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Santana Noventa Disc Brake upgrade

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Santana Noventa Disc Brake upgrade

Old 05-28-20, 02:12 PM
  #1  
marcdanziger 
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Santana Noventa Disc Brake upgrade

I've got a late 90's Noventa that I've had since new. As I've ...aged... I've developed arthritis in my wrists, and struggled with braking on my single bike - so stepped back from riding. I've since bought a single with hydraulic brakes (Specialized Roubaix) and love them - thinking of swapping the Noventa over to discs (in spite of Santana's dislike) so we can ride it again.

I have a friend who builds frames as a hobby (owns a machine shop, welds Ti, etc. etc. - is competent). He & I are talking about adding mounting points to the stock forks and stay, and likely swapping the dropouts to thru (or just getting hubs that bolt on like a track bike).

Scanning the forums here, it seems that

a) hydraulics are a good idea for a tandem;
b) adapting a tandem frame is pretty rare

Welcome comments from folks with more experience than I have...
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Old 05-28-20, 09:02 PM
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WheelsNT
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The differences in the fork loading between rim brakes and disc are non-trivial. I don’t think you want to try to modify the fork. Just get a new disc fork. The Noventa was probably designed for an Arai drum brake — does it have a pac-man hanger on the lower NDS chainstay? That chainstay would be engineered to take the braking force, so a good spot to start for modifications.
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Old 05-30-20, 06:17 AM
  #3  
Alcanbrad
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+1 on the disc ready fork. Don’t skimp there. Santana’s may use a different diameter steering tube so your selection may be limited. I would also recommend speaking with a frame builder first regarding the chainstay. I previously explored converting our mid 90’s Santana Visa to couplers and disc and spoke to someone at Bilinky and he said he would have to inspect the chain stay to insure it was strong enough to be adapted to disc brakes.

i don’t know if this is an option, but does Magura still make hydraulic rim brakes?

Don’t give up, it is more fun to ride than to not.
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Old 08-15-20, 05:04 PM
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The story so far...

I listened and bought a Rodriguez fork; found some used Rolf disc brake wheels.

Now I need a gruppo. The bike came all-Campy, so I may offset the cost with a vintage parts sale...

I escalated to Shimano corporate and they have no hydraulic road levers that aren't Di2. They have no Di2 levers that are 3 x ... so it looks like we'll wind up with a compact 2 x 11 drivetrain, which covers a decent set of gears.

Torn between eTap and Di2; we'll have to change the cranks too.

It looks like we'll have to modify the braze-ons to support hoses and maybe wires and add disc mounts (and likely some reinforcement) to the left chainstay.

...the adventure continues.
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Old 08-16-20, 12:25 PM
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Do you know for a fact that you can develop enough braking power through your arthritic hands to stop a tandem? Hydraulics have less power loss through cable friction and other inefficiencies but there is still no external power boost that you get with a carís power brakes which are driven by the engine. The bike stops from your squeezing ó thatís it. Mechanical advantage increases applied force but not power or total work done, and itís the work of converting kinetic energy into heat that stops the bike. Be careful.
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Old 08-16-20, 01:04 PM
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starting from scratch ... Safer: put the fork caliper on the front of the right blade.. braking forces* push the axle into the dropouts more..
rather than than out of them like on the back of the left blade. ... seen this done on tandems..

*Strongest torque axis becomes the brake pad on the disc rather than the hub axis ,

that's 1 reason why the 'lawyer lips' fork tips have given way to through axles on the latest disc bike production..
Bought a new fork? ... never\mind .






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Old 08-17-20, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by marcdanziger View Post
I

Torn between eTap and Di2; we'll have to change the cranks too.
.
We love our eTap, but that is up to you. You might not need a new crankset. Conversion of triple to double by moving the outer chainring to the center position is easily done. Talk to House of Tandems in TX. Good luck.
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Old 08-17-20, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by marcdanziger View Post

Torn between eTap and Di2; we'll have to change the cranks too.
For installation on an older existing frame (like yours) I wouldn't even consider Di2 as a candidate due to the wire routing issues.

One vote for eTap.
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Old 08-29-20, 04:44 PM
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In 1023 I modified our 96 Noventa to take a rear disk brake.
I fabricated a mounting tab similar to one from Paragon Machine Works, but cut from 1/4" steel. This was TIG welded to the left chainstay, no reinforcement required as this was the reaction arm mount for the drum brake. Care is needed here when welding as the difference in thickness between the tab (6mm) and WT of the chainstay (~1.5mm) but a competent welder can do this easily. You'll need a jig to hold the tab in the correct place.

I fitted a Hope tandem caliper from sjscycles. Because of the non standard placement of the caliper I used a 203-180 adapter.
A DT Swiss screw on adapter mounted the ventilated Hope V2 203mm disc to the original Edco hub.

The master cylinder is fitted under the handlebars with a custom bracket holding it in place and a new activation cam made to replace the original MTB lever. A short run of cable connects this to the Ergo brake lever.

We've lightened the bike considerably, removing the rear cantilever and the Arai drum brake. And the rear brake works (can lock the wheel) and heat control is awesome.

Last edited by fastbike; 08-29-20 at 05:59 PM.
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Old 02-24-21, 06:03 PM
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I just bought a Noventa and it came with a upgrade from Santana. They welded a piece on and painted it. Pics attached.
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Old 02-26-21, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by conspiratemus1 View Post
Do you know for a fact that you can develop enough braking power through your arthritic hands to stop a tandem? Hydraulics have less power loss through cable friction and other inefficiencies but there is still no external power boost that you get with a carís power brakes which are driven by the engine. The bike stops from your squeezing ó thatís it. Mechanical advantage increases applied force but not power or total work done, and itís the work of converting kinetic energy into heat that stops the bike. Be careful.
that's where the Shimano 4 piston calipers shine. 1 finger full braking power with the least amount of effort. they are a huge difference in effort over my magura's and how much effort it takes to accurate them.
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