Yes, I like the Pista.

I've ridden a few bikes in my life.

My son recommended the Pista to me, and it really surprised me.
I liked the way it handled way more than I would have ever expected.

Since no other manufacturer makes a frame set with this geometry, I can assume not a lot of track riders or street fixed gear riders feel the same about the Pista as I do.

It works for me.

I probably doesn't work for mihlbach, and maybe a lot of other people.

I know that if I ever want a custom frame, for lightness, I'll want the same geometry and the same sloping top tube; which means fillet brazed.
I don't think one can get that radical with lugs.

I have some doubts about anyone making a fork for me with that short of rake (28mm).

Someone might fillet braze a unicrown fork for a 28mm rake, if they have the machinery for it, and, unlike most fixed gear riders, I like a unicrown fork.

Mercian will give me any frame geometry I want, but their fork crowns will only accomodate a 33mm rake, which comes closer to the Bianchi's 28mm rake than any other fork crown of my acquaintance, by far.

The next closest fork, that on a Surly Steamroller, has a 38mm rake, which places Mercian's 33mm fork half way in between the 28mm Pista and the 38mm Steamroller.

So what frameset has mihlbach ridden that really suits his style, perhaps so much so that he'd tell a custom frame maker to use its geometry as a model?

By the way, some people say why go to a custom frame maker if a factory-built frame has the geometry you want.

I would go to someone like Mercian, first to get a much lighter frame; and, secondly, because Mercian tells me they can make a frame with the same geometry that will handle better and ride more comfortably than my Pista.
I wonder.

Anyway, I've kind of set a goal of getting a custom Merican fillet brazed frame for my 63rd birthday, two years from now.
I've already designed the wheels and chosen the rest of the components.
Now I just need to save up for my Mercian.
I've said that now for about three years.

I'd pay the extra $100 for nice lugs. I agree with losing the braze-ons and fender eyelets, etc.. Clean and simple like a track bike should be. And get thsoe angles nice and steep.

Also, how bout some different interesting colors? I know everyone would jump on wild colorways, especially if you could get contrasting color on the lugs.. Picture Makino... MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Makinooooooooooo..

My 2 cents..

I would definately pay $100 premium for a bike with a lugged frame..but only if it also had a 1" threaded fork and absolutely NO braze-ons.

My vote is no braze ons, no fender mounts, no water bottle cages, a few colors and raw metal/ unpainted for a bit cheaper (like how alien bikes offers their frames) to save me some bucks. 1" threaded but 1" threadless is cool and i will just rethread the steer tube.

Cable guides can be metal or plastic clips to hold the brake lines. This was popular in the 70's and they are cheaper for the builder, too. If someone doesn't like the look of water bottle bolts, they can replace them with low profile screws painted to match the frame. Almost invisible. Good to have, though; for either a water bottle cage or to hold a commuter light battery pack. My water bottle bosses also hold my pump holder.

...someone mentioned wanting a lightweight frame with the same geo as a pista???

No, pista-like geometry works OK for me, and I do have a track bike that I ride on the road, but its not optimal for that application. My road bike handles road conditions much better. You are free to ride whatever geometry you prefer of course. I simply don't buy into the whole "track-geometry is better on the street" paradigm that you and many others swear buy. There is a reason why most application-specific frames ("road, track, cyclocross, etc.) have each evolved into their own specific geometry ranges...they tend to work best for their intended particular applications. What many fail to realize however, is that for short-distance, non-competitive riding, there is no reason to be finicky about choosing your geometry. Theres a lot of false perception going on out there about minute differences in handling. I suspect that people tend to feel that a bike that looks better to them also handles better. A fairly wide range of geometries will yield a bike that handles satisfactorily for basic everyday riding.

I agree, Mihlbach. I typically ride my fixie for many miles and track geometry would just not be comfortable for that. On the other hand, the three mile ride to the bike shop, then over to the park, then back around to the neighborhood bar on a track bike would be no biggie.

On the other hand,
Recumbent riders swear they have the most comfortable bikes but I'm in no hurry to buy one, much less ride it on the street where people might see me. You gotta draw the line somewheres.

While this new frameset def looks very attractive, both the aesthetics and the price, I'd still go for the Alien frameset rather than this one. I want no brazeons, no bosses, tighter geo, higher BB & all that.
Lugs are all good but I'm afraid this frameset in question here is just another Steamroller, basically.

If I read this right it comes with a 1 1/8 threaded headset? I don't see too many of those out there. Did I read it right?

+1 for no braze-ons.
If you're paying that much for a frame to make into a fixed gear, it should be cleeean.

This is the same frame as the SE Premium Brew . From the pictures it looks beautiful!

https://sebikes.com/2008/bike-detail.asp?id=47
https://bikeisland.com/cgi-bin/BKTK_S...ls&ProdID=1100

Same geo and color, and it's been said in another thread that bike island sells the brown SE Lager frame.

i want one.

so i came upon this frame today, and it is tempting me something terrible; ive had the idea of a new frame in my head for a couple of weeks. has anyone ordered one, and if so could you share your experience with it?

also, i should add that the frame i'm using at the moment is an old suteki 10 speed frame, so i'm not sure if this new frame would be a step up or not.

+1 for the Pista Concept or FTP frame. There's enough options for steel lugged or otherwise including several from BD. There are few budget-minded alternatives to the Pista Concept or FTP.

I have that frame; it's an SE premium brew. A warning is that compared to my friends' bikes is that the pedal clearance is a bit low. I would be happy to answer and questions/post specific pictures if you wish.

white please.

Notice how 4-5 year old Pista Concept framesets are going for hundreds of $ over their retail price on eBay.

There's simply too few options for alu pro track framesets and/or complete bikes out there. I swear, if you did one right and offered it, you could sop up a lot of this demand and make some serious coin.

I have a SE Lager, is the premium brew part of the same family but a step up?

Amen. Keep in mind, though, that "fashion dorks" are probably the ones that keep fg merchants in business.

I think the less money I spend on a bike, the better, so long as utility is not compromised. I hope my fuji track (which is still stock after more than six months of pretty hard riding) lasts for ten years.

There's no denying that certain bikes are more aesthetically appealing than others, but in my opinion the best looking bikes are the ones with the simplest, cleanest lines.

Lugged steel?! Hellz yeah Id pay the extra bones! but Id get fancier lugs if I were you, and get rid of the braze ons ; )

now, what exactly IS the problem with braze-ons? aesthetics?