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Originally Posted by areacode312
(Post 8537235)
I'll try again. I asked you a series of questions. And your reply included a nice personal insult. Who is the troll, lol.
Have a nice day! :) Just settle down over there. |
I use a 10 pound chain and a padlock (not the nice padlock from the OP though).
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i feel fortunate that i work in a very well protected area, i can see my bike from my office window, and the complex i work in has a security force constantly driving the grounds.
i use a cheapy u-lock which i just leave attached to the bike rack on the days i bike commute to work. thanks to the OP for this post though, good insite. also, it is interesting to hear that theives break locks, never pick them, i wouldnt have known that. |
Originally Posted by crawdaddio
(Post 8539493)
Not really.
Two different sizes would be better though. If you can, use a short one so it is harder to get a prying tool/device in there. Make sure you buy one with a quality key system. If you order from certain online stores, you can have multiple kryptos keyed alike (one key works both, or three, etc....) Kryptonite locks are currently using a 'rotating disk tumbler' cylinder. Very hard to pick (like thieves pick though), and there is no spring tension on the tumblers, so they tend to last a long time. The best KEY SYSTEM on bike locks that I have seen is the 'multi lock' padlocks that I mentioned before. These are miles ahead of anything else as far as key control and protection of the cylinder itself. I do not work for multi lock. I am not shilling. I don't really care what kind of lock you use. I am only recommending what I have seen and consider to be the toughest, most reliable PADLOCK. The toughest, most reliable U lock would be the kryptonite brand. It would be AWESOME if krypto and multi lock would get together and put the restricted multi lock key into a heavy duty krypto U lock........ |
Originally Posted by old scratch
(Post 8540689)
right but isnt it true that locks are almost never picked, they are broken. the fancy locksmith key is not really worth it.
You are correct. Most locks are broken by thieves, not picked open. However, occasionally, I have seen locks defeated by thieves drilling the plug of the cylinder out. This is virtually impossible with the padlock I have listed. This lock is not for everyone. It is for those that can afford it, and see the value in buying the best. Even a grinder will take some time to cut through first, the hardened shackle guard, then the shackle. It is also about key control. NO ONE will be able to get your keys. Use common sense. Use the lock that suits your needs best. |
I appreciate the info here. What I can't get over is the cable suggestion. I mean, it seems to me that closing the cable loops with a $160 padlock is expensive decoration. The thief will not spend time on the lock if it's closed by a cable. They're going to cut the cable.
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^Actually, when they see a U lock around the frame and a cable going through the wheels AND frame, they will probably just move on....
**I will say it again: YOU DON'T NEED THE BAD*** PADLOCK** It just helps. If you can afford it. |
Originally Posted by crawdaddio
(Post 8540877)
You are correct. Most locks are broken by thieves, not picked open.
However, occasionally, I have seen locks defeated by thieves drilling the plug of the cylinder out.. NO ONE will be able to get your keys |
Originally Posted by old scratch
(Post 8542416)
you have seen this on a bike lock? this seems to be the sort of thing to do to a lock that is stable, like on a door, not a padlock hanging and swinging around on a chain. who holds the padlock steady while you drive a drill or whatever into the cylinder? wouldnt thieves with these tools just cut the lock?
no one can get my kryptonite keys either. A) It is entirely possible to hold a U lock or padlock steady enough to drill out the cylinder with a cordless drill. I am not saying that this is common, but I have done it many times. (Customer lost keys and needs their lock removed). B) Not true. There are a finite number of codes. If I had the proper machine (my lock shop just happens to not have the ability to generate disk tumbler, {or 'tibbe', in england} keys), I could make keys for your lock. I am not trying to be combatative, rather, simply give you all some info.... |
hey crawdaddio... how do you feel about solid steel chains? i went to home depot and had 3 lengths of like 4 ft. each cut... then i got some allweather masterlocks and just leave the chains in various spots like school and work for when i need em...
not a bad idea eh? |
Originally Posted by EivlEvo
(Post 8540288)
Less than a month on board and you're coming into trash useful posts/threads.
Just settle down over there. Point is, I said nothing that warrants personal insults, of course I'm fine with that, there are way too many people out there that have wayyy too thin skin. Thanks for the attention, haha. |
Originally Posted by areacode312
(Post 8543033)
I don't get it, I asked some questions. Period. Prove me wrong. EXACTLY, lol.
Point is, I said nothing that warrants personal insults, of course I'm fine with that, there are way too many people out there that have wayyy too thin skin. Thanks for the attention, haha. |
Originally Posted by wallychamp
(Post 8543005)
hey crawdaddio... how do you feel about solid steel chains? i went to home depot and had 3 lengths of like 4 ft. each cut... then i got some allweather masterlocks and just leave the chains in various spots like school and work for when i need em...
not a bad idea eh? It all depends on your risk of theft...... |
Originally Posted by crawdaddio
(Post 8543077)
Well, solid steel chains can be snapped pretty easily with a pair of bolt cutters. Unless, you get hardened, or boron alloy steel.
It all depends on your risk of theft...... i always rock a mini-u for the front wheel to the frame as well.. those are necessary |
I always run two U Locks. One New York Fahgettaboudit large lock, for the frame and rear tire. And a New York Fahgettaboudit mini disc lock for the 4' cable lock to thread thru the front wheel, and the rear again. Better safe than sorry!!
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Originally Posted by wallychamp
(Post 8543069)
are you some kind of d!ck?
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Originally Posted by areacode312
(Post 8543033)
I don't get it, I asked some questions. Period. Prove me wrong. EXACTLY, lol.
Point is, I said nothing that warrants personal insults, of course I'm fine with that, there are way too many people out there that have wayyy too thin skin. Thanks for the attention, haha. If you have something to contribute, please do. Otherwise... leave. |
Originally Posted by crawdaddio
(Post 8542994)
A) It is entirely possible to hold a U lock or padlock steady enough to drill out the cylinder with a cordless drill. I am not saying that this is common, but I have done it many times. (Customer lost keys and needs their lock removed).
B) Not true. There are a finite number of codes. If I had the proper machine (my lock shop just happens to not have the ability to generate disk tumbler, {or 'tibbe', in england} keys), I could make keys for your lock. and yunno how many thieves have the proper machine? none. and yunno how many of those that do would rather just cut your lock in two? all of them. my guess is that in the history of krypto keys (since they switched from the bic pen solvable kind) that not one bike has been stolen by a dude who made a new key. the guy who wants your bike would just cut the damn thing. |
Originally Posted by EivlEvo
(Post 8543614)
The issue is with your attitude. No one here insulted. You've done a fine job of that.
If you have something to contribute, please do. Otherwise... leave. How about checking YOUR attitude, otherwise, leave. :) |
Originally Posted by blickblocks
(Post 8537210)
Is it helpful to use two different brands of U locks when using two locks? I'm going to buy a second lock soon.
however, they cannot key all locks alike. for example the new york std ulock has a different cylinder than both the Evolution and Fahgettaboudit and cannot be keyed alike. i tried to get all my locks keyed alike, but they were not tryin to hear that. i have a evo mini, and i had it keyed like my evo disc lock. so i can use the mini on the frame and rear wheel and supplement that with a chain that is locked with the evo disc lock, with only one key. i would argue that this setup is more secure than the "maximum" security scenario involving the fancy locksmith padlock and cable discussed in the OP. any dude with a grinder wins all. but in my scenario if a guy has a bottle jack to bust the U, he will also need another tool to snip the chain. like sheldon says, you want to force the criminal to have two different tools. and if i use the cable like the OP the bad guy will need a far less substantial snipping device. and he wouldnt care what sort of fancy padlock you have when he snipped the cable. |
Cable locks are totally insecure and can be snipped in a matter of seconds with small hand tools. Using a high-end padlock on a totally insecure cable is foolish and a waste of money.
According to Cycling Plus magazine (May, 2007) they cut a 12mm thick Masterlock cable in 2.8 seconds with 2' boltcutters, a 15mm Blok cable with 'small' boltcutters in 2.6 seconds (this lock was also defeated by a Leatherman tool in 30 seconds!), a Magnum Plus (OnGuard in the States) 25mm thick armored cable in 18.15 seconds with boltcutters, and a Masterlock 30mm armored cable in 4.6 seconds with boltcutters. |
agree with ziemas. cable locks can be busted with tools you can easily carry. chains, and especially 6 sided kryptonite chains, need something like a 42 inch bolt cutter (and a strong fat man to jump on it) or a power tool to bust. of course u locks can be busted by a relatively small bottle jack, but not if the lock is small enough and all the space inside is occupied by your rear wheel and seat tube.
again, it makes no sense to invest in a fancy padlock and use it with a cable. |
Originally Posted by old scratch
(Post 8544099)
agree with ziemas. cable locks can be busted with tools you can easily carry. chains, and especially 6 sided kryptonite chains, need something like a 42 inch bolt cutter (and a strong fat man to jump on it) or a power tool to bust. of course u locks can be busted by a relatively small bottle jack, but not if the lock is small enough and all the space inside is occupied by your rear wheel and seat tube.
again, it makes no sense to invest in a fancy padlock and use it with a cable. |
The problem with all these fancy locking methods is that I don't want to spend any more time locking my bike than a thief wants to spend stealing it. In other words, time is money and, at a certain point, it becomes cheaper to just let them steal one every once in a while than to waste a hundred hours per year locking/unlocking.
The only thing that can prevent bike theft is secure parking infrastructure, shared ownership, or a bike small and light enough to carry around with you like this: http://www.pacific-cycles.com/UserFi...all%281%29.jpg Trying to secure a human powered, human transportable vehicle from powered attacks is inherently futile. |
Since this thread is all about sharing information, here's how to add someone to your ignore list:
- login and click "user control panel" at the top/right of the browser window - click "edit ignore list" in the left column - in the "add a member to your list" text box enter the user's screen name (copy/paste is best to match spelling/text formatting/special characters, etc.) - click the "okay" button and you're done |
Originally Posted by makeinu
(Post 8544472)
The only thing that can prevent bike theft is secure parking infrastructure, |
Originally Posted by crawdaddio
(Post 8538315)
Ok, I will defend my original post a little bit here.
I had a customer come into my shop and ask about some GOOD locks for his bike. He had a very expensive ($5000-ish) canondale road bike that he wanted to start commuting on this summer. (His wheels alone cost more than my bike!) So I recommended the above locks and method. The 'Multi lock' heavy duty padlock and krypto cable are used to secure THE WHEELS. The krypto U lock is for the frame. He was happy to spend $300 on the padlock, cable, and TWO U locks (one short, one long) to protect his very expensive transport. I understand that most people won't want to spend that much cash. A krypto U lock through the frame and rear wheel will suffice for most cyclists. Be aware that they can be defeated by the right tools in under 5 minutes though. Add a secondary U lock through the frame for added protection, if you want (will take longer to cut two). Add a cable or chain through the wheels if you want to keep those too. Super glue and hardened ball bearings in your allen heads will save your components, as will locking skewers. Sorry if this info makes people mad (for some strange reason), I just thought some of you out there might want to know THE BEST WAY TO LOCK YOUR BIKE UP. The ballbearing trick is pretty slick. And, by the way, I appreciate this topic. It's a shame there are d-nozzles out there that can't just accept that advice is like oppinion, you don't have to take it to heart and can easily pass it off quietly. |
Originally Posted by Ziemas
(Post 8544056)
Cable locks are totally insecure and can be snipped in a matter of seconds with small hand tools. Using a high-end padlock on a totally insecure cable is foolish and a waste of money.
According to Cycling Plus magazine (May, 2007) they cut a 12mm thick Masterlock cable in 2.8 seconds with 2' boltcutters, a 15mm Blok cable with 'small' boltcutters in 2.6 seconds (this lock was also defeated by a Leatherman tool in 30 seconds!), a Magnum Plus (OnGuard in the States) 25mm thick armored cable in 18.15 seconds with boltcutters, and a Masterlock 30mm armored cable in 4.6 seconds with boltcutters. |
Originally Posted by areacode312
(Post 8543384)
See my point. Talk about warranted. Whatever makes you feel better tough guy. :)
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