i think it depends on several factors. 1) are you going to keep the redline and use this for a second bike? 2) what is the primary use of this new bike?

i mention this because i was in a similar position; i have a bianchi san jose which i enjoy for its versatility (use it for commuting, some leisure rides, trips around town), but lately i've been wanting a faster, more aggressive bike. i ended up getting a kilo tt because of the steeper geometry and it will be primarily used as a 2nd bike for those faster group or solo training rides. i got something more specific because i knew i was going to keep two bikes around.

I live in downtown Boston. Any bike I have is used for getting around the city. My new build-up will be no different. That said, I also just like cruising around the city for fun, and also like longer rides out into the suburbs. I will prolly keep the Redline, so that might be a better choice for distance rides, as I know it has "relaxed" geometry, what ever the hell that means. Like I said, I don't know much about bike geometry. Thoughts? And Thanks very much for the input, BTW.

If money isnt an issue I'd highly recommend the Cinorelli Vigorelli frameset

It is. But yeah, that frame makes me drool. And plus, I don't think I am worthy of that thing.

pista has true track geometry. steep seat tube angle, head tube angle and short rake to the fork. this makes it a fast sprinter, and has very agile (or twitchy depending on your point of view handling). It puts you in a relatively agressive riding position.

The mark v is the other extreme. It has geometry similar to that of a standard road bike, which makes it a little more street friendly. it does keep the short wheelbase of the pista though (longer wheelbase = stability, shorter wheelbase= more maneuverability.

The surly has geometry half between road and track, and as a bonus has fatties fit fine. (large tires fit generously. which can be fun.) My main complaint is its made with 4130 tubing which is pretty heavy.

the kilo has a really long wheelbase, but steep angles (only the pista is steeper). I think thats just kinda weird.

my recommendation would be the pista if you want true track geometry, or the surly or iro if you want something a little more street friendly.

http://www.dclxvi.org/chunk/tech/trail/

here is a good crash course in basic bike geometry and how it effects the ride.

Thanks very much. That is the exact type of info each frame I was looking for. I do want something that is more agile, and was leaning against the Kilo for the exact reason. Current bike as a wheelbase of 101. The Kilo is 99. The others are down in the 96/97 range. Thanks again.

EDIT: thanks for the geo link, too.

With all due respect, that is the worst reason to get (or not get) a given product.

If you're looking to save money I'd recommend getting a Windsor The Hour off ebay here's one for 300 shipped
http://cgi.ebay.com/2009-NEW-ROAD-RA...d=p3286.c0.m14