calamarichris

Last year, I offered to drive a fellow cyclist friend to an event I was doing. I wasn't aware that he was planning on Pirating it, and I was a little surprised that he did so, given that there were no 7-11's (or buildings) anywhere on the route. But in his defense, he brought a camelbak and plenty of food, and was planning on doing the whole ride unsupported.
But the volunteers at these events are notoriously generous and supportive, and they talked him into taking some of the food & drink even after he explained that he hadn't paid and was riding unsupported.
I was so touched, that I donated $100 to the organizer the next time I saw him, and I even ended up volunteering at one of their events, and spending a fair chunk of my own coin on Hammer products to give out.
Tour de Foothills is probably going to see an increase in pirates this year, and perhaps even turned off a few people who now aren't going to participate now because they didn't approach their event with generosity and bounty in their hearts the way Adventurecorps did last year. A charity event is no time to betray any hint of cynicism. We're all honorable and generous people. It makes a lot more sense to let the riders police each other than to let your staff and volunteers do it, because you know we will.

mrflip69

^Catch more flies with honey.

Good will goes a long way! I did 1 of the free TdF sponsored training rides, and it was amazing how much support they had for again, a free ride. (beer, lunch by Qdobo/Jersey Mikes).. rivaled some paid rides I mentioned earlier.

Remember, some people actually come out of town to participate in a group ride in your back yard. We're lucky to have great scenery/weather local to us, pretty much up and down California!

nosignature

I sympathize with some of the reactions in this thread, I really do. But imagine being a triathlete? Entry fees of $120 + are routine, yet I've never seen a triathlon offer more than water, electrolytes drinks, energy bars and fruit to participants.

Centuries (in general, not just tour de foothills) are absurdly overpriced when you consider that you're just riding public roads, but between the rest stops (well stocked at last years tdf, included soup, chili, coffee, and snacks galore) and the post-ride meal, you at least get something in return. marathon runners and triathletes pay for the same 'privilege' of a mass participation event on public roads and waters, but really get nothing other than 'thanks, here's a t-shirt.'

I guess the moral is that an amateur athlete in any sport and his $$$ are easily parted.

GP

There's a lot more support needed in tris. The swim needs to have lifeguards and the closed roads need police support and traffic control.

zzzwillzzz

or you could race crits on closed courses. for $25 i can race for an hour and if i race another category it's usually only $10 for additional races. last year i made more money than i spent. of course the view isn't as nice as most centuries with the view being a bunch of old man asses ahead of you and the lap card.

socalrider

I know the ride is expensive but the promoters of the ride have also thrown 2 fully supported training rides that would rival most rides. Training rides with courses marked, pictures taken and fully stocked rest stops.

If the free ones were as good as most paid rides, I imagine what it is going to be like for the full ride..

cdp8

A friend asked me to "ride" this with him. (He's 5'6" & 150, so I'd see him at the start and maybe the finish if he wanted to wait for a couple of hours .) I decided not to because I was turned off by the price and because I live nearby and ride on these roads all the time. I didn't flinch at paying Planet Ultra's fees for Mulholland and Heartbreak because $80 is cheaper than $95 and because I don't live in those areas and I'm not familiar with the roads, public restrooms, 7-11's, etc. If I lived in Solvang, I doubt I would pay for any of those centuries either.

To be political for just a moment,

Get out and vote tomorrow, unless like me, you already have.

Hendo252 

Nosig-

You are right that in most cases the organizers don't pay for road access, and if the route is on public roads anybody that wants to ride the route alongside would be welcome in most cases.

The issues arise at the sag stops and endpoints.

Even when they are at public parks, most cities will require a substantial fee for the use of the park for a special event. Ditto for extra CHP or police help/oversite/traffic mitigation. And the catering company isn't cheap, etc etc etc.

Even the porta-potties are expensive, especially since weekend delivery/pickup is often required.

Most Century rides will have a two or three sag stops as well as the start/finish location, so multiple rental fees will be required.

Sag wagons may be volunteers, but often the vehicles will be rented (especially if they have special racks/trailers).

It all adds up! And if you have ever arranged a large wedding in a public park, or helped arrange a High School Reunion or similar event you know how the costs add up.

And don't forget the liability insurance; every time somebody gets hurt the lawsuits are filed. And that doesn't mean just in YOUR event; if somebody wins a big judgement at a ride in San Diego, the cost of insurance for rides in San Luis Obispo is affected.

And often there is a nonprofit that benefits from the ride; it is a fundraiser for them so that amount is on top of the actual costs.

So.... if you just stay on the public unlimited-access roads, then you should be welcome and I can't ever recall seeing anybody hassled for doing that, and can't be called a Pirate for doing so.

But not many folks do that; they want to hang with the paid riders at the start/sag/finish areas, relieve themselves at the porta-potties, help themselves to some drinks and/or food, etc. Those folks are just thieves, even if they aren't man enough to admit it to themselves.

My $0.02.

nosignature

I understand this, and I think we're actually in agreement with each other. The gist of my post, which may have been lost, is that I'm impressed with how much a century rider can get in return for their registration fee as opposed to a triathlon, given the additional expenses of insurance, rest stops, SAG, etc.

Johnonaschwinn

immature comment removed.

Hendo252 

Johnonaschwinn-

Have you even read this thread? I don't think anybody is even suggesting you shouldn't be able to ride on any unrestricted public-access road.

BUT -- if you relax in the park area where the event has paid a reservation fee, used their porta-potties, taken their food or enjoyed any of the other event benefits, then you are a thief.

Judging from your last sentance, I'm guessing you are an adolescent and I wonder how many taxes you really pay, but that is really beside the point of this thread.

socalrider

before you go spouting off here are the list of accomplishments from that over the hill - overweight guy who also happens to the race promoter for the TDF.. When you can even scratch a few of these then spout off.

Athletic Accomplishments:
16 x Ironman Triathlon Finisher
2.4 mile swim/112 mile bike/26.2 mile run
24 x Marathon Finisher
26.2 Mile Run
21 x (Half) Ironman Triathlon Finisher
1.2 mile swim/56 mile bike/13.1 mile run
1996 ECO Challenge British Columbia Race
7 days, 12 hours
14 x Double Century Ride Finisher
200 mile bike
1 x Triple Century Ride Finisher
300 mile bike
2 x Time Triple Crown Double Century Winner
15 x Vegas Challenge Finisher
265 mile bike/13.1 mile run
Baja 500- solo in the PRO-22 division for the Honda Team

TJClay

Yep, that sounds like most fat old guys I know..........

rooftest

OK - this thread is now turning into a weird "my friend's is bigger than yours, I bet" contest.

socalrider

For those who rode it, it was definitely not a ride in the park. A lot of Cat 1/2 riders did the ride and the pace was anything but leisurely.

One of the tandem team were 2 Cat 2 riders and they rode from the base of gmr to the shack in 38 minutes. Just an easy weekend stroll.

mtrider05

That says nothing about the ride itself. There is a ride out here that's totally pan flat on straight roads that will destroy you. Just because fast guys showed up doesn't mean it was a good ride.

robertkat

Maybe we can just start listing the accomplishments of people we know. Like a good friend of mine. He's done over 30 200km permanents this year alone. Another friend of mine not only won the Baja races a few times, he was a major factor in getting the whole thing started and owned his own team.

rooftest

That's nothing! My cousin's roommate met a guy once who ran a sub 4 minute mile.

socalrider

The accomplishments above are of the Race Promoter for the TDF - just your average old slow guy.

lesiz

They don't say what they mean by "pirating". If it means only being on the same roads at the same time, then they have no right to this kind of claim on public roads.

But I think they probably mean making use of the SAG facilities, food, restrooms, etc. There they do have a right, this kind of piracy is theft and if they really wanted to be badasses they could turn you in because theft is against the law.

I understand in the age of commonplace theft of entertainment content on the internet that stealing from anyone as long as you can get away with it is considered OK. It's a free country, one has the right to scrape his value system from the gutter.

Mr. Beanz

The post has been removed from facebook. But in the discussion/comments under the post, he later said that he hoped the locals that frequent these roads would find another road to ride for the day.


I'm sure he meant pirates not only as stealing the food but also as riding along the course without paying the fee. I figure that since most comments I have seen from promoters, this is one of their ideas of pirating.

lesiz

That casts a different shadow on it. Public roads that we all pay taxes to support! That's pretty thin ice for ride management to be skating on. Whatever they have in mind to "expose" "pirates", depending on what is, could get them in trouble.

Has this been a significant problem for them? I wonder.

Mr. Beanz

I'm wondering what they did and did it work?

Johnonaschwinn

Hi everyone, I need to apologize to bike forums and the regional discussion board and everyone who has read or participated in this thread for my immature hurtful comment. I am very sorry. This has made me really think about what i say on forums. John

rooftest

That's why I read these forums!