DropBarFan

Research shows that apparently none of the major rack companies offers a titanium front rack. Tubus makes rear Ti racks, making front Ti racks would seem logical enough but I don't see Tubus offering those. Russian/Chinese Ti fabricators offer Ti front racks & AFAIK some US/Euro bike builders offer custom Ti racks. Former are perhaps sketchy & latter cost a bundle.

I have a Jandd Extreme alu-alloy front rack (doesn't fit on Surly Disc Trucker) that weighs over 1 kg: wow, what a pig! Plus one of the stays got a big cut ground in somehow. Thinking about springing for a Tubus Logo Titan rear rack that would save a considerable 40%/230 g weight vs Topeak Explorer Disc (also alu-alloy). Logo Titan costs $300 but looks like a better simpler design than Topeak & I think that the Tubus would also simplify S & S packing.

Also, I'm a bit puzzled why vast majority of front racks don't include a platform? Sure, rear rack sales much higher than front racks but there are lots of front racks for sale. Platforms are great for lighter-weight luggage like sleeping bags. Is the idea that one should use a handlebar bag instead?

veganbikes

They probably don't do Ti at the front because you are probably more likely to not be carrying much if you are using Ti racks since they aren't going to hold the weight as well as quality steel racks.

As far as front platforms most people using front racks are carrying panniers so a top part isn't useful and those needing the top part usually are carrying a racktop bag of some sort instead of panniers. Nitto makes a bunch of platform racks for Randos and maybe some lighter tourers or those not carrying panniers.

Just go with the Cromo Tubus racks and you will be fine. They won't be as light as Ti but will have a lot of added durability. Comparing my old Surly rear Nice Rack with my Tubus Cargo Evo and Duo front the Tubus racks together are lighter than the Surly rear or your Jandd front.

tmac100

I just finished bicycling across the Nullabore and in 2 trips have gone from Perth to Sydney. My bike weighs 40 pounds and is steel and has both racks made of steel (hi-grade aircraft type tubing).

When the front rack needed an adjustment, an autobody shop used an acetylene tourch to "unbraze" two lugs and a TIG welder to re-attach in a "better" position.

Steel is repairable anywhere - wonder how Ti and Al are repairable on tour?? I DO NOT use "brifters" as bar-end shifters are foolproof.

I was self-sustainable and set up a bush camp anywhere. I had about 8 L of water and on the 2740 km trip (July 7th to August 7th) never ran out of water nor anything else. No internet on much of the trip, but now in an Australian city with good connection through a mobile 4G unit..

Bottom line for me is :use steel it is fixable almost anywhere.

Next year I do the N tip of Cape York to Cairns in July/Aug. Mostly dirt and being graded at that time after "the wet".

Here is my bike:https://www.sandsmachine.com/a_arv_001.htm

The builder said that if worst-came-to-worst, I could at least salvage the S&S connectors and parts and throw the wrecked frame away...

indyfabz

Nitto also makes a front platform rack for heavy duty loads. It's called the Nitto Big front rack. It is made for and sold through Rivendell. I have one because I like having the option. It's very strong and good looking.

elcruxio

Really depends how the steel breaks. If your frame breaks at the tube butt the frame is pretty much toast. Or you'll have to somehow get a whole new tube. Also bicycle tubing tends to be so thin anyways that fixing it is really not that easy.
Racks on the other hand can be a bit easier.

Aluminum just needs a slightly higher class tig welder but my bottom line is that if a frame breaks, I'll get a new one. A bicycle frame isn't supposed to break. Even aluminum has enough stress cycles to last decades of active riding. If it breaks, it's compromized

Tourist in MSN

I quit using my heavy Surly front rack and bought a Tubus Ergo and also bought the little Nashbar mini platform rack that attaches at the cantilever mounts. Very happy with the two racks on the front. In the photo I have my orange color vest strapped onto the front rack. I usually use a handlebar bag but the small platform is still quite functional for small items that I want to stash somewhere.

fietsbob

If weight reduction matters so much to you(?)you leave enough stuff at home to not Need a front pannier rack.



maybe the rigidity of Chromoly is advantageous and costs a lot less , so sells better.. ?


I too just added a mini-rack to a (B. Gordon) low rider pannier rack. Weighs less than a single rack doing both.

I also have another bike, Tubus ergo lowrider, like above , have a fork crown mount Headlight Bracket

So, Piling stuff on an over the wheel rack would block the Light.

+ any higher mounted light, like on the bars, And the rain cape would cover the light.

ChristianCote

I think it's mostly how narrow the use case would be for a titanium front rack. It's rare to see a front rack used on its own. Typically front racks will be used in tandem with rear racks, which comes with the implication that they're being used by someone transporting an abnormally heavy load. In this case you're already arriving at concerns over the reduced carrying capacity of titanium materials, as well as the cross purposes of paying a premium for a light mounting equipment when you're carrying heavy gear.

Considering this, and keeping in mind the challenges of manufacturing quality titanium racks vs. steel, I can see most companies deeming it an impractical move. When you really think about it, titanium rear racks themselves are very niche products already.

Rack-top platforms are pretty much the same story, but to a lesser degree (which is why you're not really so hard up to find one). There's a small market for them. Consider the average consumers who will be looking at keeping gear above the wheel, near the handlebars, and you'll see most commuters using baskets or child seats, and most tourists and bikepackers using handlebar bags like those sold by Revelate Designs or Porcelain Rocket.

DropBarFan

Thanks for all the tips! Nitto Big Front is pretty impressive (looks like part of a steel road bridge heh). For loaded bike camping it might be ideal. I use drop bar w/aero bar which makes mounting a handlebar bag problematic, thus my inquiry about front platforms. Mini-platform suggestion is good, I think those would be long enough to lash on a sleeping back or similar...& for credit card touring one could detach the mini-platform & rely on a minimal-style low-rider which is probably light enough to leave on all the time.

Tubus Logo Titan rated to carry 30 kg vs 40 kg for many of their cro-mo rear racks. 30 kg would be plenty enough for me (shorter tours) but OTOH common sense tells me it's kind of dumb to spend $300 on a new rack when current one works OK. Production steel touring bikes are heavy so I've been thinking about ways to cut weight thru component/accessory choice--usually it seems light-weight components/accessories are not very cost-efficient. Checked out carbon seat posts & was surprised that even there, weight saving was marginal vs alu-alloy.

Oh well, Disc Trucker is plump but cute. Bilenky did turquoise power-coat (actually they farm out powder-coating) & it looks prettier than most carbon-frame racers. Powder-coat is surprisingly durable, no scratches/abrasions after 6,500 kilometers.

ChristianCote

Weight reduction on any bike is going to be a bit of a salami-slicing affair, so yeah, it can be hard seeing the value in swapping out one or two parts, especially when you're running up against rising costs. Touring bikes just complicate matters to the nth degree because they fly so much in the face of weight weenie dogma just by their inherent purpose.

I'd suggest reducing the weight of what you're carrying first if weight IS a concern, and then rotating weight on your bike second, getting that to as low a point as you can while remaining happy with the durability of your wheels under load. This is basically lightweight backpacking 101. Once you've refined your load down to what are the real essentials then you can better estimate what rack hardware is necessary, how many panniers you actually need, if you you need an LHT or if it might be overbuilt for your needs, things like that. This is the same reason why ultralight backpackers don't purchase a backpack until they know exactly what's going in it.

This is me overthinking things for you, however. That's my way. I'm certain that you can probably enjoy your touring just fine doing exactly what you've been doing and just enjoying the ride. Once you go down the road of over-refining your 'system' only horror and empty pockets awaits you.

Tourist in MSN

I just use the mini platform for small things that I want to quickly stash or for quick access. I leave that rack on when I get home, but take the low riders off when I get home. The low riders are a bigger hassle for putting a bike in bike rack, etc., but he mini rack weighs very little and does not get in the way.

Mini rack is a bit short to use for much. The Nashbar one measures about 8.75 inches long, so it is not going to hold a lot. I leave a couple Velcro straps strapped on it for when I want to use it. It is a handy place to stash rain gear, a spare water bottle or two, but too short to put a rack top bag on. My sleeping bags are a bit bigger than I would want to use on that mini platform, rolled up air mattress would be the ideal size and shape but if I did not carry my sleeping bag in a water proof pannier, I would want to put it in a dry bag and I think the rack would be too small to easily lash a dry bag of that size onto it.

On a different bike I have the Sunlite brand mini-rack, it is about the same size. You can see in the photo I have my rain gear (red color) stashed on it. I have switched my handlebar bag to a second stem mounting to lower it, that makes the mini rack a bit less roomy. The Sunlite rack when I bought it had some deformed little fittings that attach at the cantilever brake mounts that I had to bend to make it fit proper, if you get it and it does not fit right then the bracket may need some bending.

tmac100

I edited my response (#3) and added a picture of my Arvon1 that I just rode across "the Nullabore", 2700 km without breakdowns...

DropBarFan

Some good points--I tend to like having 1 main bike & 1 set of equipment that can "do it all". But it might sensible to have ~2 sets of racks, 1 for loaded camping & 1 for credit-card. I bought pre-made wheels w/Sun Rhyno Lite rims. W/my light weight I could probably get away with a lighter rim but it's a hassle to build new wheels & having sturdy rims is nice insurance.

As you say, reducing luggage is the sensible first step. I could cut some weight w/lighter tent, jacket shell etc.

Using aluminum frame would cut a bunch of weight but S & S couplers can't go on aluminum. There's the option of Chinese custom Ti frames but AFAIK those require one to have CAD/CAM skill. One day someone will come out with a reasonably-priced carbon tourer--until then I suppose I just gotta face that weight-cutting options w/Disc Trucker are limited. For me more intensive training would help. One of the reasons I don't buy a light alu or carbon road bike is that I don't want to find out how slow I'd be even with a light bike!

DropBarFan

So I guess all the platform-only racks are the mini-style? I suppose that makers keep the length short so folks don't overload it. Perhaps one could make an extension out of billet aluminum & bolt it on to allow for carrying bulky but light things.

ChristianCote

That's a really sensible approach imo. A good stable is really valuable to get the most out of whatever riding you're doing, and more bikes = more fun tuning them up and generally fiddling with 'em. Win win!

Tourist in MSN

Loaded touring I use Tubus Ergo low rider rack, small platform front rack on the cantilever brake posts, Tubus Logo EVO rear rack.

The Logo EVO has very narrow platform, thus does not function well with rack top bags. But I find it outstanding with panniers. Thus it is my go-to rear rack for loaded touring. But it comes off when I get home, for around home use I want a wide platform on the back, but pannier carrying becomes a lower priority. Before I bought the Logo EVO, I used a Surly rear rack for touring but now the Surly is only used around home where the wide platform is nice to have.

The RackTime Topit rack has a larger platform, instead of mounting on the cantilever posts it mounts on the mid-fork rack mounts. There is a bikepacker on this forum that has used one extensively and he has had positive comments on it for carrying small panniers - even though it mainly is a platform type design. Do a forum search for topit and you might find more info on it.

I have a old cheapo Aluminum front rack that is platform only and fits on the eyelets on the dropouts. Was made by BorYea (spell?), sold by Nashbar. I was trying to find something cheap to order to increase my order enough to get free shipping and bought the rack. Have not used it yet, but I might some day. My point is that such racks have been made, I just do not know of any that are currently made that way.

DropBarFan

Ergo seems like a good choice & it's convenient that if one adds the small platform rack that they use different mounting points.



Logo Evo platform is not wide but I see that Ortlieb makes RackBags designed to work with Ortlieb panniers (& apparently racks like the Evo). Or else one could fashion a solid platform from aluminum or plastic. Photo below is a Disc Trucker with full Ortlieb/Tubus setup incl the spacious RackBag.





Topit looks nice for lighter-weight front luggage.

veganbikes

Rivy always has some great designs that other folks make that I sometimes forget about! I wish I had that kind of relationship with Nitto where I can call them up and have them make me stuff and it is awesome.

gugie 

Nope.

I can bend steel back.

If it's broke, a little flux, a torch, and a brazing rod, I can fix just about anything. Might need to grab a bolt, grind the head off, and use it as a patch, but it'll fix. I don't arc weld (yet), but one who does can do the same. and that skill can be found on every country and continent in the world.

It may not be pretty, it may not be a permanent fix, but I'll get you home.

But as far as the OP goes, I would imagine that cost what's holding back Ti racks.

$360 for a rear rack, anyone?

elcruxio

Umm yeah. The thing about that is that you're probably more likely to find a tig welder capable of fixing aluminum than you are finding
1) a torch (this is the easy part though)
2) brazing rod suitable for high tensile steel repair
3) flux suitable for high tensile steel repair
4) proper degreasing/paint stripping/cleaning agents
And all of them in the same place.

Realistically you're looking at a bubblegum fix to last you until you can get a replacement or a good craftsman fix. But bike steel really isn't as easy material to deal with as people think. One needs really good tools and technique to deal with today's very thin tubing. Mostly it's technique so it's not at all likely that a village blacksmith can tig weld the tubes used in bicycles.

Tourist in MSN

Yeah, sometimes I use the Ortlieb 31 liter duffle, it sits on the panniers very nicely.

gugie 

I'm not having my frame repaired "back to new" on the road. If I'm stuck in the middle of BFE, I'll have a guy bung it together so i can keep moving. We can go back and forth about theory, but I like to see if someone's done it before. Here's some quotes from CGOAB:

"I did have a frame failure while on tour. Fork failure to be exact. I was touring on the west coast of British Columbia in the early 1980s (not exactly third world). I was riding my old chrome-moly lugged criterium bike, which I had put clincher rims on for touring. In the middle of the nowhere the right fork broke clean through at the fork/dropout joint.
What to do? A little Yankee ingenuity and some duct tape and I was back on the road traveling very slowly and only using my rear brake. A half an hour up the road I came to a log yard and stopped in and sure enough there was a welder on duty. He graciously offered to weld it back together. I very politely informed him the frame was alloy and he probably couldn't weld it with his AC welder and the welding rods he used to repair the logging equipment. He assured me he had welded his kids bikes and brazing would be too brittle to last very long. I turned my back as he struck the arc and I heard an explosion followed by the sound of the dropout hitting the concrete floor. "Must be alloy" was his terse response. Welders, especially field welders, are an extremely resourceful bunch. Without hesitation he turned on the valve to his acetylene torch. He made a little jig and eyeballed the air gap between the dropout and now charred end of the fork. He proceeded to pileup a big gob of brass and sent me on my way refusing any talk of compensation."

and another:

It not only got me back to Vancouver (a day's ride), but I rode the mended fork around my home for a month while waiting for the warranty fork to arrive. I never pushed it down hills, around corners or loaded it with groceries and the like, but it did hold."

"I broke my steel frame on the last day of a 15 day leg riding the "Tanami Track". At the time it seemed terminal for my trip. Fortunately within 15 minutes I had 3 4 wheel drive trucks from the local cattle station offering help and I had it welded up at the station. Back on the road in 40 minutes. Its held up for another 2000km since then. I don't need to post a picture because it was in the same place as Mike Noonan's break."

I know I've read about others.

May not be pretty, but it can get you home.

DropBarFan

I guess if one can afford a Lynskey bike the rack cost is no biggie. On sale for $300, heh. OTOH it's rated for a whopping 77 kg & has lifetime warranty. Seat-stay attachment is not as trick as Tubus Evo style though.

bikiola

What is the weight of the Nitto Big? I can't find it anywhere and rivbike has their characteristic "snark with no substance" description on the page. Looking between this and the Surly Front...

DropBarFan

Jandd Extreme aluminum-alloy front rack is just over 1 kg, Surly cro-mo is 1382 g, I'm guessing Nitto would have to be in that range. I'm a bit puzzled why Nitto weight capacity is 30 lbs while Surly is a whopping 70?