Trek 920
01-17-16, 06:37 PM
#26
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Originally Posted by LeeG
Mike, I'm curious about stock wheels on pricier production bikes these days. My assumption being that the 920 fits that description. Would you feel confident sending someone out on a trip loaded as you were on the 920 without going over the wheels? I ask because djb's observation would imply an improperly trued wheel although one anecdote doesnt necessarily define the original status of the wheel.
i've bought a couple Handspun brand wheels a few years back and they didn't require any adjustment as received, spoke tension was even and they stayed true for years carrying my fat ass and loads. Just wondering if the bikes come out of the box with well built wheels.
A lot of spoke breakage I saw decades ago on PCH came from people who simply were unaware of the condition of their wheels so they would ride for 100's of miles on wheels a bike mechanic could tell right off needed trueing. The only way the person knew something was wrong was when the spokes broke.
i've bought a couple Handspun brand wheels a few years back and they didn't require any adjustment as received, spoke tension was even and they stayed true for years carrying my fat ass and loads. Just wondering if the bikes come out of the box with well built wheels.
A lot of spoke breakage I saw decades ago on PCH came from people who simply were unaware of the condition of their wheels so they would ride for 100's of miles on wheels a bike mechanic could tell right off needed trueing. The only way the person knew something was wrong was when the spokes broke.
01-17-16, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by bikemig
Not to overthink this but what's the advantage of 28 hole rims? There's an areodynamic advantage to fewer spokes if going fast but most people going offroad touring probably aren't time trialing. What's the downside of overbuilding the wheel a bit with say 32 spokes? Overbuilding parts that might fail doesn't strike me as being an old school mindset so much as a pretty sound design principle.
To be clear, I'm not arguing with your experience with the bike which is clearly excellent but you also said it was the best thing out there for offroad touring. What's the advantage of 28 spokes say over 32? Are you going fast enough where this is a plus for you? Why is it a disadvantage to overbuild a wheel for that kind of an application say with 32 spokes?
To be clear, I'm not arguing with your experience with the bike which is clearly excellent but you also said it was the best thing out there for offroad touring. What's the advantage of 28 spokes say over 32? Are you going fast enough where this is a plus for you? Why is it a disadvantage to overbuild a wheel for that kind of an application say with 32 spokes?
01-17-16, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333
More spokes are better for wheel longevity, and the incremental weight added by a few spokes for Touring use is utterly trivial. Well built 36h, 135/100mm QR hub wheels are fairly common among the Touring crowd because they are sensible low-cost, low-maintenance, proven wheels.
The Surly LHT, probably the most popular touring bike ever, uses mid-tier Shimano ball bearing hubs, inexpensive Alex rims and 36 straight gauge spokes. I cannot recall a single thread on the Touring forum where someone complained about the cheap wheels on their LHT. It is unnecessary to reinvent this wheel for touring.
The fact that the Trek 920 has 28 spoke wheels is not it's major shortcoming; rather it is the fact that the 920 frame/fork will accept ONLY 142-12mm rear and 100-15mm front thru-axle wheels. These will likely be a special order item at any North American LBS you'd stop at for a wheel replacement. If you plan on touring outside NA the Trek 920 is not the best choice.
I'll conclude by noting that steel is well known to be a more durable material with a fatigue limit that is several orders of magnitude greater than aluminum. A well built steel frame can last lifetimes if protected from corrosion. An aluminum frame can fail in relatively short time used regularly in a rough off-road setting, which makes the choice of Al for the Trek 920 all the more puzzling. Evidently Trek is aiming for the MTBing crowd with this bike, and since more than half the bikes sold spend their entire lives in a shed, basement or garage, Trek probably isn't risking much in the design of the 920.
The Surly LHT, probably the most popular touring bike ever, uses mid-tier Shimano ball bearing hubs, inexpensive Alex rims and 36 straight gauge spokes. I cannot recall a single thread on the Touring forum where someone complained about the cheap wheels on their LHT. It is unnecessary to reinvent this wheel for touring.
The fact that the Trek 920 has 28 spoke wheels is not it's major shortcoming; rather it is the fact that the 920 frame/fork will accept ONLY 142-12mm rear and 100-15mm front thru-axle wheels. These will likely be a special order item at any North American LBS you'd stop at for a wheel replacement. If you plan on touring outside NA the Trek 920 is not the best choice.
I'll conclude by noting that steel is well known to be a more durable material with a fatigue limit that is several orders of magnitude greater than aluminum. A well built steel frame can last lifetimes if protected from corrosion. An aluminum frame can fail in relatively short time used regularly in a rough off-road setting, which makes the choice of Al for the Trek 920 all the more puzzling. Evidently Trek is aiming for the MTBing crowd with this bike, and since more than half the bikes sold spend their entire lives in a shed, basement or garage, Trek probably isn't risking much in the design of the 920.
01-17-16, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by mikeonthemadone
Having run MANY pairs of untouched stock wheels and a few pairs of handbuilt wheels, I will say I personally see so little difference long term between the two that I don't really worry myself about it. I have seen a handful of lemons on customer bike and the worst pair I saw were handbuilt by someone who thought they knew what they were doing! Always have a competent person check everything over before leaving on a trip. That's the lesson.
01-17-16, 08:26 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by mikeonthemadone
... Don't let the marketing gurus tell you what is best.
Why would anyone spend an extra 50% above the cost of a Surly Disc Trucker for a Trek 920 - isn't there a better reason than "it handles nicely and brakes well"?
01-17-16, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333
I wish you'd followed your own advice. You don't seem to know what you like about the 920 other than it handles and brakes nice.
Why would anyone spend an extra 50% above the cost of a Surly Disc Trucker for a Trek 920 - isn't there a better reason than "it handles nicely and brakes well"?
Why would anyone spend an extra 50% above the cost of a Surly Disc Trucker for a Trek 920 - isn't there a better reason than "it handles nicely and brakes well"?
01-17-16, 08:59 PM
#32
Clark W. Griswold
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I test rode the 920 and it was a fun bike and had some cool stuff that I dug but I wouldn't rate it in my top touring bikes. If I had to go with a touring bike from Trek it would be the 520 (though I wouldn't go with Trek) but if I wanted one of those sort of adventure touring bikes I would probably go with the Specialized AWOL EVO, that thing has some pretty sweet details that are great for touring. Steel frame for a comfortable ride, Supernova dynamo lights and Plug (with a cool bar end switch) 32h wheels, TRP disc brakes (HY/RDs so you can run cross levers), Tubus rear rack and comes with fenders. It has some similarities with the 920 but I think overall is a better package for the money. If the 920 was steel I might rate it a bit higher but I would still say the Specialized is a better bet.
However for the best bet before total custom is Co-Motion. They make all sorts of different touring bikes with different configurations and have been doing so for quite a while. They give you a ton of options if you want 29" or 26" or maybe classic 700c, IGH or derailleur...I think spending the extra money and getting something nicer is always a great way to go if you can afford it. If not start off like I did with a Disc Trucker or something like that and upgrade when you can.
However for the best bet before total custom is Co-Motion. They make all sorts of different touring bikes with different configurations and have been doing so for quite a while. They give you a ton of options if you want 29" or 26" or maybe classic 700c, IGH or derailleur...I think spending the extra money and getting something nicer is always a great way to go if you can afford it. If not start off like I did with a Disc Trucker or something like that and upgrade when you can.
01-17-16, 09:05 PM
#33
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Great, another troll. Are you a sock puppet of Ty0604?
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
01-17-16, 09:45 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by seeker333
Great, another troll. Are you a sock puppet of Ty0604?
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
And as far as I can tell, he was being polite and just giving his opinion, and thats ok.
Its just a bike, and he is having fun on it.
01-17-16, 11:42 PM
#35
Clark W. Griswold
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Originally Posted by seeker333
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
I know Trek has been hyping the 920 big time because they want their piece of the adventure/off road/touring pie. It is big money now because a lot of folks are into it and people are talking about it quite a bit. I have no doubt in my mind that if you work at a Trek store you will be talking it up heavily. I remember at one of the shops near me it was on display right as you walk in soon after it came out.
01-18-16, 11:20 AM
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I too have a Specialized AWOL. Changed the cassette and will change the crank next season to get a little lower gearing for climbing loaded, but the ride on the bike with a Brooks B-17 is magnificent.
There is no way I'd own an aluminum touring bike. The ride just isn't the same. I've tried AL frames over and over, and they are just too harsh for long days in the saddle. Be objective, and ride at least an hour over lots of bumps before you buy.
There is no way I'd own an aluminum touring bike. The ride just isn't the same. I've tried AL frames over and over, and they are just too harsh for long days in the saddle. Be objective, and ride at least an hour over lots of bumps before you buy.
01-19-16, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by seeker333
I wish you'd followed your own advice. You don't seem to know what you like about the 920 other than it handles and brakes nice.
Why would anyone spend an extra 50% above the cost of a Surly Disc Trucker for a Trek 920 - isn't there a better reason than "it handles nicely and brakes well"?
Why would anyone spend an extra 50% above the cost of a Surly Disc Trucker for a Trek 920 - isn't there a better reason than "it handles nicely and brakes well"?
Originally Posted by Mr Grinch
I too have a Specialized AWOL. Changed the cassette and will change the crank next season to get a little lower gearing for climbing loaded, but the ride on the bike with a Brooks B-17 is magnificent.
There is no way I'd own an aluminum touring bike. The ride just isn't the same. I've tried AL frames over and over, and they are just too harsh for long days in the saddle. Be objective, and ride at least an hour over lots of bumps before you buy.
There is no way I'd own an aluminum touring bike. The ride just isn't the same. I've tried AL frames over and over, and they are just too harsh for long days in the saddle. Be objective, and ride at least an hour over lots of bumps before you buy.
The 920 looks like it could be a fun bike but the geometry looks a little too aggressive for my tired old body, I certainly want something more upright.
There are tons of disc options out there and the best one is going to be the one that you will actually enjoy riding. My best advice is to test ride the crap out of a bunch of bikes then eliminate a few and repeat.
01-19-16, 05:40 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by Mr Grinch
I too have a Specialized AWOL. Changed the cassette and will change the crank next season to get a little lower gearing for climbing loaded, but the ride on the bike with a Brooks B-17 is magnificent.
01-19-16, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by seeker333
Great, another troll. Are you a sock puppet of Ty0604?
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
No one comes to bikeforums for patronizing, cliched answers or product shilling. We're all looking for good information, or to share good information.
You earlier stated "I wouldn't dream of anything else for myself for the next several years".
You make it sound like 920 is an incredible bike. I'm simply asking why is that?
You claim to work in a LBS, so I'm sure you must be capable of explaining why you chose a 920, and why you think it's such a great touring bike. Please leave off the hyperbole and just tell us why the 920 apparently dominates your dreams.
Mike (On Sabbatical to tour our great country until Spring of 2017.)
Spoke and Wheel Bike Shop
Twin Falls, Idaho
https://www.facebook.com/Spoke-and-W...51783/?fref=ts
01-19-16, 09:12 PM
#43
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24 is only 4 away from 28.
28 is 8 away from 36.
20 is 4 away from 24.
28 spokes on what is marketed as arough tough go anywhere heavy duty pack it up bike is akin to the terms jumbo shrimp and astronomically small.
...those are oxymorons, just to be clear.
28 is 8 away from 36.
20 is 4 away from 24.
28 spokes on what is marketed as arough tough go anywhere heavy duty pack it up bike is akin to the terms jumbo shrimp and astronomically small.
...those are oxymorons, just to be clear.
01-20-16, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr
24 is only 4 away from 28.
28 is 8 away from 36.
20 is 4 away from 24.
28 spokes on what is marketed as arough tough go anywhere heavy duty pack it up bike is akin to the terms jumbo shrimp and astronomically small.
...those are oxymorons, just to be clear.
28 is 8 away from 36.
20 is 4 away from 24.
28 spokes on what is marketed as arough tough go anywhere heavy duty pack it up bike is akin to the terms jumbo shrimp and astronomically small.
...those are oxymorons, just to be clear.
01-20-16, 08:14 AM
#45
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Originally Posted by Squeezebox
...
01-20-16, 08:20 AM
#46
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Originally Posted by shelbyfv
This is your third post with only a bunch of dots. What does it mean?
01-20-16, 08:30 AM
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I thought it might be some unfamiliar internet shorthand. You can delete posts w/o leaving something weird. I guess maybe it's like a dog peeing on a hydrant?
01-20-16, 08:38 AM
#48
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Originally Posted by Squeezebox
I'm not trying to say that I know more about wheels than the Trek engineers know and have tested. Those guys get paid well to know more than I do. Sure I was surprised at 28 spokes. My road bicycle does very well with 20/24 radial. Another example, look at the spoke count on some of the tandems now-a-days. I was surprised about that also. I trust that Trek knows what they are doing.
A couple things in response to your post.
- Those who spec a product often times do so within a price range and/or image. Perhaps a higher quality wheel was cost prohibitive. Perhaps a higher quality wheel wouldnt meet the company's marketing look. I have no idea, those are just guesses, but they are the only things I can think of since outfitting it with 28 instead of 36 or at worst 32 is just so odd.
- Why would you trust that Trek knows what they are doing? If ever ignorance was bliss, this is that time. Please dont ask me to list the thousands of times when a company's design team created a flawed or faulty product. I could list a dozen in the bike industry off the top of my head, and way more if I actually looked them up. Cars which start on fire. Cars which dont turn. Toys which melt. Toxic materials which leech.
Those are all fatal flaws in products and all we are talking about is a poorly spec'd bike, so not even some fatal flaw. Thousands of bikes are poorly spec'd. Often times its because of a cost constraint, but at $2000, this shouldnt be due to cost.
My wife's new Cdale had terrible brake pads. I mean awful. They were poorly spec'd. I switched them. Based on your logic, Cdale engineers knew what they were doing and I should have kept the originals. Thatd be pretty absurd in my mind.
01-20-16, 05:05 PM
#49
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Originally Posted by PDKL45
Just out of curiosity, as I am planning to do the same to my AWOL, what cassette did you use as a replacement and which crankset are you planning on using? I have been a little obsessed with AWOL gearing replacement options recently.
Haven't decided on the Crankset yet, but it will be something with a granny gear that requires 90 rpm just to move the bike at .5 mph.
01-20-16, 06:32 PM
#50
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Originally Posted by Mr Grinch
Stock upfront right now, cassette is 11-34.
Haven't decided on the Crankset yet, but it will be something with a granny gear that requires 90 rpm just to move the bike at .5 mph.
Haven't decided on the Crankset yet, but it will be something with a granny gear that requires 90 rpm just to move the bike at .5 mph.
