike

Chosen? Any reliable source for your "thinking" on this 20% tidbit?

Digital_Cowboy

I can't help but wonder how he'd feel, if because he didn't medically disqualify someone from driving he gets named in a wrongful death lawsuit? As somehow, I seriously doubt that his malpractice insurance would cover such a lawsuit.

unterhausen

my father gave up driving voluntarily when he rear-ended someone at a traffic light. Unfortunately, later when he started suffering from severe dementia, he really wanted his license back. Of course, this was a bit of a joke since he couldn't even drive his electric wheelchair around the block without getting it stuck.

I see this as a subject that should be relatively non-controversial. I don't see it as unfair that we require people to be competent to operate a vehicle. When I see an elderly person driving inappropriately slowly down the road, I think that police should be able to call them in and force an exam. My understanding is that most older people still drive after they realize their competence to do so has evaporated. They generally only drive to very few destinations, and hope for the best. It seems to me that most of them are probably spending more on their car than they would on taxis to go to the same places.

B. Carfree

Here you go, Sweetie: https://transportationnation.org/2012...inues-to-drop/

The trend is rather interesting as all young people are either delaying or foregoing driver's licenses relative to "former young people".

Digital_Cowboy

I agree, and given that driving is privilege and NOT a right, it should be an easy matter to remove someone's driving privilege. And I agree that they're probably are spending more to have a car than they would one either a cab or other form of public transportation.

Bekologist

you consider 'cohort replacement' a better strategy than urban design for the quandry of seniors unfit to drive.

another cup of tea, perhaps?

American investment in infrastructure and public transportation as a proportion of domestic spending ranks LAST among developed countries..... maybe there are some greater structural issues the USA needs to face up to as the third most populous country in the world, eh?

Places like Tampa need to work on densification, infrastructure, land zoning and transportation schemes that support seniors living car free lifestyles. suggesting 'cohort replacement' is enough of a strategy falls far short, and is a very cloudy cup of tea.

Bekologist

10 percent of all German seniors bicycle regularly.

I wonder what stops seniors in Tampa from biking to the store and doctors office?