Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Singlespeed & Fixed Gear
Reload this Page >

Do you carry extra cogs with you all the time?

Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

Do you carry extra cogs with you all the time?

Old 12-11-18, 09:07 PM
  #1  
bassboy1126
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
bassboy1126's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 18

Bikes: State Bicycle Undefeated II

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Do you carry extra cogs with you all the time?

Do any of you carry extra cogs with you at any given time? Especially if you bike in hilly areas. Right now I've been rocking a 48 18 gear ratio, and I'm trying to find a ratio that is easy when it comes to going up and down hills, or should I just carry multiple cogs with me a change on the go?
bassboy1126 is offline  
Old 12-11-18, 09:19 PM
  #2  
bonsai171
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 853
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 429 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Most of the time I just have 1 set of gearing (45X16) and stick with that for the entire ride. If you have a flip flop hub with threads for a lockring on the other side, you can run fixed-fixed and have more than one set of gears.

The gearing you pick depends on your riding. For me, 45X17 is a little on the spinny side for downhills. Switching to a 16t cog increased my comfort level going downhill, and increased top speed. I would suggest playing with different cogs to find out at what point you can no longer ride up the steepest hill in your area. Keep in mind you can always swap cogs back to a higher ratio, although I would probably only do that at home. It wouldn't be fun carrying a chain whip, extra cogs, and a lockring tool around with you on a ride :-p Half the fun of riding fixed is pushing really hard thru a tough hill and finding that you can actually climb it, despite having only one gear.

Dave
bonsai171 is offline  
Old 12-11-18, 09:31 PM
  #3  
REDMASTA
Senior Member
 
REDMASTA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Traveling through time, will return last week.
Posts: 556

Bikes: Bare Rum Sword Knuckle Runner

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 208 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
i carry a second bike strapped to my back.
REDMASTA is offline  
Old 12-11-18, 09:52 PM
  #4  
mouse
dumb
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Tucson
Posts: 362
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by bassboy1126 View Post
Do any of you carry extra cogs with you at any given time? Especially if you bike in hilly areas. Right now I've been rocking a 48 18 gear ratio, and I'm trying to find a ratio that is easy when it comes to going up and down hills, or should I just carry multiple cogs with me a change on the go?
Say you did plan on carrying extra sets of cogs... do you plan on carrying a chain whip and lock ring tool as well? By the time you take everything apart and put it back together you'd probably have ridden up that hill. I typically find a gear ratio that I like and stick to that... I don't even bother with running a second cog on the flip side. I'd assume most people are the same.

A funny image just popped in my mind: A guy wrenching cogs on and off at the tops and bottoms of every hill lol

Originally Posted by REDMASTA View Post
i carry a second bike strapped to my back.





Last edited by mouse; 12-12-18 at 12:56 PM.
mouse is offline  
Old 12-11-18, 11:21 PM
  #5  
hairnet
Fresh Garbage
 
hairnet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 13,195

Bikes: N+1

Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 339 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by bassboy1126 View Post
Right now I've been rocking a 48 18 gear ratio, and I'm trying to find a ratio that is easy when it comes to going up and down hills, or should I just carry multiple cogs with me a change on the go?
This is part of the challenge of riding a fixed gear. If you want it easier to climb a hill then you're going to have to learn how to spin those cranks down a hill. Riding fixed gear in hilly areas isn't easy, you'll have to build some skills and find a compromise between uphill and downhill that works for you. If you have some seriously steep downhill sections then I'll echo getting a fixed-fixed wheel and have an extra tall gear ratio reserved for those.

or be a wussie and get a freewheel

Originally Posted by mouse View Post
Say you did plan on carrying extra sets of cogs... do you plan on carrying a chain whip and lock ring tool as well? By the time you take everything apart and put it back together you'd probably have ridden up that hill. I typically find a gear ratio that I like and stick to that... I don't even bothering with running a second cog on the flip side. I'd assume most people are the same.
This.

Only once did I try flipping-the-flop and I immediately disliked the freewheel. As for fixie, I've hovered around the same gear ratio for maybe 7 years because it works for me.

Last edited by hairnet; 12-11-18 at 11:34 PM.
hairnet is offline  
Old 12-11-18, 11:41 PM
  #6  
Leukybear
THE STUFFED
 
Leukybear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 12,675

Bikes: Rock Lobster; EAI Bareknuckle; Evil Insurgent

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 358 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Realistically speaking, the number of people that are willing to go to that effort to address a momentary inconvenience of a climb are surprisingly low.

Also, if you're the type of person that takes pleasure in doing things the hardway, don't forget to re-tighten your freshly swapped cog and lockring otherwise you'll risk stripping them on the other side of the climb!
__________________
¿pɐǝɹ oʇ sᴉ sᴉɥʇ ƃuᴉʎouuɐ ʍoɥ ǝǝs

Originally Posted by veganbikes View Post
Pound sign: Kilo TT
Leukybear is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 07:54 AM
  #7  
TimothyH
- Soli Deo Gloria -
 
TimothyH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 13,558

Bikes: 2018 Rodriguez Custom Fixed Gear, 2017 Niner RLT 9 RDO, 2015 Bianchi Pista, 2002 Fuji Robaix

Mentioned: 208 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6096 Post(s)
Liked 125 Times in 85 Posts
Originally Posted by REDMASTA View Post
i carry a second bike strapped to my back.
National Park Service doesn't allow bicycles in some parks and so...

Bikepackers cross the Grand Canyon this way.

TimothyH is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 09:01 AM
  #8  
TMonk
Not actually Tmonk
 
TMonk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 10,984

Bikes: road, track, mtb

Mentioned: 108 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 864 Post(s)
Liked 33 Times in 15 Posts
if you want to switch gears mid ride, I'd suggest getting a bike with a derailleur and multi-speed cassette
__________________
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
TMonk is online now  
Old 12-12-18, 10:43 AM
  #9  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 5,094

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Pink Klein MTB, Phil Wood VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1128 Post(s)
Liked 12 Times in 10 Posts
I don't carry extra cogs, If you really needed an extra gear get a flip flop hub with a different gear on the other side. Me personally I say just go for it sometimes a climb is tough on a fixed gear but that is part of the fun. Fixed gears are always in the wrong gear and while that sounds bad it is part of the draw and joy of fixed gear riding. It is more about pedaling and riding then worrying about gears and am I in the right gear should I shift up or down you have what you have and you make it work.

If you are truly worried Surly makes the Dingle cogs which have two gears on them so you can manual move your chain to them if you feel you need something different. And if that doesn't satisfy (I *snicker*) get a bike with derailleurs and gears and don't worry anymore. I love my derailleur bikes as well and have a whole bunch of them.
veganbikes is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 10:59 AM
  #10  
seamuis
aire díthrub
 
seamuis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: chatham
Posts: 450

Bikes: Raleigh Competition, Pashley Roadster Sovereign, Cielo Sportif Classic, Mercian Vincitore Speciale

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 198 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
We solved this problem over a hundred years ago and surprisingly it’s still widely available, cheap and reliable.
seamuis is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 03:19 PM
  #11  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 20,246

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 103 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1628 Post(s)
Liked 10 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by mouse View Post


Say you did plan on carrying extra sets of cogs... do you plan on carrying a chain whip and lock ring tool as well? By the time you take everything apart and put it back together you'd probably have ridden up that hill.


Or even walked up it.

A funny image just popped in my mind: A guy wrenching cogs on and off at the tops and bottoms of every hill lol


Isn't that why they make flip/flop and 3-speed fixed gear hubs?
JohnDThompson is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 06:57 PM
  #12  
trekkie820
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 2,301

Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600 SS, 2016 Cannondale Cujo 2 SS

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Maybe while youre at it carry a cluster of extra cogs for multiple ratios to swap out. Then maybe add some special device to derail the chain for you so you don't have to. Hell, since we are getting crazy now, instead of carrying the extra cogs in your backpack you could organize them from smallest to largest, put some kind of threaded carrier that also allows the cog cluster to ratchet forward, allowing the wheel to spin freely when the cogs arent engaged in moving the bike forward. That would be sah-weeeeet
trekkie820 is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 07:11 PM
  #13  
phobus
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: South FL
Posts: 259
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 116 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by trekkie820 View Post
some kind of threaded carrier that also allows the cog cluster to ratchet forward, allowing the wheel to spin freely when the cogs arent engaged in moving the bike forward. That would be sah-weeeeet
To be honest, this sounds awful and I'm sure nobody would buy it.
phobus is offline  
Old 12-12-18, 07:32 PM
  #14  
hairnet
Fresh Garbage
 
hairnet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 13,195

Bikes: N+1

Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 339 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 2 Posts
Man, I forgot all about the Surly Dingle cog. It would be perfect for OP if he can find one. I did this on my SS mountain bike (cassette hub) so I could have a street gear and a mountain gear.

hairnet is offline  
Old 12-13-18, 04:16 AM
  #15  
trekkie820
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 2,301

Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600 SS, 2016 Cannondale Cujo 2 SS

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by phobus View Post
To be honest, this sounds awful and I'm sure nobody would buy it.
true. Sound much better to just carry extra cogs, a wrench, a chain whip and lockring tool and spend 30 minutes swapping cogs at the base of every hill
trekkie820 is offline  
Old 12-13-18, 05:17 AM
  #16  
klhada
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 63
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I choose my gear based on the highest climb I ride. Right now 48X18 works really nicely. In the crazy descents, I just use my "gasp" brakes, and keep the cadence under control. But sometimes in the bottom of the hills I just let it loose and spin like a mad man My max cadence already improved a lot.
klhada is offline  
Old 12-13-18, 07:40 PM
  #17  
Roadie Fixie
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6

Bikes: Bianchi Sempre, Surly Steamroller, and Somec Pista

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
The only time I every carry extra cogs with me is if I'm riding my bike to a race. I don't like riding in the streets brakeless with a heavy ratio, and I don't want to wear my legs out before the race starts.
Roadie Fixie is offline  
Old 12-13-18, 09:23 PM
  #18  
veganbikes
Clark W. Griswold
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: ,location, location
Posts: 5,094

Bikes: Foundry Chilkoot Ti W/Ultegra Di2, Cinelli Mash Work RandoCross Fun Time Machine, 1x9 XT Parts Hybrid, Co-Motion Cascadia, Specialized Langster, Pink Klein MTB, Phil Wood VeloXS Frame (w/DA 7400), Cilo Road Frame

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1128 Post(s)
Liked 12 Times in 10 Posts
Originally Posted by trekkie820 View Post
Maybe while youre at it carry a cluster of extra cogs for multiple ratios to swap out. Then maybe add some special device to derail the chain for you so you don't have to. Hell, since we are getting crazy now, instead of carrying the extra cogs in your backpack you could organize them from smallest to largest, put some kind of threaded carrier that also allows the cog cluster to ratchet forward, allowing the wheel to spin freely when the cogs arent engaged in moving the bike forward. That would be sah-weeeeet
That is a dumb idea I doubt will ever catch on anywhere. What next some sort of air bladder inside our tires that we have to inflate sometimes. No thank you the ordinary works just fine for me.
veganbikes is offline  
Old 12-13-18, 09:45 PM
  #19  
79pmooney
A Roadie Forever
 
79pmooney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 6,717

Bikes: (2) ti TiCycles, 2007 w/ triple and 2011 fixed, 1979 Peter Mooney, ~1983 Trek 420 now fixed and ~1973 Raleigh Carlton Competition gravel grinder

Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1548 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by bassboy1126 View Post
Do any of you carry extra cogs with you at any given time? Especially if you bike in hilly areas. Right now I've been rocking a 48 18 gear ratio, and I'm trying to find a ratio that is easy when it comes to going up and down hills, or should I just carry multiple cogs with me a change on the go?
Yes.

A little background. I love riding fix gears. I love climbing. I started riding fix gear 1976 and fell in love first ride (despite forgetting, coasting and rudely crashing). 2011 I ordered a custom fix gear with a very longroad-style dropout that would allow me to use any available cog without messing with the chain length. Ordered a fix-fix flip-flop hub and built a wheel. Made an aluminum chainwhip that mounts on the toptube. Picked up the bike at the end of the year. Two months later I went to the Cycle Oregon kickoff party where they announce the next year's route. Crater Lake. The course profile showed each hilly day as being one of two seriously big climbs. and a big downhill inot camp. Very little up-and-down riding. Hmmf. I could ride this fix gear doing very few gear changed, but very big ones. So I did. It was a blast. (Now the day going up to and around Crater Lake took more. 9 wheel flips and 2 cog changes. In 98 miles and 9800' of climbing. Believe me, those gear changes made a real difference! (Fun part was going around the rim. I replaced the flat ground 17 with the 12. So all I had was a 12 aND A 23. THey were perfect. The 23 miles of rim have maybe a mile of sorta flat.

So that bike is a road version of a classic fix gear; track1/8" crankset and cogs. I rode 4 Cycle Oregons on it. Two years ago we were supposed to go up Crater Lake again but were promised many miles of steep gravel, both up and down. That skinny tired bike wasn't the right tool. But there was my old Mooney! It could handle seriously big tires and had horizontal dropouts (Campy). So being a geeky engineer and being very aware that I needed at least the gearing range I had before, I got to work. Since I had a short dropout to work with, I needed multiple chainrings. This was going to g o very fast, both on paved and unpaved roads. Since there are few track quality cranksets that allow small enough chainrings (a 42-23 track low just doesn't cut it on 15% and gravel and they only seat one chanring) I was going to have to use a 110 BCD or similar crankset and probably not get the wonderful roundness I take for granted with my Sugino 75 crankset. So I am going to use nothing but 1/8" stuff to better ensure I don't toss a chain at speed.

Playing with gear tables and knowing I was limited to a 24 tooth low (I found a 24 in England), I deduced I needed a 36 tooth chainring for the steep gravel. I also needed a flat ground 42-17 or the like and a big gear. So ... how 'bout a triple chainring crankset, three cogs and each cog set up to line up with its respective chainring. And if I pick my cogs and chainrings right, all the combos will land within that short dropout. (The easy "rule" - if the chainring teeth plus cog teeth add up to the same number, the wheel will sit in the same place.) Next challenge - three cogs and lining up the cogs and chainring. Here things start getting very non-stock. I decided to introduce dish to a similar flip-flop hub. Just enough that it shifts each cog 1/2 the chainring spacing. Flat ground gear is dished in, small high gear cog is dished out. And I sorta copied Surley's Dingle. (I knew about them but have never actually looked at one.) I bought two cogs, a 17 and a 23 and took them to a framebuilder to combine them with the 23 flipped around so it basically sat on the turn of the spokes. A spacer was made, then the 17, all brazed to make a single unit that screws on just like a single on the 23's threads. (Lockring sits a hair further out but had full thread engagement.)

Last piece was the crankset. I found a Sugino GT crankset (110 BCD) and bought rings of 36, 38, 42, 44 and 46. The rings needed to be as far inboard as possible to match the cogs but being quite large for triple, the usual triple wouldn't work; the inside teeth don't clear any chainstay. So instead of fastening the third ring in the inside and moving the crankset out until it clears (and add a mile of "Q" factor which these knees really don't like, I put the small and middle chairings in the usual double positions then spacers and the large ring outside. (Since chainlines are dead straight, there is plenty of room out there where the front derailleurs and chain usually live.) I had some custom steel chainring bolts made. Bought a Phil Wood narrow BB and used the wonderful ability to fine tune alignment to get the inside 38 tooth ring to just miss the paint. (I can barely slide a sheet of paper in there. Chainlines aren't quite perfect but very close. As close as the usual error introduced with even high quality square taper cranksets after a few ons and offs. My knees love the low "Q" factor!

The setup works very, very well. Yes, expensive. But it is very close to full velodrome quality and I can run 46-44-38 X 13-17-21 for paved days with real hills and 44-42-36 X 13-17-21 (unscrewing the 17-21 "dingle" and putting on the 24 for the big gravel climbs) A month before that Cycle Oregon I joined 11 locals (including some well known BFers) to ride the Trask River Trail across the Oregon coast range as a (much more demanding ) trail run. The bike worked flawlessly. (The gearing wasn't low enough. Multiple 18% stretches on 1 1/2" "gravel. One one I couldn't sit, stalled and fell. But downhill on the big gear, 38c tire in front, 35c in back, the bike ruled!) Sadly, that CO was the one that got canceled by the fires. But my Peter Mooney found it's true calling so all was not lost.

So, does the concept work? Big question is what do your hills look like? For really big stuff, it is a a no-brainer. Yes, the geared folk will walk away when you stop to change gears. Forget them. When you are all back in camp, all they did was a ride where they can spout the numbers off their computers. You did real work and will be feeling it to your bones. And I promise you, even with multiple cogs and changes, riding fixed will always be harder than with gears and freewheels. Like 25-33% harder. Maybe not faster, more energy spent or anything else you can measure, but it is harder. I promise.

The rides that are true killers, spare cogs or no are ones with many smaller hills that aren't rollers where you can blast up off the momentum you got going down. Oregon's coast highway is hard. Not fun. The hills are just long enough to justify stopping and changing but you pay for the stop, Then you are in too small a gear and have to repeat the change at the top. Or skip the changes, suffer going up and get you crotch hammered coming down. Get to the bottom and repeat. We did this as the rest day ride for one of my fix gear COs. After beating my body up riding 25 miles south lunch, I elected to come home via the option with a long 1000' climb and descent. 3 gear changes and a joy to ride!

And lastly, those of use who have done real rides on fix gears (even changing gears) know real men ride fix gears.

Ben
79pmooney is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 08:33 AM
  #20  
seamuis
aire díthrub
 
seamuis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: chatham
Posts: 450

Bikes: Raleigh Competition, Pashley Roadster Sovereign, Cielo Sportif Classic, Mercian Vincitore Speciale

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 198 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
And lastly, those of use who have done real rides on fix gears (even changing gears) know real men ride fix gears.
this statement is trash, so I hope it was a bad joke. you would literally have been better served with a multi speed bike or at the very least an IGH 3speed fixed hub. but you keep on wasting countless hours of your life screwing and unscrewing sprockets and riding with a chainwhip. Just don’t expect anyone to read your way too long post and say “yea, that all makes perfect sense.” Cheers.
seamuis is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 09:49 AM
  #21  
seau grateau
Senior Member
 
seau grateau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: PHL
Posts: 9,461

Bikes: Litespeed, IRO

Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1101 Post(s)
Liked 27 Times in 14 Posts
Originally Posted by seamuis View Post


this statement is trash, so I hope it was a bad joke. you would literally have been better served with a multi speed bike or at the very least an IGH 3speed fixed hub. but you keep on wasting countless hours of your life screwing and unscrewing sprockets and riding with a chainwhip. Just don’t expect anyone to read your way too long post and say “yea, that all makes perfect sense.” Cheers.
Trash is a very good word for it.
seau grateau is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 10:47 AM
  #22  
kingston 
Jedi Master
 
kingston's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Lake Forest, IL
Posts: 2,614

Bikes: http://stinkston.blogspot.com/p/my-bikes.html

Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1063 Post(s)
Liked 13 Times in 11 Posts
I have an 18/16 dual fixed cog at the bottom of a parts box in my basement somewhere. Seemed like a good idea when I bought it but was way too much hassle to use in real life.
kingston is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 11:46 AM
  #23  
seamuis
aire díthrub
 
seamuis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: chatham
Posts: 450

Bikes: Raleigh Competition, Pashley Roadster Sovereign, Cielo Sportif Classic, Mercian Vincitore Speciale

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 198 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by seau grateau View Post
Trash is a very good word for it.
damn mate, did something go over my head, or did you and I agree?
seamuis is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 12:09 PM
  #24  
seau grateau
Senior Member
 
seau grateau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: PHL
Posts: 9,461

Bikes: Litespeed, IRO

Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1101 Post(s)
Liked 27 Times in 14 Posts
Originally Posted by seamuis View Post


damn mate, did something go over my head, or did you and I agree?
Lol, I never thought I'd see the day.
seau grateau is offline  
Old 12-14-18, 03:22 PM
  #25  
trekkie820
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 2,301

Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600 SS, 2016 Cannondale Cujo 2 SS

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
Yes.

A little background. I love riding fix gears. I love climbing. I started riding fix gear 1976 and fell in love first ride (despite forgetting, coasting and rudely crashing). 2011 I ordered a custom fix gear with a very longroad-style dropout that would allow me to use any available cog without messing with the chain length. Ordered a fix-fix flip-flop hub and built a wheel. Made an aluminum chainwhip that mounts on the toptube. Picked up the bike at the end of the year. Two months later I went to the Cycle Oregon kickoff party where they announce the next year's route. Crater Lake. The course profile showed each hilly day as being one of two seriously big climbs. and a big downhill inot camp. Very little up-and-down riding. Hmmf. I could ride this fix gear doing very few gear changed, but very big ones. So I did. It was a blast. (Now the day going up to and around Crater Lake took more. 9 wheel flips and 2 cog changes. In 98 miles and 9800' of climbing. Believe me, those gear changes made a real difference! (Fun part was going around the rim. I replaced the flat ground 17 with the 12. So all I had was a 12 aND A 23. THey were perfect. The 23 miles of rim have maybe a mile of sorta flat.

So that bike is a road version of a classic fix gear; track1/8" crankset and cogs. I rode 4 Cycle Oregons on it. Two years ago we were supposed to go up Crater Lake again but were promised many miles of steep gravel, both up and down. That skinny tired bike wasn't the right tool. But there was my old Mooney! It could handle seriously big tires and had horizontal dropouts (Campy). So being a geeky engineer and being very aware that I needed at least the gearing range I had before, I got to work. Since I had a short dropout to work with, I needed multiple chainrings. This was going to g o very fast, both on paved and unpaved roads. Since there are few track quality cranksets that allow small enough chainrings (a 42-23 track low just doesn't cut it on 15% and gravel and they only seat one chanring) I was going to have to use a 110 BCD or similar crankset and probably not get the wonderful roundness I take for granted with my Sugino 75 crankset. So I am going to use nothing but 1/8" stuff to better ensure I don't toss a chain at speed.

Playing with gear tables and knowing I was limited to a 24 tooth low (I found a 24 in England), I deduced I needed a 36 tooth chainring for the steep gravel. I also needed a flat ground 42-17 or the like and a big gear. So ... how 'bout a triple chainring crankset, three cogs and each cog set up to line up with its respective chainring. And if I pick my cogs and chainrings right, all the combos will land within that short dropout. (The easy "rule" - if the chainring teeth plus cog teeth add up to the same number, the wheel will sit in the same place.) Next challenge - three cogs and lining up the cogs and chainring. Here things start getting very non-stock. I decided to introduce dish to a similar flip-flop hub. Just enough that it shifts each cog 1/2 the chainring spacing. Flat ground gear is dished in, small high gear cog is dished out. And I sorta copied Surley's Dingle. (I knew about them but have never actually looked at one.) I bought two cogs, a 17 and a 23 and took them to a framebuilder to combine them with the 23 flipped around so it basically sat on the turn of the spokes. A spacer was made, then the 17, all brazed to make a single unit that screws on just like a single on the 23's threads. (Lockring sits a hair further out but had full thread engagement.)

Last piece was the crankset. I found a Sugino GT crankset (110 BCD) and bought rings of 36, 38, 42, 44 and 46. The rings needed to be as far inboard as possible to match the cogs but being quite large for triple, the usual triple wouldn't work; the inside teeth don't clear any chainstay. So instead of fastening the third ring in the inside and moving the crankset out until it clears (and add a mile of "Q" factor which these knees really don't like, I put the small and middle chairings in the usual double positions then spacers and the large ring outside. (Since chainlines are dead straight, there is plenty of room out there where the front derailleurs and chain usually live.) I had some custom steel chainring bolts made. Bought a Phil Wood narrow BB and used the wonderful ability to fine tune alignment to get the inside 38 tooth ring to just miss the paint. (I can barely slide a sheet of paper in there. Chainlines aren't quite perfect but very close. As close as the usual error introduced with even high quality square taper cranksets after a few ons and offs. My knees love the low "Q" factor!

The setup works very, very well. Yes, expensive. But it is very close to full velodrome quality and I can run 46-44-38 X 13-17-21 for paved days with real hills and 44-42-36 X 13-17-21 (unscrewing the 17-21 "dingle" and putting on the 24 for the big gravel climbs) A month before that Cycle Oregon I joined 11 locals (including some well known BFers) to ride the Trask River Trail across the Oregon coast range as a (much more demanding ) trail run. The bike worked flawlessly. (The gearing wasn't low enough. Multiple 18% stretches on 1 1/2" "gravel. One one I couldn't sit, stalled and fell. But downhill on the big gear, 38c tire in front, 35c in back, the bike ruled!) Sadly, that CO was the one that got canceled by the fires. But my Peter Mooney found it's true calling so all was not lost.

So, does the concept work? Big question is what do your hills look like? For really big stuff, it is a a no-brainer. Yes, the geared folk will walk away when you stop to change gears. Forget them. When you are all back in camp, all they did was a ride where they can spout the numbers off their computers. You did real work and will be feeling it to your bones. And I promise you, even with multiple cogs and changes, riding fixed will always be harder than with gears and freewheels. Like 25-33% harder. Maybe not faster, more energy spent or anything else you can measure, but it is harder. I promise.

The rides that are true killers, spare cogs or no are ones with many smaller hills that aren't rollers where you can blast up off the momentum you got going down. Oregon's coast highway is hard. Not fun. The hills are just long enough to justify stopping and changing but you pay for the stop, Then you are in too small a gear and have to repeat the change at the top. Or skip the changes, suffer going up and get you crotch hammered coming down. Get to the bottom and repeat. We did this as the rest day ride for one of my fix gear COs. After beating my body up riding 25 miles south lunch, I elected to come home via the option with a long 1000' climb and descent. 3 gear changes and a joy to ride!

And lastly, those of use who have done real rides on fix gears (even changing gears) know real men ride fix gears.

Ben
http://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/detail/s3x-silver

why not just get one of these?
trekkie820 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.