andre nickatina

Just for the record, I can tell the difference between janky old bearings and brand new ones in my skateboard. Take that mander

dylandom

what kind of cog/crankset/bb works with pw hubs. does it matter. dura ace cog or surly. will sugino's work. i'm sure the answer is out there if i try, but i'm sure one of u on here is dying to tell me instead.

Moximitre

The phil spec bearings are essentially industrial motor bearings with different grease, yes?

Also, phils are machined (quite beautifully, in my opinion) from a solid aluminum cyclinder, polished to a fine shine, and anodized or painted. There's a reason they're expensive, it's because they're expensive to produce. Isn't it also a relatively small operation, based in this country?

Cyclist0383

PW bearings have both a different grease and much more grease in them than industrial motor bearings.

dookski

i can't sift through every post waiting for the joke...
rounded nipples being a pain in the rear?
adjusting loose balls?

please. someone go for it. something like "i found no loose ball adjustment necessary with my skinny jeans etc, etc..."

dookski

for what it's worth, this thread has definitely helped me decide what my next hubset will be.

frankstoneline

conclusion being?

jim-bob

Phil Wood's pretty nifty.

I like White Industries a lot too.

queerpunk

darlin', i answered you over there on our home turf.

SD Fixed

I've riddin a Suzue Jr, a Surly, a miche hub AND Phils.

The suzue was so bad.. just soo bad.

The Surly has been alright, but needs new bearings now.. not to bad for about 2k miles of street use.

The Miche was good out of the box, and still no problems.

I'll say this, the Phils are beautiful, and costly. they took a while to break in. But rock solild, smooth now (after about 200 miles). But, dollars to donuts, if I had to do it again, I'd get Miche; the phil's, while beautiful, and smooth.. just don't give the added value to me for my performance level.

Miche is a good bet.

TheScientist

I ride phils, and I am fast on my phils.

DYLAN DYLAN, DYLAN DYLAN, and... DYLAN

Sixty Fiver

Our little shop is like fixed gear and single speed central and has seen some beautiful bikes and beautiful builds...

I was working on my 1955 Raleigh Lenton one afternoon and had her up in the stand after going through the bb and hubs (loose ball) and after oiling everything up (she doesn't see grease) spun up the cranks just to watch her spin, and spin, and spin, and spin.

It's akin to seeing a perpetual motion machine.

A few of the regular's jaws just dropped as they had never seen a smoother running bike... the bearing are grade 25, the cups look like new, and there are no cages. I have been able to pull down a sub hour 35 on this 53 year vintage "lightweight" that hits the curb at over 30 pounds because the bike is just that smooth and fast.

This is why they still make loose ball hubs and why I would still prefer to run a high quality loose ball bb over a modern cartridge as they are far smoother and will outlast a cartridge bb with proper service.

My primary ride is my 1962 Peugeot and she gets her bearings overhauled every 3 months as she can log 4500-5000 km in that period of time...I am running vintage Normandy hubs which are also diabolically smooth after being overhauled and after having the bearings replaced so I could be sure of their grade.

I just hooked my friend up with a wheelset for his new build... they are some NOS Ukai wheels (bombproof) laced to Sansin hubs that are among the smoothest I have ever had the pleasure to use.

mander

I'm not debating that different bearing setups (when brand new and set up properly) feel different when you spin em by hand, or that ultimately there is an objective difference that may or may not be reliably connected with perceived "smoothness". The second point I was trying to make is that this difference is probably meaningless to the average street rider when actually riding their bike instead of sitting around with the wheels off spinning the axles by hand. My main point is that in the absence of any technical definition, "smoothness" is about as useful as "stiff yet compliant" when evaluating bike parts. It's ok to buy stuff just because it makes you happy, that's what a hobby is all about. It seems to me though that these sorts of words are used to disguise this perfectly respectable pursuit as something based on calculated, objective "performance requirements". That strikes me as vain and silly.

SD Fixed

This is good stuff. What type of oil do you use?

Wotan

And how often do you re-oil? Pretty frequently I'd imagine.

schnee

Two things... is that spinning when the bike is on the stand, or riding? 5% 'smoother' with 800g of load around the rim turns into something else when a 150 lb. rider is on the bike.

Also, the placebo effect is huge, and measurable. Don't ever underestimate the ability of people to shape their reality to their perceptions or expectations...

mattface 

I just replaced the old mildly worn bearings on the rear wheel of my winter beater with GENUINE PHIL WOOD Spec bearings. Guess what they said on the seal?

Yup. "6001DU NSK Japan" Looks like Phil Wood uses the EXACT same bearings in their hubs Suntour was using over 15 years ago. I understand part of their "spec" is that they are packed with "Genuine Phil Wood waterproof grease". Maybe that makes a difference, maybe it doesn't. I'm pretty sure there is other grease out there that is just as good, but if these NSK bearings hold up as well as the set of NSK bearings they are replacing did I'll be happy.

el twe

Phil is known for having much higher "fill rates" of grease than any other manufacturer/distributor.

Soil_Sampler

NTN makes the bearings for Phil.

https://www.ntn.co.jp/

mattface 

Some of them maybe. Did you miss the part where I said I just installed a set that were made by NSK. SO apparently they source their bearings from more than one manufacturer.

sp00ki

is it just me, or is attempting to compare the drag from sealed bearings to loose ball bearings on a bike designed for street use with sneakers kinda silly?
My favorite is "stiff and responsive".

mattface 

Well sp00ki, you ARE kinda silly but it's not JUST you. We're mostly kinda silly around here.

Soil_Sampler

Most of them maybe.
Ignored that part.
apparently.

bryanhayn

HELP?! Does anyone happen to know what spoke length I'd need for high flange Phil track hubs and Velocity Fusion rims? I'm pretty sure the Fusions have an ERD of 591mm.

jdms mvp

good thing i swapped all my looseballs to ceramics for an alleycat coming up. i feel faster already! :thumbup: