Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Tandem Cycling
Reload this Page >

Clipless Pedal/Shoe question

Notices
Tandem Cycling A bicycle built for two. Want to find out more about this wonderful world of tandems? Check out this forum to talk with other tandem enthusiasts. Captains and stokers welcome!

Clipless Pedal/Shoe question

Old 08-27-15, 07:40 PM
  #26  
Senior Member
 
chojn1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Sugar Land, TX
Posts: 298

Bikes: Eriksen Tandem, DIY CF Tandem, Aluminum Tandem, Lightspeed, Cervelo, Specialized, Trek

Liked 12 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by fxsvelo
My stoker is small and light and hasn't the leverage (short foot) or the mass (<100 lbs) to use SPDs. We tried Crank Bros. Candy and that wasn't much better so we gave up and she uses toe clips and straps.

Studies show that clipless isn't any more efficient than regular flat pedals, so what the heck. She's happy with that. The only down side is that when I test ride solo, I use a very small bungee to hold the cage to the crank arm so the cage doesn't hit the ground. The bungees live in the trunk bag, so no big deal. It doesn't look as cool as clipless, but we're beyond caring about that.

My wife is 110lb and a non-biker. She would not consider clipless on her single bike. But on a tandem, she would not ride without the frogs. I do occasionally accelerate or decelerate my cadence. With the clipless I don't even have to verbally communicate my intentions. Without them, she would occasionally loose her footing on the pedals and hit her legs with them.

Pedal cages are nice, but they are so much harder to get in and out. Try the frogs, they really are effortless to clip on and off.

Last edited by chojn1; 08-27-15 at 07:48 PM.
chojn1 is offline  
Old 08-28-15, 09:23 AM
  #27  
Santana Couple
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
"Try the frogs, they really are effortless to clip on and off." Also the free float works best for my knees.

I second that!!!!
apage4u is offline  
Old 08-28-15, 01:18 PM
  #28  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Paul J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Upstate South Carolina
Posts: 1,098

Bikes: 1980's Spectrum 10 sp Campagnolo Centaur, 1990 Eddy Merckx 10 sp Campagnolo Centaur, Bushnell Tandem, Co-Motion Speedster Tandem

Liked 103 Times in 66 Posts
I've loved watching my wife (Stoker) becoming more confident in her riding. When we started riding the Tandem she probably had lifetime total of less the 500 miles on a bike. She now clips-in like a pro, talks bikes with other people, daydreams about owning a Seven titanium tandem one of these days and sees herself as a full-on cyclist which she is! We used no clips for the couple years and then rode for a couple of years with clips and toe strap followed by the SPD set-up. When she had the knee issue last year she switched back to the clips as she rehab'd her knee post surgery and now has really enjoyed the Frogs this year. We have a Chaps-stick that got dropped in the dirt that we cleaned-up and now lube-up the cleats before most rides. I really appreciate how this forum and all you awesome fellow tandem-er have helped us these past several years.

Paul
Paul J is offline  
Old 08-30-15, 11:42 PM
  #29  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by fxsvelo
My stoker is small and light and hasn't the leverage (short foot) or the mass (<100 lbs) to use SPDs. We tried Crank Bros. Candy and that wasn't much better so we gave up and she uses toe clips and straps.

Studies show that clipless isn't any more efficient than regular flat pedals, so what the heck. She's happy with that. The only down side is that when I test ride solo, I use a very small bungee to hold the cage to the crank arm so the cage doesn't hit the ground. The bungees live in the trunk bag, so no big deal. It doesn't look as cool as clipless, but we're beyond caring about that.
Link to said studies on pedal efficiency??
DrMarkR is offline  
Old 08-31-15, 02:26 PM
  #30  
TKramer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 87

Bikes: Paketa V2r, Co-motion Equator Co-pilot, Bingham BUILT. tandem

Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by DrMarkR
Link to said studies on pedal efficiency??
There have been many studies done. Google can be your friend. Some meta-references can be found here and here. I ride flat pedals as captain and would never go back unless I were road or track racing (which is likely never). Anyone who claims that they consistently pull up on the pedals during crank rotation (besides sprinting or climbing out of the saddle) is deluding themselves. The human leg is not adapted to flex and pull the foot towards the hip and training it to do so is an inefficient use of energy. Yes, it can be effective, as in sprinting. But sprinting isn't about efficiency, is it? Like much in bicycling, attaching the feet to pedals has as much to do with tradition than anything else. Clips and straps were invented so racers could keep their feet from flying off the pedals when riding cobblestones and all the other dodgy road surfaces in Europe.

I switched to platforms from SPDs when I realized my stoker couldn't contribute any power at the cadence I was used to (95-100 rpm). I did it just as a "temporary" remedy to help me slow down to 80-85 rpm and, by Jove, we increased our speed and range dramatically! I never saw the need to revert back. For less than $250, I have a shoe/pedal combo with weight that rivals clicky pedal/shoe combos costing hundereds-to-thousands more:

Race Face Atlas Pedals 355 g/pr
Merrell Trail Glove Shoes 450 g/pr
tkramer is offline  
Old 08-31-15, 04:11 PM
  #31  
Senior Member
 
waynesulak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ft Worth, TX
Posts: 1,971

Bikes: Custom 650B tandem by Bob Brown, 650B tandem converted from Santana Arriva, Santana Noventa, Boulder Bicycle 700C, Gunnar Sport

Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Originally Posted by tkramer
There have been many studies done. Google can be your friend. Some meta-references can be found here and here. I ride flat pedals as captain and would never go back unless I were road or track racing (which is likely never). Anyone who claims that they consistently pull up on the pedals during crank rotation (besides sprinting or climbing out of the saddle) is deluding themselves. The human leg is not adapted to flex and pull the foot towards the hip and training it to do so is an inefficient use of energy. Yes, it can be effective, as in sprinting. But sprinting isn't about efficiency, is it? Like much in bicycling, attaching the feet to pedals has as much to do with tradition than anything else. Clips and straps were invented so racers could keep their feet from flying off the pedals when riding cobblestones and all the other dodgy road surfaces in Europe.

I switched to platforms from SPDs when I realized my stoker couldn't contribute any power at the cadence I was used to (95-100 rpm). I did it just as a "temporary" remedy to help me slow down to 80-85 rpm and, by Jove, we increased our speed and range dramatically! I never saw the need to revert back. For less than $250, I have a shoe/pedal combo with weight that rivals clicky pedal/shoe combos costing hundereds-to-thousands more:

Race Face Atlas Pedals 355 g/pr
Merrell Trail Glove Shoes 450 g/pr

Very interesting to me that you ride a Paketa V2r with flat pedals. I am glad your flat pedals are working well for your team. I have ridden some with flat pedals and to me is seems it that as the cadence increases the risk of very bruised shins increases with it. I don't feel much useful force is gained by pulling up on the pedals but I do pull up slightly to completely unweight the foot. I notice that when I start riding flat pedals by feet rise leaving the pedals behind. Keeping the rising foot on the pedal requires the downward foot to use some of its power to lift against the other foot.

That said I also feel that clipless pedals change the nature of injury when laying a bike down. Many newer riders don't unclip until after contact with the ground and the hip tends to take the brunt of the force when otherwise the rider might get their foot, shin, or knee down first. I don't know if that would be better or worse but it would be different than some crashes I have seen where the hip took all the initial contact with the pavement.
waynesulak is offline  
Old 08-31-15, 06:09 PM
  #32  
TKramer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 87

Bikes: Paketa V2r, Co-motion Equator Co-pilot, Bingham BUILT. tandem

Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
If you ride and practice often enough, your muscle memory is surprisingly good at tracing the perfect circles of a rotating crank. If not, there are other fit or functional problems that need to be addressed. We are running/walking animals and the recovery phase of the gait is tuned to follow the knee forward for setting up for the next contraction cycle. Hooking us up to a machine can, of course, confound this natural motion. But, with enough training (and friction at the shoe-pedal interface), I believe over the long haul, my "gait" on the cranks provides a more efficient exertion pattern. Any purported retrograde force to keep my foot on the pedal is likely negligible. I can sustain a loaded spin on the tandem @ over 110 rpm without my feet flying off. I also have more of an ankling pedal style than many riders which may help in keeping the flat surface of the pedal at a more perpendicular tangent to the arc of the pedal spindle.

I get a lot of quizical looks from others who pull up at stops. Then, when the signal changes, we jump off the line and get some two lengths ahead while they're trying to engage their cleats.
tkramer is offline  
Old 09-06-15, 07:04 PM
  #33  
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Aveiro, Portugal
Posts: 259

Bikes: tandem, road bike, hybrid

Liked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Originally Posted by tkramer
Yes, it can be effective, as in sprinting. But sprinting isn't about efficiency, is it?
I have a biomechanical issue and find that when I ride with clipless pedals I do pull up on the pedals (always with the whole leg, and when I am wearing the prosthesis whose suspension allows pulling up, then also with that leg). When I ride my commuter bike without clipless, I find that I miss being able to pull up on pedals. I am not willing to adjust the power grip foot retention system to be tight enough to support pulling up.

Since my "feeling" the pedal on 1 foot is compromised, I always use some sort of retention system.
esther-L is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
wiscobadger
General Cycling Discussion
39
09-09-19 04:52 PM
Hoser1268
Road Cycling
12
06-08-14 06:32 PM
Bike'n'write
Touring
2
12-16-10 11:53 PM
asforme
Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg)
26
08-13-10 04:47 PM
bjh000
Road Cycling
11
02-23-10 02:04 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Your Privacy Choices -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.