Design for Building Frame
04-17-24, 07:38 PM
#26
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Dave Levy has been making custom bikes for a LONG time (35 years?) and will be able to coach you through the design process to fit oddly dimensioned bodies.
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05-17-24, 08:58 AM
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I also use BikeCad. I will again suggest that the design method the OP starts playing with might be best if it is the same as what the class/instructor will use. less translation or getting up to speed when taking the class.
As to books- I can't say there's even one or two that offer a thorough and overall view of geometry for a wide range of bike types and intended use, or at least among those I've looked at. Here's a few that I have used in the past: The Paterek Manual, Touring Bikes (Tony Oliver), Bicycle Design (Hadland and Lessing), Bicycle Science (Wilson) and the CONI manual. There are others but these are what I have on my shelf. Most don't go into much depth about steering geometry however Bicycling Science is, perhaps, the most in depth here and has Jim Papadopoulos contributing (for those who don't know of Jim P he's, perhaps, the most knowledgeable person about the relationships between angles, diameters, and rakes/trail alive today. Do know that predicting the actual handling manor of a bike is hard to do for at least one reason, the rider's body and brain vary from rider to rider and even day to day. Andy
An interesting read but of little real world value is the Scientific American article on the unrideable bike. Andy
As to books- I can't say there's even one or two that offer a thorough and overall view of geometry for a wide range of bike types and intended use, or at least among those I've looked at. Here's a few that I have used in the past: The Paterek Manual, Touring Bikes (Tony Oliver), Bicycle Design (Hadland and Lessing), Bicycle Science (Wilson) and the CONI manual. There are others but these are what I have on my shelf. Most don't go into much depth about steering geometry however Bicycling Science is, perhaps, the most in depth here and has Jim Papadopoulos contributing (for those who don't know of Jim P he's, perhaps, the most knowledgeable person about the relationships between angles, diameters, and rakes/trail alive today. Do know that predicting the actual handling manor of a bike is hard to do for at least one reason, the rider's body and brain vary from rider to rider and even day to day. Andy
An interesting read but of little real world value is the Scientific American article on the unrideable bike. Andy
https://ruina.tam.cornell.edu/research/topics/bicycle_mechanics/Pap&Olson88biketech.pdf
https://ruina.tam.cornell.edu/research/topics/bicycle_mechanics/papers.html
A bit hard to find as a lot of his work predates the interwebs and there is a lot of clutter from marketing type tech blogs.
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Cheers, Mike
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05-17-24, 10:33 AM
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Being the age I am I still have a lot of paper books and have been drawn to the engineering side of things so I have a few publications with Jim P's writing on my shelf. IIRC it was in the earlier 1980s that I first heard of him (and I was trying to better understand bicycle steering/stability to have a more formulaic approach to steering geometry decisions). I had a subscription to BikeTech too and remember the shift in content and such before it went belly up (as I knew of). It was too bad as the earlier version had some pretty cool articles. Andy
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05-17-24, 03:23 PM
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I'm not sure you're going to learn much from Jim Papadopoulos about standard usable upright bike design. His work was pretty interesting. Most of it was done in an era where research didn't have to make money
05-17-24, 03:33 PM
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Well, if the research doesn't have to make money, it can probably be trusted. I've only started reading it, and it is definitely interesting.
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05-17-24, 06:36 PM
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I really don't think funded research is usually* an issue because most academic researchers are reasonably ethical, but it certainly makes me jealous if someone figures out how to work on bikes. I tried to talk one of my bosses into opening a center for bicycle research so we could legally park our bikes in the lab.
*there are many counter-examples, but they get caught by their peers eventually.
*there are many counter-examples, but they get caught by their peers eventually.
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05-17-24, 06:40 PM
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