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Lucas Brunelle - Line of Sight Trailer

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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

Lucas Brunelle - Line of Sight Trailer

Old 06-18-10, 11:35 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by cardboardhut View Post
You could say the same thing about any fat f*** at a McDonald's drive-thru. At least these guys are doing something interesting with their lives.
ok. i agree. my point is still valid.
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Old 06-19-10, 12:31 AM
  #27  
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I don't think you understood what I meant, I said I would get in his way, never said I would hit him, I would just make sure that he has to stop where he is to piss him off the same way he's pissing off everyone who have to think for him while they're driving.
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Old 06-19-10, 12:51 AM
  #28  
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It's all a moot point because no, no you wouldn't. You can talk about running down people on the internet all you want, and you can pretend you've got some preternatural sixth sense where you can sense a bike "riding dangerously" through traffic well before it gets to you, and you can somehow outmaneuver a bike in your truck to "get in his way", but in the real world you won't do it, and it's a stupid discussion in the first place.

Going back to what TJ has been saying, and what anyone who's ever ridden quickly in traffic can tell you, the cars will do their thing without noticing the cyclist, and by the time you've registered that the cyclist has weaved past, the cyclist is gone. That's the whole point, and that's how it works. Most drivers don't have a chance to react until we're gone, and that's how you can handle traffic in those situations. It's predictable because the cars don't have time to react to your presence before you're gone. That's also why I don't feel bad about it; if you never even noticed me and kept driving as if you couldn't see me, I'd be long gone because I'm not counting on you to do anything but keep going along your way.

If that pisses you off that's fine, because in actual practice we're already gone. IME most cars don't even react, by the time their brain registers that a cyclist just flew in front of them against a light, their brain also registers that the cyclist is gone and they can keep driving the same way they've been driving. Some people slam on the brakes (late, I might add), but it doesn't make a difference to how the guy on the bike is getting through.

And if you're stuck on this idea that the only reason the cyclists don't get hit is because the cars are accomodating them, I'm saying again that you only think that because you haven't experienced it yourself. It doesn't work that way.
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Old 06-19-10, 01:38 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by MatLax View Post
Well you could count on me, if I was riding my truck and I saw a guy coming my way riding like this through traffic, I would move to get right in his way just to teach him a lesson.
what the hell are you doing on this forum? leave if you're gonna say **** like this.
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Old 06-19-10, 01:41 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by cardboardhut View Post
You could say the same thing about any fat f*** at a McDonald's drive-thru. At least these guys are doing something interesting with their lives.
I suppose being idiots is "doing something". Personally, I shoot a little higher. But, that's just me.
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Old 06-19-10, 01:42 AM
  #31  
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I don't really approve of the video because those guys didn't do a good job plotting the routes in Japan: always taking crappy roads like in a mountain tunnel, heavy traffic, and steep narrow paths prevalent in rural area. ... Probably couldn't read the maps; not all maps are written in the white people's tongues, you see? Should've hired a good translator.

P.S. Yeah, imagine my surprise when I saw civilized people talking in non-Asian languages few decades ago. Just kidding. But you know the first English sentence I have ever learned by 100% certainty is, "I am full."
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Old 06-19-10, 01:45 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
When you watch a Lucas video keep in mind most of the riders in it ride all day in core traffic.
As shown by the guy who laid his bike down because the motorist did not consider slamming on the brakes to be in his best interest. Depending on the generosity of the world around you for your own physical well being is a suckers play. The only guarantee is that one day someone will not be generous.
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Old 06-19-10, 01:53 AM
  #33  
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Oh, sorry. Clearly, that guy wasn't part of "most".
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Old 06-19-10, 02:26 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by oldfixguy View Post
Depending on the generosity of the world around you for your own physical well being is a suckers play. The only guarantee is that one day someone will not be generous.
+10 from me.
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Old 06-19-10, 02:28 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Tomo_Ishi View Post
I don't really approve of the video because those guys didn't do a good job plotting the routes in Japan: always taking crappy roads like in a mountain tunnel, heavy traffic, and steep narrow paths prevalent in rural area. ... Probably couldn't read the maps; not all maps are written in the white people's tongues, you see? Should've hired a good translator.

P.S. Yeah, imagine my surprise when I saw civilized people talking in non-Asian languages few decades ago. Just kidding. But you know the first English sentence I have ever learned by 100% certainty is, "I am full."
LOL. I couldn't help but think how I live on a street with no name and in a house with no number. To this day I have no idea how I get mail. I ask the mailman all the time if he's taking care of himself because if he dies I'll never get another piece of mail. We laugh about it - he lives just a few blocks away. Our kids go tot the same schools, we see each other at soccer games and all that.
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Old 06-19-10, 04:36 AM
  #36  
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The assumption that a car will always maintain its trajectory is fatally flawed, regardless of whether they see the cyclist or not. Drivers do unexpected things all the time. Cars make sudden turns or lane changes without looking or slowing down or signaling all the time. I see it everyday. Riding in the way LB describes it in the video clip (in the gaps), greatly elevates your risk. Regardless of your skill, the skills or behaviors of the drivers are simply beyond your control. Weaving around at high speed through traffic, riding in people's blind spots, simply increases your risk of getting nailed.

There is also a double standard here.....people who ride like ******bags rely on the drivers to not drive like ******bags. So don't whine when a doucebag driver turns into you or runs you over.


That said, I used to enjoy LB videos. Some of the older ones had a nice flow to them, such as the San Francisco video or Monster Track V. The newer videos don't seem to have the same sense of smoothness and flow. Its seems more like the goal of the newer videos is just to show off the riskiest fastest riding, which is not always the most interesting IMO.

Last edited by mihlbach; 06-19-10 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 06-19-10, 04:57 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by mihlbach View Post
There is also a double standard here.....people who ride like ******bags rely on the drivers to not drive like ******bags. So don't whine when a doucebag driver turns into you or runs you over.
The conservation of ******bags-ness in a shared lane (an extension of mihlbach's hypothesis on the lane mechanics):

The total quantity of ******bags-ness of drivers and cyclists sharing a lane is constant at all time.

So ******bags-ness of you and drivers are kept in check. And, I think the absolute quantity of ******bags-ness depends on the traffic condition and the time of the day. (what else?) A cool concept, I m gonna remember that.
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Old 06-19-10, 06:19 AM
  #38  
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For me, this discussion and any like it boils down to one simple concept - respect. If you conduct yourself in a manner that is respectful to the world around you then you will find the creases in life that allow you bend some of the rules and realities to your advantage. This is the real skillset.

No one in any walk has some special bubble around them that lets them behave in dangerous, uncaring, disrespectful ways all day everyday and walk away. Messengers have no bubble. Some behave with a certain amount of respect for the world around them, pick up skills and find the creases. This is all a byproduct of behaving with a certain respect. Others do not. They do not fare well in the end. Very few people care and even fewer cry. Hell, even their companies first concern is getting another messenger to their location so that set of modeling pictures won't be late getting 5 blocks down the street.

The people in the video behaved with no respect. That is a choice.
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Old 06-19-10, 08:26 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by mihlbach View Post
Drivers do unexpected things all the time. Cars make sudden turns or lane changes without looking or slowing down or signaling all the time.
You just made me remember something that happened to a guy I knew back in the days, he was driving through traffic when he decided to change lane to his left, he didn't check his blind spot and didn't signal, when he changed lane hit the side of a bus he didn't see and he reacted by moving his car to the right instead because he wasn't thinking and he hit the bus to his right. Nobody around him could see that coming, now just imagine what would have happened if a guy on his bike had been riding in between his car and one of the buses at this time? No more legs for him!

I wonder how many of these riders would stop if they felt they touched a car just a bit... With cars it very convenient, you take note of the license plate and there's a way to find the person who scratched you car, if a bike rider scratches your car then, just pay for the paint, too bad for you?
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Old 06-19-10, 08:46 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by MatLax View Post
Blah, blah, blah.
..
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Old 06-19-10, 09:22 AM
  #41  
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Guys, they're racing. Of course they ride fast. When you race, you ride fast.
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Old 06-19-10, 09:22 AM
  #42  
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Where else are messengers going to race huh? It's what's they do. The cars are merely obstacles, in all my years I've never accidentally scratched a car. I've knocked a couple mirrors off kilter with my bag but the only damaged ones were quite deliberate. I agree with the other post about LB's earlier vids having more flow, more messenger centric I believe. I myself couldn't imagine ripping through Tokyo not knowing how the drivers drive, least not without some time to get used to the flow of the locals.

I do have take my bike to NYC next time, and I'd love to do the Vegas Strip drag.

...BTW depending on a certain % of the drivers out to be d o u c h e bags is part of the game, it is a fairly low % though. Without any scientific data to back me up I'd venture the % of AlleyCat riders who end up hurt/killed in traffic is very very low when compared to all the other people/traffic, traffic/traffic, people/people interactions in the same city that evening. Most aren't going to push through an impossible hole but either wait it out or find another way around, decisions are just made quickly and generally without stopping.

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Old 06-19-10, 09:49 AM
  #43  
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Traffic Jammer,

You strike me as the type of guy who earned his bones and knows how to behave given circumstances. I don't think I know anyone who has anything against AlleyCat races. I think you are right - how else are messengers going to kick up the dust? But, the video that started this thread is not people (messengers or other) kicking up the dust. It's a group of guys giving everyone of us a bad name. Their behavior is inexcusable. But, to be honest, I seem to think that way about most fixed gear videos I see.
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Old 06-19-10, 10:09 AM
  #44  
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I can fully respect your opinion as well, alot of the "self tape" youtube aren't we cool vids are beyond narcissistic, and many times beyond the skillset of them's filming. Subject matter aside LB is a master of the traffic cam. When he gets right in there I can feel it in my guts, like watching a well done vert skate video. This type of behavior however is as old as time begate. Kids racing Pa's best horse through the town square splashing folks with mud, steam powered cars scaring horse and rider off the road. It's part of our genetic makeup that has led to Redbull powered events and X-Game type of entertainment.

I do believe the MASH jokers started out this way (i didn't like their vids, boring as hell IMHO), now they market their own Cinelli frame set and get a nod from the TOC in order to follow the race course. All we need now to complete the circle is a messenger powered UCI team to stir up the pro ranks. I do believe it's time to go ride downtown.

I think I'll link this thread to LB on facebook.

Last edited by TRaffic Jammer; 06-19-10 at 10:21 AM.
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Old 06-19-10, 02:42 PM
  #45  
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To each his own, but when they were screwing around at the very end, on the Soviet memorial here in Berlin, thats not cool. Thousands of soldiers are buried there and they are using it for a playground. I really disagree with that.
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Old 06-19-10, 04:24 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by AModernDrunkard View Post
To each his own, but when they were screwing around at the very end, on the Soviet memorial here in Berlin, thats not cool. Thousands of soldiers are buried there and they are using it for a playground. I really disagree with that.
Why so morose? Perhaps the soldiers to whom the memorial is dedicated would have appreciated that people can now celebrate and enjoy themselves, rather that fight in wars and die young.
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Old 06-19-10, 04:53 PM
  #47  
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What's worse is that they don't consider how they are screwing with the drivers. I've almost hit riders and pedestrians before, and it is one of the most shocking experiences. Some riders operate under the assumption that all drivers are d*cks that don't care about cyclists, so what's the harm in giving them a scare, right? That's not true.

What's worse is what if a driver is obeying the traffic laws and still takes down one of these dudes on the bikes? That's a lot of unnecessary stress.

It's no different than the d*ckhead motorcyclists that speed through town and on the freeways doing tricks.

Like I tell my friends that want to speed around town on motorcycles: "Take it to the race track and get all the thrills you want with a much lower risk of death." For cyclists, they can go to the velodrome, hills, mountains, dirt jumps, skate park, criteriums, or road races. There is no excuse for this.

EDIT: I guarantee that if these guys spend one day a week training or racing in the aforementioned places designed for bikes they would get all of that thrill seeking out of their system and they won't feel the need to do it in the roadways.

That dude is too old to be doing this crap anyway. Grow up.

Last edited by carleton; 06-19-10 at 05:18 PM.
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Old 06-21-10, 02:07 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by elTwitcho View Post
How would you know what the racers do or don't want cars to do when you haven't experienced it yourself?
Touche.
I never got stuck by lightening either but I'ld imagine it to hurt like hell and I might be in a near death experience, if not dead. Just a thought.

Originally Posted by TRaffic Jammer View Post
More chances are taken when racing no doubt, but hardly tossing ourselves in front of cars all the time. What you see in an NYC race is not typical.

^^ I'm referring to same direction car/bike, not crossing in front in the intersection, tossing yourself in front of cross traffic depending on them to stop for you is indeed foolish, no arguments there.
Now there's a point I can wrap my head around better. Though I can't say I'm totally convinced, but I haven't seen it and to each his own
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Old 06-21-10, 02:24 PM
  #49  
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I took my motorcycle to the track. It was fun but didn't do for me what a hard ride in the mountains does and the "personalities" that are attracted to the track turn me off.

My time at the velodrome has been wonderful. Show up, do laps, have a couple little races with some guys who are training and go home. Relaxed. Rarely is organised track time relaxed. It's either RACE or RACE. The appeal of ripping around the streets is not for the speed but the for appeal of ripping around the streets. "Taking it to the track" is a common mantra of the motorcyclists I've known over 20 years and for some it just doesn't wash.

At 40, I like to zip around in traffic on my bicycle, I like to ride my sportbike in the mountains, I like the velodrome. These guys won;t be at the local track any time soon, it is simply not for them. As a guy who likes cars as well, they will get spooked enough one day to chill a bit or will simply move on to another "thing to do".

Not agreeing with the video, just saying that "take it to the track" doesn't apply to the thrill here.
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Old 06-21-10, 05:30 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
EDIT: I guarantee that if these guys spend one day a week training or racing in the aforementioned places designed for bikes they would get all of that thrill seeking out of their system and they won't feel the need to do it in the roadways.

That dude is too old to be doing this crap anyway. Grow up.
Thing is, couriers/messengers, historically, seem not to have fit in on the track. I've heard of dudes saying that track racers were sketched out by their dodgy appearance and beat up bikes. For the older generation, pre-hipster, track-bike-riding couriers, alleycats and street racing makes some sense. They have developed street riding skills - weaving through traffic, plotting routes, etc - that aren't directly transferable to a track race. And it seems like a lot of them tried it and didn't dig it.

Of course - messengers racing is negative for drivers - just like messengers working can be. If you ride eight hours a day, in traffic, taking risks to pull in more pay, you'll probably end up pretty skilled (also, occassionally injured, but...).

The trouble is, fixed gear bikes exploded in popularity, amongst kids (like me) who aren't messengers, don't have developed street riding skills. Being a messenger become a bizarre cult/fashion thing - for people who aren't messengers. Alleycats stopped being a messenger thing, and became a hipster thing as much as anything else. A lot of people who aren't old school messengers ride like they think messengers ride (inaccurately, focusing on an idealised version of one style of messenger cyclist).

So, you have a whole bunch of younger kids, in their teens and twenties, who're riding fixed on the street, and organising or coming along to street races. They don't wear sporting gear, or train for the sport, or whatever. They have a bit of a young, rebellious streak. They're attracted to the mythos of riding brakeless and think they're part of something radical (which they generally aren't). It's like skateboarding, or whatever else.

Would those kids get the same thing out of a velodrome? I don't know. They'd be safer, and less alienating to motorists - but it would lack a lot of the rebellious pose.
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