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Alternatives to Surly Ogre?

Old 06-28-15, 12:23 AM
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stevage
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Alternatives to Surly Ogre?

I'm considering jumping on the offroad touring bandwagon with a new bike that takes fatter tyres. Then I can convert my current Specialized Tricross to lighter duties like commuting, paved midweight cycle tours and day rides.

The Ogre seems pretty appealing: fattish tyres, lots of mounting options on the fork (especially bottle cages/Anything bags). But I'm not a steel fetishist, so I wonder if there's something equivalent in aluminum somewhere? The must-haves are 700c, able to run 35mm to 2.5", rigid fork with rack and cage mounts. Still undecided about disks vs cantis etc.

Also, and maybe unanswerable, but I just noticed that the Surly Ogre has a maximum tyre width of 2.5" (64mm), while the Troll takes up to 2.7" (69mm). Is there a reason for this difference?
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Old 06-28-15, 09:30 AM
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The Santos Travelmaster 2.9 has an aluminum frame but steel forks, by the look of it. Definitely an up-market alternative but from the reports I have seen they make really solid bikes.

Santos - Custombuilt bicycles - Travelmaster 2.9
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Old 06-28-15, 10:14 AM
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Trek 920? its their 29er touring rig. 920 - Trek Bicycle
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Old 06-28-15, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by stevage View Post
I'm considering jumping on the offroad touring bandwagon with a new bike that takes fatter tyres. Then I can convert my current Specialized Tricross to lighter duties like commuting, paved midweight cycle tours and day rides.

The Ogre seems pretty appealing: fattish tyres, lots of mounting options on the fork (especially bottle cages/Anything bags). But I'm not a steel fetishist, so I wonder if there's something equivalent in aluminum somewhere? The must-haves are 700c, able to run 35mm to 2.5", rigid fork with rack and cage mounts. Still undecided about disks vs cantis etc.

Also, and maybe unanswerable, but I just noticed that the Surly Ogre has a maximum tyre width of 2.5" (64mm), while the Troll takes up to 2.7" (69mm). Is there a reason for this difference?
High end: Koga Miyata Traveler ($3000+)
Less high end: Cannondale Synapse, Giant OCR, REI Novara Strada, not sure if any can take wide tires
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Old 06-28-15, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Trek 920? its their 29er touring rig. 920 - Trek Bicycle
Oh wow, that just looks so...mean. I love it. Any idea what the maximum tyre clearance is?
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Old 06-28-15, 11:54 AM
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by reading the website you would have learned the standard tire is 2 inches wide, as supplied new on the bike.
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Old 06-28-15, 12:31 PM
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Salsa Fargo:

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Old 06-28-15, 02:00 PM
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If that matters to you, the Ogre will even run tires a little bigger than 2.5, like some guys who installed 29+ rubber.
Will also run 27.5+ tires easily
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Old 06-28-15, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by stevage View Post
I just noticed that the Surly Ogre has a maximum tyre width of 2.5" (64mm), while the Troll takes up to 2.7" (69mm). Is there a reason for this difference?
Tire diameter + drive line + drivetrain (FD) limitation + how much you can bend chainstays and they don't end up weak and ugly. It's simply harder to fit big tires into a bicycle that is essentially the same size.

For the same reasons, a LHT in 26 will accommodate 2.1" (53mm) tires with fenders, whereas LHT in 700c limited to 42mm with fenders.
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Old 06-28-15, 02:04 PM
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The Salsa Fargo, which I own and love, is a steel frame. To me, that is a benefit, but the op is looking for an aluminum framed alternative.
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Old 06-28-15, 02:36 PM
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Steve, check out the threads from a few weeks ago about the trek 920, seems like a nest bike, although the cost appears to be high in my opinion, and bar ends might be a deal breaker for some people.
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Old 06-28-15, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by djb View Post
Steve, check out the threads from a few weeks ago about the trek 920, seems like a nest bike, although the cost appears to be high in my opinion, and bar ends might be a deal breaker for some people.
Yeah, thanks. I'm not super sensitive to price, but some of the options further up the thread were a bit ridiculous, like the Santos Travelmaster at like 4000 euros. I'm definitely not a fan of bar ends - I've been really happy with STI, and I'd be fine with MTB shifters, but having to move hand positions to change gears is a turn-off.
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Old 06-28-15, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by stevage View Post
having to move hand positions to change gears is a turn-off.
You might be surprised to find out how quickly this becomes second nature. Maybe it depends on how stable you feel on a bike though, i.e. riding with one hand or no hands. After seeing a relatively long thread over in the road biking subforum with someone seeking advice about how to move their hands from the hoods to the drops, I realized that not everyone is comfortable shifting their hands around.
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Old 06-28-15, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by stevage View Post
Yeah, thanks. I'm not super sensitive to price, but some of the options further up the thread were a bit ridiculous, like the Santos Travelmaster at like 4000 euros. I'm definitely not a fan of bar ends - I've been really happy with STI, and I'd be fine with MTB shifters, but having to move hand positions to change gears is a turn-off.
Re barends, ya I know what you mean. I've never owned one, but have ridden a friends 520 trek a bit and having had ridden downtube bikes for years, I adapted really quickly. That said, I really like sti and my other bike is a MTB with trigger shifters, which I really like also. Not having to move your hands to shift in rough stuff, and with lots of riding i do in city traffic, makes me leery of barends. I guess ultimately I'd have to live with a bar end bike for a while to see if I'd be OK with it.

Hey, ps, did you ever replace the shifter on the tricross of did flushing the heck out of it help, I don't remember the outcome
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Old 06-29-15, 02:03 AM
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Originally Posted by DanBell View Post
You might be surprised to find out how quickly this becomes second nature.
Yeah, maybe. I actually ride no-hands a lot, but I still think it would be frustrating being stuck in a gear on rough terrain.
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Old 06-29-15, 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by djb View Post
Hey, ps, did you ever replace the shifter on the tricross of did flushing the heck out of it help, I don't remember the outcome
Oh, hey Eventually bit the bullet and had them replaced with Sora. New handlebars at the same time. I was about to do the Mawson Trail (partial write up here) and didn't want a big disaster.

On that trip I had a 48mm front tyre which got me thinking about fatter tyres. Sadly I can only fit about a 38mm rear.
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Old 06-29-15, 03:34 AM
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I'd like to address the no hands subject for just a second. (since you brought it up) I ride a DT and noticed that when empty I can "no hands it" easily. However when I try it loaded, you can forget it. I not complaining or anything, just thought it was interesting how much differently the bike handles when it's loaded. (and that's with a tubus low rider front rack)
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Old 06-29-15, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by jargo432 View Post
I'd like to address the no hands subject for just a second. (since you brought it up) I ride a DT and noticed that when empty I can "no hands it" easily. However when I try it loaded, you can forget it. I not complaining or anything, just thought it was interesting how much differently the bike handles when it's loaded. (and that's with a tubus low rider front rack)
That's interesting. I have a Disc Trucker too, and I find it to be incredibly easy to ride with no hands loaded or unloaded. Tubus something in the back and Duo on the front. It's definitely easier to no-hands at lower speed unloaded, but there's so much momentum to it loaded that I love riding no hands coasting down a road. Great way to stretch the back out on a long tour. I wonder if it's a size difference? I'm on a 56cm DT with 700c wheels. This is certainly dragging the OP off track though. Apologies.
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Old 06-29-15, 05:53 AM
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check out the Kona Big Rove
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Old 06-29-15, 09:17 PM
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I ride a steel bike, a Thorn Nomad. On handling, I find that with my handlebar bag mounted I can easily ride no-hands. Without the bag, the bike is a lot more skittish.

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Old 06-29-15, 10:07 PM
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Jim, I've always thought that those drivetrain cover thingees are the smartest thing. Imagine how much longer life everything lasts not having gunk on it. Would absolutely be on my list if I were ever to go that route.
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Old 06-30-15, 01:10 AM
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Originally Posted by stevage View Post
Also, and maybe unanswerable, but I just noticed that the Surly Ogre has a maximum tyre width of 2.5" (64mm), while the Troll takes up to 2.7" (69mm). Is there a reason for this difference?
Like @seeker333 said, 29er tires are really large. If you look at the area behind the seat tube, you can see the difference.


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Old 06-30-15, 09:32 AM
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The troll uses 26" tires. I have a Karate Monkey, but he ogre has more mounts. Can you even run cantis on an ogre?
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Old 06-30-15, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty View Post
Like @seeker333 said, 29er tires are really large. If you look at the area behind the seat tube, you can see the difference.
Ah...that makes sense. I was thinking of sideways clearance only.
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Old 06-30-15, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Leebo View Post
The troll uses 26" tires. I have a Karate Monkey, but he ogre has more mounts. Can you even run cantis on an ogre?
Yep:

>Ogre comes with our suspension-corrected (80mm) fork with threaded mounts for fenders and a rack. It will run cantilever or disc brakes so you can choose a system that best suits your stopping needs. Both fork and frame allow the use of a fender, disc brake, and rack at the same time.
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