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Originally Posted by NinetiesKid
(Post 10780356)
Any suggestions for a build such as this?
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...1#post10637920 |
Originally Posted by Yellowbeard
(Post 10783191)
When a spoke loses too much of its tension its into the zone where failures happen. Too little pressure on the nipple threads mean they can unscrew themselves if there was some residual twist in the spoke or they can turn themselves from vibration. Low tension at the bottom means you lose the lateral forces that stabilize the rim at that point (I think) so you can taco the wheel, and there are fatigue issues associated with spokes that go slack, as well as ones that are too tight
Sending PM. |
how does a simple thread turn into this... ---->http://www.landpirates.org/at/images...s/gayfight.gif
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Originally Posted by gumbii
(Post 10784110)
how does a simple thread turn into this... ---->http://www.landpirates.org/at/images...s/gayfight.gif
http://slapitbackwards.files.wordpre...ang-theory.jpg |
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like this...???
http://images.eonline.com/eol_images...iew.102808.jpg |
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Originally Posted by mihlbach
(Post 10777301)
When you read Sheldon Brown, you have to consider his age and his retro-perspective. Spokes and rims are much better now than they used to be. 36 spoke wheels, though still available, are basically unnecessary for most people. In fact, it sort of rediculous that most SSFG hubs and wheelsets have so many spokes. Given the high flange hubs, deep profile rims and the lack of dish the characterize many track wheels, most people could get away with 20-28 spoke wheels with no problem. There are some advantages to having fewer spokes, but the problem with fewer spokes is that you need a better build. With 32-36 spokes you have enough redundancy that the wheel is robust to uneven and improper tension levels. This is why so many low-end wheelsets have 32 or more spokes...the factories can cheap out on building it properly with less risk of the wheel failing. When you get into fewer spokes, the wheel will only be strong, stiff, and resilient when it is built with care and attention. A 20-28 spoke wheel that is well-built with quality DB spokes is going to be stronger and stay true longer than a poorly built 36 spoke wheel with ****ty SG spokes.
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That's why I am split between getting a low spoke count custom wheelset built up or getting an errorspoke for the front. The arrospock wil cost more and look cooler (personally speaking) but using a carbon deep rim from HK built up low spoke count with nice custom rims will cost the same, but be much lighter and probably more aero too.
But still i don't get the argument that spokes take the weight on the bottom spokes. they are pre tensioned so that they will not stretch anymore. And when a wheel is properly tensioned, the hub hangs from the top of the rim by the none stretching top spokes. The rim is held up in shape by the rest of the spokes forcing the rim into it's circular shape. This is how RevX wheels keep their strength. And why the early gen wheels lost it because the hub spacers gave out and allowed the spoked to loose their tension and thus the wheel integrity. BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUYAHHHHHHHHHH! |
Originally Posted by Scrodzilla
(Post 10783045)
And to think that all the OP wanted to know was where to buy a 36 spoke wheelset...
Originally Posted by WoundedKnee
(Post 10783095)
God, I'm sorry OP. I thought there was a simple answer to my question.
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Originally Posted by Yellowbeard
(Post 10782311)
Only if there ARE no bottom spokes.
I think of compression as two forces pushing against one another. Assuming the bottom spokes hold up the bike by compression, what do they push against? The top part is easy - the elbow of the spoke could push against it's resting place in the hub. At the bottom, however, there's nothing to push down against. The spoke ends in a nipple that rests in a hole in the rim and can resist tension but not compression forces. How could that hold anything up? |
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 10795443)
I'm obviously missing something here.
I think of compression as two forces pushing against one another. Assuming the bottom spokes hold up the bike by compression, what do they push against? The top part is easy - the elbow of the spoke could push against it's resting place in the hub. At the bottom, however, there's nothing to push down against. The spoke ends in a nipple that rests in a hole in the rim and can resist tension but not compression forces. How could that hold anything up? |
Found it. http://dbox.unt.edu/wheels.pdf
BICYCLE WHEEL AS PRESTRESSED STRUCTURE. DISCUSSION AND CLOSURE Accession Number: 00681518 Language: English Abstract: A discussion of a paper with the aforementioned title by Burgoyne and Dilmaghanian, published in this journal (Volume 119, Number 3, March 1993), is presented. Discusser Papadopoulos states that the authors make several errors of history and precedence regarding prestressed wheels. The discusser also addresses structural efficiency, measurements, wheel construction, analysis, and tire behavior and bead. Discussion is followed by closure from the authors. TRIS Files: TRIS Pagination: p. 847-849 Authors: Burgoyne, C J Dilmaghanian, R Discussers: Papadopoulos, J M Publication Date: 1995-7 Serial: Journal of Engineering Mechanics Volume: 121 Issue Number: 7http://tris.trb.org/common/images/icons/more.png Publisher: American Society of Civil Engineers ISSN: 0733-9399
Originally Posted by wroomwroomoops
(Post 10782465)
There was a "Reply" to that article, published 2 years later, but my institution doesn't have access to that journal. Can you access it? Maybe there's some interesting counter argument.
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I'm not sure what OP is talking about; almost every bmx hub made comes in 36h drilling, and I know of maybe two that have EVER used 32h.
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It's also really good reading - I highly recommend it. |
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