Maconi

I always see people using maintenance against disc brakes yet I haven't really seen that many disc owners actually complain about it... odd...

Bandera

Cycling/Driving/Walking in an urban environment while negotiating traffic control devices requires a certain amount of situational awareness and familiarity with the hardware one is operating. No hardware type confers immunity to the laws of physics or compensates for lapses/lack of awareness.

It's Not About the Hardware and Never Has Been.

-Bandera

Bandera

How nice.
Not exactly a testing ground for any type of bicycle brake, and not actually Road Cycling on the open public roads we all put the miles on.

-Bandera

GlennR

I have hydro disc on my MTB and they are great.

I recently test rode a new Domane SLR with hydro disc and after taking it along the soft shoulder in the dirt, sand and mud, i was on a paved down hill and the brakes were awesome. So much so that i decided that my new gravel bike needed hydro disc also.

joejack951

In other words, you are forced to ride slower in some situations because of your **** brakes.

icyclist 

What's insignificant to one person might be significant to another. All those grams add up. Since I like to ride uphill and I can save several grams at no additional cost with rim brakes, why not? ;-)

Bandera

Hardly, as previously noted:

-Bandera

DrIsotope

Well, I've never had to stop to clear the mud out of my brakes with a stick, so I've got that going for me.

Here's an easy bottom line: the top defense of rim brakes, other than "they've worked fine since forever," is "so long as you don't ride in the wet, you don't need discs." The drawback to discs seems to be "they're several grams heavier." So if we do a head-to-head between discs and rim brakes in a variety of conditions, including panic braking in wet and dry, the discs are going to come out ahead overall. Even if by the slimmest of margins.

And yet still, I'm not telling anybody to give up their rim brakes, or run out and buy a bike with discs. Ride whatever blows the wind up your skirt. I don't give a damn-- I don't have to ride anyone else's bike. I like my discs, and the bike after this bike will have discs.

link0

Except there IS a significant weight penalty.

American Euchre

Weight penalty
Aero penalty
Cost penalty
Aesthetic Penalty
Safety Penalty

Campag4life

To me, your comment about being no downside to owning disks in normal riding conditions is bogus. I have owned disk brake bikes. I know the downside in adjustment relative to caliper brakes. Disks are heavier. Disks are less aerodynamic. Keeping them quiet is a PITA...rotors have to be dead true and caliper and pads have to be dead center to not rub with a low travel lever position...especially if pads are new. I am the guy that helps my riding friends adjust their disk brakes because they can't keep them quiet or from rubbing as I am a better wrench than the rest of them because of my background.

You can dream on all you like about disks not having a downside in normal conditions but they do including cost and the vast majority of riders will be better served with caliper brakes.

The upside for disks is riding off road...or riding a lot in inclement conditions. This is where my disk brake bikes have shined and the only reason I put up with their PITA compared to calipers.

Further caliper brakes are not created equally. I haven't spent a lot of time on Sram caliper brakes but I have on Campy and Shimano built bikes and Shimano's latest Ultegra and DA calipers are outstanding in terms of modulation, lever effort and power. To me they blow Campy out of the water in terms of performance and why I ride Shimano brakes on my Campy bikes.

Campag4life

You wear a skirt?...hmmm. Not telling anybody to give up on their rim brakes? That's nice.

I have to laugh about caliper brakes not working in the wet. Gee....how have I ever survived over the decades of fast group riding getting caught in a rain storm? Or pro tour riders in 'racing conditions' in the wet descending the Alps at 50 mph + with caliper brakes. Since they have been banned in the pro peloton, I guess they will have to walk when it rains. Too bad.

Lazyass

So you're claiming to push close to 40 miles per hour in town with lights and traffic?

Paul Barnard

I have ridden V brake and disc brake mountain bikes. For the kind of riding I did, they offered no real advantage. I never rode in conditions I couldn't lock V brakes in. If I can lock the brakes, power isn't an issue. It's just a matter of finding the right amount of pressure to control braking so that I don't lock the brakes. That's not an issue either. In fact, I have fewer accidental lock ups with rim brakes than with discs. Don't get me wrong, I liked the disc brakes, but they didn't really do anything for me.

The bicycling world needs change to fuel interest. There's only so much technology that can be applied to a bicycle, so you see the industry push changes. Some of those changes stick and some don't. I remember when Bio Pace chain rings came out. The industry pushed it and people swore by it. Then they didn't. So they reinvented it, and now people swear by it. Press fit BB, the various head set configurations, now axle changes and road disc. Mostly change for the sake of change. Real benefit to every day riders is nominal at best.

dwing

I have a bike with hydro disc brakes and another with caliper. I'm a lot more "aware" and cautious on fast descents in wet weather with the calipers. Stopping power isn't the issue, it's the precise modulation that hydros provide that elicits confidence using them. There is a different feel from 75" of rim rubbing against pads that are 1" apart per revolution versus the smaller disc with pads 1/4" apart, and any imperfections in the rim caliper setup really amplify.

andr0id

Not have to deal with fluid, especially when hanging bikes by the wheels upside down in the garage. I can grab a bike after not riding it a few months and know the brakes are going to work.

I'm just gonna have mineral oil all over the floor with hydraulic/disc brakes.

9000/6800 braking is incredible. And I thought the previous generation was just fine.

rms13

Why are you going to have mineral oil on your floor? Its within a contianed system

lungdoc

Horses for courses. Disks have definite advantages and a few drawbacks. For many sport/race road bike users who don't commute and realistically don't ride much on their fancy bikes in adverse conditions there simply isn't much gain. I just bought a Cervelo R3 without disks for precisely that reason. If I lived in rainy mountains or was committed to crappy weather riding my decision would have been different. I wouldn't buy a commuter or touring bike without disks, nor a tandem.

The UCI's decision about disks will have a big impact on availability and preference for disks on higher end road bikes, as will their weight limit decisions. If they remove or lower the weight limits the weight of the disks becomes a more meaningful issue. Not that we're riding with the pros but it influences preferences.

roccobike

Interesting thread. I was just thinking about it last week, all the new bikes showing up at rides this year but no disc brakes with the "fast" bikes until yesterday. For the first time I saw a true, higher end bike with a fast rider show up with disc brakes. I've seen a few beginners with flat bar bikes with disc and a few C, D level riders with them, but not so much with the "B" and "A" level riders until yesterday. Based on some of the threads on BF, I expected to see mostly discs on new bikes. Just not seeing big acceptance, Certainly, haven't heard anyone buying a new bike just to get disc brakes.
I upgraded my main rider to 7800 series DA brakes with Koolstop salmon colored pads. It has plenty of stopping power. I think I'd go to 9000 series before I'd trade the bike for a disc bike.

snidely

Careful, those things can cut your leg right off.

gsa103

A couple of points.

1) Shimano road hydrualics greatly benefit from using MTB lines. Shimano, in their infinite wisdom, decided road riders weren't ready for MTB style braking feel, and intentionally used more flexible brake lines. The result is the lever feel is less firm that if you swap to the newer MTB lines.

2) Hydraulics allow for a dramatic reduction in lever travel and force. If you a 170 lbs man, caliper brakes are fine, but for riders with small hands (especially women) will benefit from the reduced lever travel and pull force required. With caliper brakes, women are frequently forced to choose between inadequate pad clearances or levers that are too far forward.

andr0id

Like the "contained" fluid systems on airplanes, cars, motorcycles and all the other contained systems that never leak? You are a very optimistic person. I've been elbow deep in hydraulic fluid before, so I am less naive.

rmfnla

Entropy at its finest...

andr0id

The one key thing I learned in the Navy, the only thing that breaks faster than an airplane you fly is an airplane you don't fly.... Go figure.

DinoShepherd

No surprise performance and feel are similar. That was Shimano's design intent with this first generation of road. There are tons of articles on line, but the short version is that Shimano initially went with the MTB (more aggressive) feel and roadies didn't like it. So they changed the housing, ratios, etc... to feel more like a standard caliper brake.

With a hydro system, the potential is there to make the brakes feel very different. For this revision though, we all get something that feels very much like quality road calipers. Which doesn't suck at all.