Sorry, I was referring to deathhare's $1,100 new NJS frames.

Still, there's no point (except to make a fashion statement) to pay a premium for a used NJS frame.

I'm just curious based on the frames I have seen. If I recall correctly, both were Ishiwati tubing and had nice lugwork.

In general, I could care less about NJS certified. NJS certification may mean a particular standard - not necessary the best, but certainly not even close to the worst - but when it comes to frames, it is more about employing a frame building method that and a craft and skill not readily available in most frames these days. I'm biased toward lugged frames and but I'm even more so biased toward Italian and English frames.

Just buy the damn Matsuri OP, and if you don't like it flip it, you could definitely get at least $600 for it.

One of the things that bothers me about NJS certification of frame builders is that they are very strongly biased against *ANY* non-Japanese builder.

matsuri
 

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Tomity said he had not heard of it till I mentioned it to him.

Told me that brand (Matsuri) is for overseas sales. fyi

It's just a part of the whole protectionist philosophy of the Japanese government and culture.

And has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the frame being certified for Keirin use.