Hypno Toad

I did some analysis on a similar subject last year, and started a thread:
https://www.bikeforums.net/general-cy...ead-sorry.html

To your point, compare the Globe Daily (city bike) or Marin Nail Trail (winter bike) with the Felt Z85 and Mondonico (pure road bikes).

The large sample size helps, but there are lots of errors in my comparison. For example, I typically ride the Globe with panniers, making it heavier and more wind resistance; and the road bikes will ride the segment on fitness/training rides. However, I feel that the top 20% of each bike offers a good 'feel' for what the speed differences are based on the same rider.

The two big advantages for me changing bikes: Road bikes allow me to ride on the drops and get less wind resistance; and the gearing allows me to add power at high speeds. Therefore, a road bike riding on the hoods or tops isn't going to make a rider much faster - reference dksix's post.
BTW - the tires are a lesser difference, the Globe is on 28mm T-Servs; the road bikes are on 25mm.

PepeM

Just here to give kudos to Dan, that was some exceptional detective work.

dplevy81

I think you would first have to define "hybrid" and "road bike". You can have an 18lb carbon hybrid, and you can have a 30lb steel road bike.

gregf83 

Doing a loop like that should feel like a 5k run for you. If you can run a 5 k in 15-20min you might have a shot at the kom.

WhyFi

That's what bells are for.

hsuehhwa

Since the strava segment is inside a metro park, make sure you don't go over the speed limit and don't put other recreation riders/pedestrians at risk.

joejack951

And where can you find a park path with a posted speed limit of 20-25mph?

Hypno Toad

If you want to see the advantage of drop-bars (& riding on the drops) - I made my Pugsley a drop-bar fatbike for gravel grinding. Here's a pic from the 2016 Almanzo 100:

65778889-Almz16-00430.jpg

I made this conversation on Feb 29, 2016, also changed to (relatively) lighter/faster tires. Here's the Pugsley's performance on the same segment (see my earlier post).


Image screenshot from VeloViewer

I've ridden the Pug over this segment 155 times, and in every condition imaginable. I don't 'race' the Pug on this segment, the Pug's never gonna get my PR. So this give a good idea what the speed difference is with the same rider, over the same segment, with only changing from flat-bars to drop-bars (& lighter/faster tires). There's a time advantage, but it's not massive over a short segment. However, that small advantage pays off when you're riding a 100 miles!

gregf83 

The speed limit for the segment (road not a path) was 35mph.

hsuehhwa

Many bike paths in South California have a speed limit sign, 10-15 mph (or 5 mph when pedestrians are present) and clearly define right of way (Pedestrians > horse > bike.. )

practical

You could improve your speed by changing your tires. That would make the biggest difference. You could get more "aero" by riding in the drops on a road bike, but a lot of people don't like riding with their hands down there. You may be able to lower your flat handlebars some at the stem or by rolling them down. Do you use clipless pedals (or toe straps)? If not, this may improve your speed too. Do you use a bike computer so that you can see your speed? Do you pedal with cadence or power in mind? If you can develop a fast steady cadence and sustain it, that will improve your speed.

Cyclist0108

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it is the bike.

I had that bike (or maybe the next increment up), and it really was a mistake for me. I gave it to my daughter's flute teacher, and he likes it. I am older and less fit than you are, so my numbers would mean very little, but the difference between that bike and a good road bike are rather extreme. As others have suggested, even if it gains you nothing in speed, it will still gain you quite a bit in terms of enjoyment.

joejack951

I was under the impression this was on a path, for which reason I questioned the sanity of going so fast. But given that it's a road, 'race' away!

joejack951

Right, I've never heard of a path with a posted limit any higher than 15mph, aka toodling along on a road bike. But apparently this segment is a road with a 35mph speed limit so no issues there.

highrpm

There is a path around that park but it has a 10mph speed limit. The only cyclists you usually see on the path are families going slowly with small children.


I rode the road around. I'm sure everyone else did too.

@Hypno Toad, that is a good summary in your thread. And like you said, the top 20% speed does show a marked difference when you step into the road bikes.

hsuehhwa

35 mph speed limit inside a park? Sounds like a fun loop!

autonomy

All this talk about carbon and tailwind... let's go simpler. OP, are you using platform pedals? Thin, slick tires at high PSI? Are you sure your bottom bracket and wheel hubs are well-oiled and have as little friction as a well-tuned road bike? (I know I'm wasting a lot of energy on those on my junker commuter) Are you assuming a less wind-resistant position? (at 20mph+ it definitely helps).

Also, were you wearing a skin-tight kit?

Racing Dan

Most likely not a lot onless you compere to riding in the drops. Most dont or cant. I you place the flat bars to get your body in the same position as if you would be rinding the hods on a drop bar and get some low rolling resistane tyres, Im betting the difference is essentially zero.

Seattle Forrest

Well, that's why right there.

highrpm

@autonomy,


I was using the normal platform pedals that come with the bike. I was running around 60psi in the 32 tires. I didn't really do any maintenance beforehand. I lubed the chain at the start of the season. I rode in my normal position.


And I was wearing normal khaki shorts and a t-shirt, and hiking shoes. Not tight bike gear.


These are all things that are costing me speed, and that I could change before I swap the bike out. That's why I was wondering how much I left on the table, and at what point I'd hit the wall before I'd need to jump onto a better bike.

WhyFi

The other thing that you need to consider is the nature of increasing resistance as you speed up. You've compared yourself to the KOM as a yardstick, which is all well and good, but if he's 6 mph faster than you, don't for a second believe that getting 3mph faster gets you halfway there. It doesn't, not by a long shot.

Tweaking stuff on your current bike or even getting a new bike might net you some relatively easy gains, but everything after that is going to be more and more hard-fought.

autonomy

What's your goal? If you want to move up on the list for that segment, you can get 25mm 100+psi tires, clipless pedals, and drop bars, or a lighter bike altogether... carbon, carbon wheels, all that jazz. You can also train harder. All of this will help you go faster - marginally - but will it add anything to your enjoyment of cycling? Thin, high-pressure tires, a low-riding position are less comfortable than a hybrid; with clipless pedals you need to know how to pedal properly in order to be more efficient and they take getting used to for clipping in/out.

Of course, biggest gains you'll see will be from wearing a team kit lol:

patrickgm60

+1. I started my "real cycling" on a hybrid. Soon added SPD-MTB pedals, 25mm road tires, and a tighter cassette. After a year of hard riding on that, I bought a carbon road bike. The speed difference on flattish routes was negligible. Hilly routes, OTOH, brought out the ~10-pound weight difference.

mj0

these are my results for a local TT loop on country roads (8.3 miles 469ft 0% grade):

Road Apr 2, 2017 29:51 16.7mi/h
Hybrid Mar 20, 2017 31:39 15.8mi/h

Just the last half which is slightly downhill (3.9 miles 390ft -2% grade):

Road Apr 2, 2017 9:10 26.0mi/h <-- was in the drops the whole time.
Hybrid Mar 20, 2017 9:50 24.2mi/h

My road bike is geared 53/39 w/ 11-27 25c conti 4season tires. Hybrid is 1x 40t w/11-40 44c compass tires.

Hypno Toad

Try this video:
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