After 15 years, I"m done buying Trek bikes...
07-31-10, 12:14 AM
#126
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Or an over-torqued front derailleur that has cracked the tube. Or a simple paint defect he never noticed before.
07-31-10, 12:24 AM
#127
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Thats not the OP's bike, its someone elses.
07-31-10, 12:40 AM
#129
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How come a Ti bike is a wall trophy? It looks like unpainted pipes welded together. Most Ti bikes get ridden hard in the worst weather. Mine does. I know about 10 more that are.
07-31-10, 01:07 AM
#130
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Everyone has their horror story about any car company.
07-31-10, 01:08 AM
#131
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My Mitsubishi Lancer needed a new mass air sensor at 80k. The gas gauge stopped working last Summer at ~130k. No big deal, I'll go by mileage. A few months later, the horn decides to stop working intermittently and the mechanics can't find a problem. Earlier this year, the warm-up cat and its 02 sensor went out, $1500 to repair or it won't pass smog. I'm not very hard on cars, either, having gotten over 150k out of a Ford Taurus before I sold it with no major repairs.
I used to be with you on the Japanese thing, and was in awe on how many miles friends got out of Toyotas... until that brake debacle.
As for the OP, I don't blame you for trying. You understand they don't have to do anything, but you're disappointed in the product and will shop elsewhere in the future. I think many products don't have warranties that are too short for the price of the product, and I try to find alternatives, and try to convince the manufacturer to be more lenient if I can't. Plus, there are ways around the red tape that manufacturers are aware of and ok with, if you are willing to be creative. Too many years working retail taught me that.
I used to be with you on the Japanese thing, and was in awe on how many miles friends got out of Toyotas... until that brake debacle.
As for the OP, I don't blame you for trying. You understand they don't have to do anything, but you're disappointed in the product and will shop elsewhere in the future. I think many products don't have warranties that are too short for the price of the product, and I try to find alternatives, and try to convince the manufacturer to be more lenient if I can't. Plus, there are ways around the red tape that manufacturers are aware of and ok with, if you are willing to be creative. Too many years working retail taught me that.
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It's like riding a bicycle
It's like riding a bicycle
07-31-10, 01:27 AM
#132
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^^^ The record holder for car longevity is still a Mercedes diesel 2.8 million miles for a 240D used as a taxi. Mitsubishis are on the lower end of Japanese cars in terms of longevity. Just test drove a VW TDI today with 360K mikes. Window regulator and sunroof work. The crucial things like compression and the injector pressure was still within specs (I am assuming my scan tool is accurate). I am a diesel nut and would like to not own gassers by the the next election year.
To the OP. Nothing wrong with changing brands. I wonder though what would happen if that was a Pinna or Colnago
To the OP. Nothing wrong with changing brands. I wonder though what would happen if that was a Pinna or Colnago
07-31-10, 03:19 AM
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But seriously, that is a terrible deal about Trek. I never bought any anyways, nor will I ever. Lately I cringe when my friends come in on their Treks and talk about lance and whatnot. That's why I have a Bianchi!!!!!
07-31-10, 04:14 AM
#134
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One of the guys in the shop had a Madone, and the decals were almost all off within a year. They are just stuck on, no clear coat. He didn't care. Most of us don't give a crap about looks, only how the bike rides. But that's not for everyone. If you are really hung up on looks, possibly this is not your cup of tea. From my end, I am real clear with customers about this.
Did the OP get a Signature Series Madone? He's not clear on that. Don't get a "regular" P1 mixed up with a Signature Series Madone.
Last edited by roadwarrior; 07-31-10 at 05:31 AM.
07-31-10, 04:18 AM
#135
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Smart? Here's some advice, if you expect something out of the norm, get it in writing. Sorry, but smart is knowing what you are getting into and if you expect somethign more than what is in writing, then that aint smart. 
If the Project One was any different than the off the shelf 6.9, it would have been in writing, but it's not.
If the Project One was any different than the off the shelf 6.9, it would have been in writing, but it's not.
BTW...while I have not checked recently, Trek stopped taking P1 orders they were so backlogged. And in 2011 they are reducing the color offerings. Signature will still be available.
07-31-10, 04:22 AM
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No sh**. Of course the cracks can be prevented. But not with the paint that Trek decided to use, which is a lightweight, minimalistic formulation. They, of course, choose the lightweight, minimalistic paint to satisfy the requirements that this bike be a lightweight, minimalistic racing frame. It's not intended to be a wall trophy. Want a wall trophy? Go Ti or get a paintjob by a guy who specializes in wall trophy paintjobs.
It boggles my mind that people buy a bike with an expressed limited warranty (or an explicit lack of warranty) and then call and expect Trek to make a "special exception" for them.
It boggles my mind that people buy a bike with an expressed limited warranty (or an explicit lack of warranty) and then call and expect Trek to make a "special exception" for them.
Well said.
07-31-10, 04:37 AM
#139
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BTW...we have four Cervelos in the shop for repair. All of them have wear and tear damaged paint coatings. None of the riders care. There is a cost associated with weight reduction. They understand this.
Shocking, I know.
Shocking, I know.
07-31-10, 05:15 AM
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Last edited by WHOOOSSHHH...; 07-31-10 at 05:30 AM.
07-31-10, 05:30 AM
#141
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^^^ The record holder for car longevity is still a Mercedes diesel 2.8 million miles for a 240D used as a taxi. Mitsubishis are on the lower end of Japanese cars in terms of longevity. Just test drove a VW TDI today with 360K mikes. Window regulator and sunroof work. The crucial things like compression and the injector pressure was still within specs (I am assuming my scan tool is accurate). I am a diesel nut and would like to not own gassers by the the next election year.
To the OP. Nothing wrong with changing brands. I wonder though what would happen if that was a Pinna or Colnago
To the OP. Nothing wrong with changing brands. I wonder though what would happen if that was a Pinna or Colnago
Pinarello is three years if you register the bike within 10 days of purchase, 2 years if you don't.
A shop I looked at talked about Colnago and it maybe taking 12 weeks to sort out a warranty issue.
FWIW...if you want to ride the pro stuff, realize that the pros do not ride these bikes forever. that's who they are made for.
07-31-10, 05:42 AM
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07-31-10, 06:06 AM
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condescension is probably the best way to get your point across. i wholeheartedly agree.
07-31-10, 06:25 AM
#145
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So let me see if I have this straight.
You've been happy with Trek for 15 years and 10 bikes. This might translate into 45,000 to 60,000 miles.
1998? happy.
2003? happy.
2008? happy.
oh no. crack in paint. Not related to parts, ride quality or SAFETY.
In fact, still ridable.
Now you want to begin a relationship or become comfortable with another bike line.
I own 5 bikes.
Trek 830 mountain bike.
Redline Conquest Pro crossbike
Steelman road bike
Lightspeed Ultimate road bike
Scott CR-1 road bike.
I love all of them, and they all serve a purpose....
but I never ever thought of only buying from one bicycle manufacturer.
You've been happy with Trek for 15 years and 10 bikes. This might translate into 45,000 to 60,000 miles.
1998? happy.
2003? happy.
2008? happy.
oh no. crack in paint. Not related to parts, ride quality or SAFETY.
In fact, still ridable.
Now you want to begin a relationship or become comfortable with another bike line.
I own 5 bikes.
Trek 830 mountain bike.
Redline Conquest Pro crossbike
Steelman road bike
Lightspeed Ultimate road bike
Scott CR-1 road bike.
I love all of them, and they all serve a purpose....
but I never ever thought of only buying from one bicycle manufacturer.
07-31-10, 06:29 AM
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My next bike will be some other brand of bike... due to poor customer service on Treks part.
My history as a Trek customer is the in the last 15 years I've bought 10 Trek bikes. 3 mountain bikes new, and 5 new road bikes (1 aluminum and 4 carbon). Also a couple used OCLVS. One of my new bikes is a Project One Madone with yellow and gray custom paint scheme ridden 4,300 miles.
About six weeks ago I noticed a crack around the down tube where the bike is painted yellow on this bike. Two weeks ago I'm cleaning the bike and find the crack has grown from 1/4 inch to about 1 1/2 inches. I take the bike to my LBS and ask them to look at it. They comment on how well kept my bike is and agree to have the Trek rep look at the bike when he stops in that week. A couple days later the shop calls and says I can come get the bike. I go to pick it up and ask what the results are. The shop says the Trek rep looked at the bike and said it's a paint issue, not structural and nothing further would be done since Trek only warranties paint for one year and my bike is over two years old.
While I knew that Trek warranties there frames for life I honestly didn't know that paint was only covered for one year even on a custom painted frame. (Probably because none of my other OCLVs have cracks in the paint! One is white, two have half silver paint btw...I never had an issue until now.)
The rep said that paint cracking around the joints is very common on all their carbon frames and is present to some degree in almost all their carbon bikes, it's just more visible on the lighter colors like white yellow and silver. This is directly from the Trek rep. At this point I ask the shop if they were the customer, would they be happy with a high end Project One bike with a paint scheme they paid extra for having a crack in the paint? Both owners said, 'Probably not, were can certainly see your point." They recommended I contact John Burke the president of Trek directly, since his email and a note saying "If your not completely satisfied, contact me directly." is on the owners manual of every new bike. They believe this is one of those situations where customer satisfaction should likely override the standard warranty terms.
So I send a very nice, polite email to Mr Burke and explain my situation, I list all the bikes I've purchased and that I currently own 5 carbon road bikes and a new Trek commuter. I state the local bike shop's response and ask if there is any recourse for my bike's paint issue. I added that had i known that my bike would likely develop cracks in the paint, I would have: A. Bought a darker color B. Not paid extra for a P1 paint job and C. Might not have bought another Trek, since this problem has not occurred on my other OCLVs with many more miles on them than this bike.
A couple days later I get an email from a customer support representive saying that it's very common for many of the carbon framed Treks to develop paint cracks at some or all of the joints, that it's just visible on the lighter colors and that structurally my bike should be just fine. He states that lighter brighter colors often show these cracks more visibly, which of course is a no brainer. He goes on to say that even if they repainted the frame the cracks would likely come back. Since Trek only warranties paint and finish for 1 year they consider the matter closed.
Now before anyone re-states the Trek warranty policy on paint to me, let me say... I understand they are under no legal obligation to offer me anything, because my bike is more than a year old, but from a service standpoint and as a long-time customer with many high end bikes purchased from them, I honestly thought they might offer some option, and other than the LBS Trek did not at any time say were sorry you're unhappy with your bike/paintjob. They didn't offer to repaint the bike a darker color if I shipped it back, they just said basically "Case Closed".
So I replied that since I bought the wrong color bike, I'm stuck with cracked paint. Next time I buy a bike in the near future I'll make sure I buy a different brand.
Bottom Line for me; This is just poor customer service on Treks part. My LBS...still great people and they were disappointed in Trek's response to the situation. They even stated that they could see were goodwill towards the customer should probably trump the warranty in a case like this, but Trek themselves are refusing to do anything, so the LBS is mostly powerless to do anything more.
If you are thinking about buying a carbon Trek or a Project One bike... you might take what you just read above into consideration before you buy.
Me...I've bought my last Trek. I think I see a Tarmac in my future.
My history as a Trek customer is the in the last 15 years I've bought 10 Trek bikes. 3 mountain bikes new, and 5 new road bikes (1 aluminum and 4 carbon). Also a couple used OCLVS. One of my new bikes is a Project One Madone with yellow and gray custom paint scheme ridden 4,300 miles.
About six weeks ago I noticed a crack around the down tube where the bike is painted yellow on this bike. Two weeks ago I'm cleaning the bike and find the crack has grown from 1/4 inch to about 1 1/2 inches. I take the bike to my LBS and ask them to look at it. They comment on how well kept my bike is and agree to have the Trek rep look at the bike when he stops in that week. A couple days later the shop calls and says I can come get the bike. I go to pick it up and ask what the results are. The shop says the Trek rep looked at the bike and said it's a paint issue, not structural and nothing further would be done since Trek only warranties paint for one year and my bike is over two years old.
While I knew that Trek warranties there frames for life I honestly didn't know that paint was only covered for one year even on a custom painted frame. (Probably because none of my other OCLVs have cracks in the paint! One is white, two have half silver paint btw...I never had an issue until now.)
The rep said that paint cracking around the joints is very common on all their carbon frames and is present to some degree in almost all their carbon bikes, it's just more visible on the lighter colors like white yellow and silver. This is directly from the Trek rep. At this point I ask the shop if they were the customer, would they be happy with a high end Project One bike with a paint scheme they paid extra for having a crack in the paint? Both owners said, 'Probably not, were can certainly see your point." They recommended I contact John Burke the president of Trek directly, since his email and a note saying "If your not completely satisfied, contact me directly." is on the owners manual of every new bike. They believe this is one of those situations where customer satisfaction should likely override the standard warranty terms.
So I send a very nice, polite email to Mr Burke and explain my situation, I list all the bikes I've purchased and that I currently own 5 carbon road bikes and a new Trek commuter. I state the local bike shop's response and ask if there is any recourse for my bike's paint issue. I added that had i known that my bike would likely develop cracks in the paint, I would have: A. Bought a darker color B. Not paid extra for a P1 paint job and C. Might not have bought another Trek, since this problem has not occurred on my other OCLVs with many more miles on them than this bike.
A couple days later I get an email from a customer support representive saying that it's very common for many of the carbon framed Treks to develop paint cracks at some or all of the joints, that it's just visible on the lighter colors and that structurally my bike should be just fine. He states that lighter brighter colors often show these cracks more visibly, which of course is a no brainer. He goes on to say that even if they repainted the frame the cracks would likely come back. Since Trek only warranties paint and finish for 1 year they consider the matter closed.
Now before anyone re-states the Trek warranty policy on paint to me, let me say... I understand they are under no legal obligation to offer me anything, because my bike is more than a year old, but from a service standpoint and as a long-time customer with many high end bikes purchased from them, I honestly thought they might offer some option, and other than the LBS Trek did not at any time say were sorry you're unhappy with your bike/paintjob. They didn't offer to repaint the bike a darker color if I shipped it back, they just said basically "Case Closed".
So I replied that since I bought the wrong color bike, I'm stuck with cracked paint. Next time I buy a bike in the near future I'll make sure I buy a different brand.
Bottom Line for me; This is just poor customer service on Treks part. My LBS...still great people and they were disappointed in Trek's response to the situation. They even stated that they could see were goodwill towards the customer should probably trump the warranty in a case like this, but Trek themselves are refusing to do anything, so the LBS is mostly powerless to do anything more.
If you are thinking about buying a carbon Trek or a Project One bike... you might take what you just read above into consideration before you buy.
Me...I've bought my last Trek. I think I see a Tarmac in my future.
Hey Genius, did you ever look at Specialized warranty? Let me help you, this is cut and pasted from the Specialized warranty: "This limited warranty does not apply to paint/finish"
https://cdn.specialized.com/OA_MEDIA/...20Warranty.pdf
Good luck getting Specialized to cover paint chips and finish problems on that Tarmac.
Why do I even bother trying to reason with idiots???
Cheers!
FB
07-31-10, 06:36 AM
#147
I drank the Kool-Aid!
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I know you say you are happy with the LBS but it sounds like me that they sold you a custom finish that they themselves knew little about. If cracks are common due to the finish used and there is no clear coat they should present that information to a customer right away. Years ago I sold custom cabinets and when there were custom finishes that changed warranties or were done differently I went over that thoroughly with the customer before they committed so they knew the risk to benefit ratio. Now they want to throw it 100% back onto Trek when they made a profit on it as well.
07-31-10, 06:38 AM
#149
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What is painfully obvious at this point is the fact Trek doesn't care. They do not care that you have been a long time faithful customer. They have an obvious flaw in their painting process that they have know about but choose not to address. Als0 in the scheme of things you are not important to them. I would say you are more than justified in moving on to a different brand. Too bad you will get little satisfaction from the whole thing. They won't notice or care that you are gone. But at least they won't be getting any more of your business and hopefully in the long run this will bite them in some small way.
07-31-10, 06:40 AM
#150
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Hey Genius, did you ever look at Specialized warranty? Let me help you, this is cut and pasted from the Specialized warranty: "This limited warranty does not apply to paint/finish"
https://cdn.specialized.com/OA_MEDIA/...20Warranty.pdf
Good luck getting Specialized to cover paint chips and finish problems on that Tarmac.
Why do I even bother trying to reason with idiots???
Cheers!
FB
https://cdn.specialized.com/OA_MEDIA/...20Warranty.pdf
Good luck getting Specialized to cover paint chips and finish problems on that Tarmac.
Why do I even bother trying to reason with idiots???
Cheers!
FB
Remember, here we are all special. Rules apply to others.
BTW, that paint and finish rule is not unique.