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Replaceable rear derailleur hanger on our Calfee

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Replaceable rear derailleur hanger on our Calfee

Old 04-27-13, 02:48 PM
  #1  
DubT
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Replaceable rear derailleur hanger on our Calfee

I am giving strong consideration to converting the non replaceable rear derailleur hanger on our Calfee to replaceable.

Our daughter has a new Cannondale Evo and the derailleur hanger is a neat design that slides on the frame and uses two small screws and the axle to retain it.

I found one at a local shop here in Owasso, Oklahoma and when we get home I am going to take a really close look at making the modification. Last July the rear derailleur got into,the rear wheel and bent the hanger and the threads were ovalized. It was straightened and retreaded and works fine but it is ovalized. I would really like to have a replaceable hanger so I will probable be performing surgery on our Calfee.

My plan is to use my Dremel with a cut-off disc to cit off the hanger and install the hanger and then use the hanger as a guide for drilling the holes.

Any suggestions on how to drill the holes in the titanium hanger.
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Old 04-27-13, 05:53 PM
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If the derailleur hanger is off less than a mm their will be chain rub and shifting will be effected. I would talk to Calfee before replacing the hanger as the hanger alignment is important on a frame.
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Old 04-27-13, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by tandem rider View Post
If the derailleur hanger is off less than a mm their will be chain rub and shifting will be effected. I would talk to Calfee before replacing the hanger as the hanger alignment is important on a frame.
After I install the new hanger I will take it to a shop and have them check and align the hanger if it needs to be aligned. I had to have that done after we bent it last year. I do not like the Calfee design as it is one piece and not field replaceable, the frame has to be sent back to Calfee and they have to remove and replace the one piece unit, a very expensive proposition. Their suggestion was to drill it out and use one of the internal threaded nuts to hold the derailleur. In writing this I think that will be my first step, if that works great, if not i will replace the hanger.
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Old 04-27-13, 07:42 PM
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The replacable hanger on our Santana was a somewhat touchy thing. When that tandem was originally delivered to the shop, the box fell over and bent the hanger which cracked. We got a replacement hanger, but that underscored how careful we had to be from then on.

The Calfee hanger is fairly beefy (aka strong). If it ain't really broke... leave it alone. At least until you find a real need to ship the frame to Calfee. Something really important like... a new paint job, or Di2, etc
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Old 04-27-13, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by twocicle View Post
The replacable hanger on our Santana was a somewhat touchy thing. When that tandem was originally delivered to the shop, the box fell over and bent the hanger which cracked. We got a replacement hanger, but that underscored how careful we had to be from then on.

The Calfee hanger is fairly beefy (aka strong). If it ain't really broke... leave it alone. At least until you find a real need to ship the frame to Calfee. Something really important like... a new paint job, or Di2, etc
You do not know me very well, why send it back to Calfee for them to replace the current hanger with one just like it. I do not know what your Santana replaceable hanger looked like but the new Cannondale hanger appears to me to be an excellent design. I will, as I said drill out the threaded hole and install the threaded insert. If I am not happy with the outcome then I will install the Cannondale hanger.
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Old 04-27-13, 11:01 PM
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If the Calfee dropout is titanium, pay close attention not to heat the material if cutting.

Use water as a coolant, if you see steam, stop and let it cool.

If you remove material with a sanding disc, find an acceptable process to prevent hot spots.

If it is titanium be concerned in regards to cleaning / cleanup, some solvents can cause embrittlement to titanium.

PK
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Old 04-28-13, 12:33 AM
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If you modify it to take a replaceable hanger you could also make an extra thick hanger like I did for our C'dale. Then you can use the 130mm wheels when you want to just by swapping the hangers.
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Old 04-28-13, 02:06 AM
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Originally Posted by DubT View Post
You do not know me very well, why send it back to Calfee for them to replace the current hanger with one just like it. I do not know what your Santana replaceable hanger looked like but the new Cannondale hanger appears to me to be an excellent design. I will, as I said drill out the threaded hole and install the threaded insert. If I am not happy with the outcome then I will install the Cannondale hanger.
Answers:
1) Because there isn't a lineup of people here complaining of hosing their hangers - yours appears to be something of a one-off.
2) Because you are asking how to do it, indicates maybe experimenting with a newish Calfee, titanium material and a hacksaw (exaggerating for effect) may not be the best thing to do yourself.
3) Because you keep using the term "threaded insert" instead of "helicoil" :/
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Old 04-28-13, 04:13 AM
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A threaded insert is not always a helicoil.
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Old 04-28-13, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Dean V View Post
A threaded insert is not always a helicoil.
Dean, you are absolutely correct. I have one of these hanging on a hook in my garage. https://wheelsmfg.com/dropout-saver.html

it looks like I have 5 options.

1. Do nothing, it is working.

2. Drill out the existing hanger and install the drop out saver.

3. Cut the bottom off of the existing hanger and install the Cannondale Cadd 10 replaceable hanger (UPC #88460331362.

4. Install thicker dropouts on both sides and be able to use 130mm spaced wheels.

5. Send the frame back to Calfee and have them install a new RH hanger,

Since I have never drilled titanium I was asking advice on how to do it, Paul has provided some great input.
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Old 04-28-13, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by DubT View Post
Dean, you are absolutely correct. I have one of these hanging on a hook in my garage. https://wheelsmfg.com/dropout-saver.html

it looks like I have 5 options.

1. Do nothing, it is working.

2. Drill out the existing hanger and install the drop out saver.

3. Cut the bottom off of the existing hanger and install the Cannondale Cadd 10 replaceable hanger (UPC #88460331362.

4. Install thicker dropouts on both sides and be able to use 130mm spaced wheels.

5. Send the frame back to Calfee and have them install a new RH hanger,

Since I have never drilled titanium I was asking advice on how to do it, Paul has provided some great input.

How does the Cannondale drop out slide onto the frame after you cut off the hanger?
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Old 04-28-13, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by waynesulak View Post
How does the Cannondale drop out slide onto the frame after you cut off the hanger?
take a look at this site: https://www.cannondaleexperts.com/Can...158_p_271.html

i think that you will be able to see how it fits.
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Old 04-28-13, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean V View Post
A threaded insert is not always a helicoil.
Originally Posted by DubT View Post
Dean, you are absolutely correct. I have one of these hanging on a hook in my garage. https://wheelsmfg.com/dropout-saver.html
Regardless of the type of insert this isn't a clunky chunk of metal hanger we are talking about, it is a fairly svelte Ti hanger - not much to work with. There is precious little hanger material around the existing hanger threads. Reeming it out to fit a "plug" of any kind would only make that hanger point weaker.

Last edited by twocicle; 04-28-13 at 01:32 PM.
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Old 04-28-13, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by twocicle View Post
Regardless of the type of insert this isn't a clunky chunk of metal hanger we are talking about, it is a fairly svelte Ti hanger - not much to work with. There is precious little hanger material around the existing hanger threads. Reeming it out to fit a "plug" of any kind would only make that hanger point weaker.
My word man, I do not know how you modify things but you are the one who used ream, not me. The hole would not be reamed. I would position my portable drill press in the correct position and then lay the bike on its side and support it as required. I would clamp the hanger to the bed of the drill press and then very carefully and precisely drill the hole, I will probably do it in steps, taking off just a little bit of material with each pass until I can safely use the 15/32 bit. This is the exact solution that Calfee suggested, stating that they had done it several times.

Wayne
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Old 04-28-13, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by DubT View Post
My word man, I do not know how you modify things but you are the one who used ream, not me. The hole would not be reamed. I would position my portable drill press in the correct position and then lay the bike on its side and support it as required. I would clamp the hanger to the bed of the drill press and then very carefully and precisely drill the hole, I will probably do it in steps, taking off just a little bit of material with each pass until I can safely use the 15/32 bit. This is the exact solution that Calfee suggested, stating that they had done it several times.
Wayne
Very strange you have a problem with the word "ream", as that is precisely what you described doing, albeit with a drill bit and not a specialized reamer.
ie: definition: "Reaming expands existing holes slightly, to produce tightly toleranced holes.". Which part of that is offensive to you?
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Old 04-28-13, 07:36 PM
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Clamp well, low rpm, light pressure, quality drill bit, and probably cutting wax, likely Boelube.

As for the reaming vs drilling...drilling often produces a lower quality hole that is not round. Drilling can remove a lot of material quickly.

A reamer requires an existing hole and will give a round hole of close tolerance.

So typically, a hole is drilled, then reamed.

As for those inserts, yes they can work well. Whether the insert or Heli-coil, the existing hole will be enlarged.

Not offended by any of it.

PK
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Old 04-28-13, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by twocicle View Post
Very strange you have a problem with the word "ream", as that is precisely what you described doing, albeit with a drill bit and not a specialized reamer.
ie: definition: "Reaming expands existing holes slightly, to produce tightly toleranced holes.". Which part of that is offensive to you?
My perception was that your use of reeming, indicated to me a rough shod approach, not a controlled process.

Sorry for my over reaction.

Wayne
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Old 04-28-13, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by PMK View Post
Clamp well, low rpm, light pressure, quality drill bit, and probably cutting wax, likely Boelube.

As for the reaming vs drilling...drilling often produces a lower quality hole that is not round. Drilling can remove a lot of material quickly.

A reamer requires an existing hole and will give a round hole of close tolerance.

So typically, a hole is drilled, then reamed.

As for those inserts, yes they can work well. Whether the insert or Heli-coil, the existing hole will be enlarged.

Not offended by any of it.

PK

Thanks PK!
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Old 04-29-13, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by DubT View Post
My perception was that your use of reeming, indicated to me a rough shod approach, not a controlled process.

Sorry for my over reaction.

Wayne
NP. It's one of those issues with doing quick posts online... intent is not always clear. Perhaps my fault.

While PMK clarified "drilling" vs "reaming", I was only concerned that losing hanger material - enough to fit the plug you mentioned, is nonetheless removing more material than just the threads to retap it.

I am nervous for you. This task seems to be something you could leave until the winter months.
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