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Newsflash: Aerospokes are SO not built for speed

Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

Newsflash: Aerospokes are SO not built for speed

Old 02-12-08, 02:10 PM
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kmart
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Newsflash: Aerospokes are SO not built for speed

Stole this graph from a post in the road forum. It shows, from left to right, the fastest accelerating to the slowest accelerating wheels (and it's a pretty comprehensive list of wheels at that).



Arrospok is dead last (on the right).

EDIT: Here's the full article.

Last edited by kmart; 02-12-08 at 02:53 PM.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by kmart View Post
Arrospok is dead last (on the right).
Thats because its the heaviest and/or has the poorest weight distribution with more mass farther away from the hub. The results basically have nothing to say about the aerodynamic qualities of arrospok. Note that the arrospok is not called accelespok.

Last edited by mihlbach; 02-12-08 at 02:19 PM.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by mihlbach View Post
Thats because its the heaviest. This has little to do with aerodynamics.
Yep. This is kind of a "no duh" post.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:18 PM
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*yawns*
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Old 02-12-08, 02:19 PM
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Your thread title is inaccurate. They're not built for ACCELERATION. Get us a graph of power required to sustain a 30km/h speed and then we can judge speed.

edit: the graph is extremely useful though. thanks.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:19 PM
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Speed and acceleration are not the same.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:20 PM
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You're getting things mixed up. There's a difference between accelerating and maintaining a speed. The Aerospokes are a real ***** to accelerate because they are tanks and not aero. A 28-hole Open Pro wheelset is going to be world's easier to accelerate because of less rotational mass. But then we get into the old debate of weight vs. aero. There's different applications for either. Less weight is better when you're a roadie climbing mountains. Aero is better for flats, time trials, track... places where weight isn't as important (which is mainly hills) and when there's not a whole lot of side wind. I have light wheels (Aeroheads) and I have a Tri-Spoke, they're both fun to ride. Easier to maintain speed with the Tri-Spoke up front even though it's heavier than the Aerohead wheelset, easier to accelerate the Aerohead wheelset up to speed.

As for Aerospokes, yeah they kind of are worthless. Okay for novelty, bull **** for performance. Not like anything I mentioned above really matters if you aren't racing or at least serious about training, either.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:20 PM
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what the graph doesn't show is the energy required to maintain 30km/h. A horse of a different color, eh?
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Old 02-12-08, 02:21 PM
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Arrospoks aren't made to accelerate fast they are best for maintaining a top speed. Show me a graph of drag vs wheel type.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:21 PM
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its definitely an interesting graph, but your argument is, um... bad.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:24 PM
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unimportant, but cool.
 
Old 02-12-08, 02:24 PM
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I actually didn't make any sort of an argument, just said they were not built for speed (that can obviously be construed in various ways). It's true, they're aerodynamic. But anyone who thinks these would be totally killer for the weekly alleycat is probably going to be disappointed. I'm sure there is a similar graph out there comparing the drag coefficients of arrospok to other wheels too. It would be nice if the guys that generated the graph above did this test for the same (very long!) list of wheelsets, just to be consistent.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:27 PM
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I'm buying stock based on that chart.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:28 PM
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In a sort of defense of the OP, while the terms acceleration and speed may be missused, I think it is faily safe to say that alot of the people who use Aerospokes (on street fixed applications) do not really benefit from the aero abilities. Also, while they are slower to accelerate, ie: not "quick", they may also be "slower" in many of their (city street) applications , which would be getting from point A to point B if there is a lot of starting and stopping, if ya wanna be all technical.

Either way, I still think they are ugly and don't get them.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:38 PM
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What I find interesting is that lots and lots of people who use their fixed gear bicycles for urban commuting (which requires lots of stopping and starting and modulation of low speed velocities) run heavy deep section rims which are designed to be aero. I myself run the IRO wheels [are they Deep Vs? They were advertised as such when I bought them, now they call them Cold Fusion? w/e] which, while quite stiff and durable, are probably not nearly as good as a set of lighter box section rims for my commute.

I love my Ritchey Deep Section wheels on my road bike, though.

Edit: I really wish they had some Deep Vs or Ritchey Deep Sections up there.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by andre nickatina View Post
Not like anything I mentioned above really matters if you aren't racing or at least serious about training, either.
Theoretically, if you were 'serious about training', wouldn't a less efficient wheel be desireable? The heavier the wheel, the harder you gotta work, thus 'training' more. then when you throw on your ultralight wheel you'll be even faster, no?

As far as racing, I'd agree, but for training, that seems like trying to build muscles by lifting a 5 pound weight when you could be using a 50 pounder.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by willypilgrim View Post
Theoretically, if you were 'serious about training', wouldn't a less efficient wheel be desireable? The heavier the wheel, the harder you gotta work, thus 'training' more. then when you throw on your ultralight wheel you'll be even faster, no?

As far as racing, I'd agree, but for training, that seems like trying to build muscles by lifting a 5 pound weight when you could be using a 50 pounder.
If your theory rang true, you'd see TDF'ers training on Schwinn Varsitys. It makes sense, but it's still kind of silly.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Adam777 View Post
In a sort of defense of the OP, while the terms acceleration and speed may be missused, I think it is faily safe to say that alot of the people who use Aerospokes (on street fixed applications) do not really benefit from the aero abilities. Also, while they are slower to accelerate, ie: not "quick", they may also be "slower" in many of their (city street) applications , which would be getting from point A to point B if there is a lot of starting and stopping, if ya wanna be all technical.

Either way, I still think they are ugly and don't get them.

very valid point. if you're in a city environment, acceleration would be what you want more. if everyone is arguing about the aerospokes because they race track, then that's a different story. somehow i dont think that's the case for the majority.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:43 PM
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I don't think anyone ever really argued that aerospokes made them fast.

I ride one because it looks fly,no appologies there.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:44 PM
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Nope not for speed maintenance since in the city you're not going to be having long stretches of open road...strength is the reason for my buying a set (I was able to crack a Mavic OP rim). They truly do make a world of a difference to maintain speed compared to a light wheelset though.....and there's also the fact that I never had a BMX bike with mags so it kind of makes up for that
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Old 02-12-08, 02:45 PM
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Whatever, if you want to go fast you're probably riding a bike with variable gearing that can coast, anyway.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ThunderChunky View Post
very valid point. if you're in a city environment, acceleration would be what you want more. if everyone is arguing about the aerospokes because they race track, then that's a different story. somehow i dont think that's the case for the majority.
we all race on the track.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:46 PM
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i was under the impression that arrospokes became popular because they were durable and easy to lock up, and cheaper than a HED3 or zipp trispoke.

the above is a pretty solid point, though.
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Old 02-12-08, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jim-bob View Post
Whatever, if you want to go fast you're probably riding a bike with variable gearing that can coast, anyway.
Whoa wait. They make a coasting fixie with variable gears? Where can I buy one?!?!????!!!
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Old 02-12-08, 02:52 PM
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I should have just linked the full article, probably would have been bashed a little less....

http://rouesartisanales.over-blog.co...-15988284.html
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