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New custom touring bike build

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New custom touring bike build

Old 10-02-16, 01:40 AM
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azza_333
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New custom touring bike build

I have just spent a large portion of my weekend online ordering components for my new touring bike builds.
For anyone that’s interested, I am going to post in this thread throughout the build, with lots of photos of my progress.
I am building it on a 2017 Kona Sutra LTD Frame, with the new Shimano XT T8000 trekking groupset, using Shiftmate ratio changers, so I can use STI shifters. A SON28 hub will run a front and rear light, with USB charging output to keep my GPS charged up.
The gearing should get me 19.2-119.8 gear inches.
When the frame arrives to first step will be treating the inside of the frame with Frame Saver.
I will be completing the build all myself, except the wheels, I am taking the Hubs/Spokes/Nipple/Rims to a professional wheel builder
All up I expect the final total to come to $5000-6000 AUD by the completion of the build.

The only items I have yet to order are:
- Stem, I am going to use an adjustable stem until I figure out my bike fit then buy the appropriate length/angle stem, but I will most likely get a BBB BHS-25 high rise stem
- Pitlock set, I will be ordering this to secure my bike as best as I can, at the very least I will be ordering front and rear skewers.
- Pedals, I am going to use an old Shimano XT trekking set until I decide on what pedals I want to use, it will be a set of high quality flat pedals though.

Skeleton:
- 2017 Kona Sutra LTD Frameset 54cm
- Race face ride XC seatpost
- ()
- FSA Vero Compact road bar 42cm
Wheelset:
- SON28 36h disc brake (6 bolt) front hub, black
- Velocity Chukker rims, 36h, non-machined sidewall, 700c, black
- DT Swiss Alpine III spokes
- DT Swiss Pro lock standard spokes, black brass
- Victoria 18mm rim tape
- Schwalbe Road Tube, 28-45c
- Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tyres, 35c
Brakes:
- TRP Spyre callipers
- 160mm Shimano RT86 ice tech rotors
- Jagwire Road Pro compression less brake cable set
- Tektro RL 721 CX crosstop brake levers
- Spyre brake cover and accordion boot
Drivetrain:
- Shimano 105 5703 3x10speed STI shifters
- Jagwire Road Pro shifter cable set
- Shimano XT FC-T8000 48/36/26 crankset
- Shimano BB-MT800 Bottom Bracket
- Shimano XT CN-HG95 10 speed chain
- Shimano XT M771 10 speed Cassette 11-36
- Shimano XT RD-T8000 SGS rear mech
- Shimano Deore XT FD-T8000-H-3 (63-66) front mech
- Shiftmate 6
- Shiftmate 7
- KMC 10 speed chain links
- Ritchey barrel adjusters
Misc:
- Brookes B17 Saddle
- Tubus Logo classic
- FSA Orbit MX headset
- SKS longboard mudguard set 45mm wide
- Deda bar tape, Cinelli bar ends
- Carbon fibre steerer tube spacers
- Busch + Müller Lumotec IQ2 Luxos U Front Light
- Busch + Müller TOPLIGHT Line Brake Plus LED-Rear Light
- Radon High Modulus chain stay protection sticker
- Topeak Shuttle AL Aluminium Bottle Cage

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Update 22nd October 2016:
The bike build has been delayed a bit, due to 2 strokes of bad luck.

The Kona Sutra LTD frameset arrived, but was very damaged(a lot of rust inside the bottom bracket, and a little on the steerer tube, bend rear dropouts, bent mech hanger, quite a few paint chips. Currently the shop I ordered it from is looking into getting me a replacement from Kona, and I am currently also in contact with FEDEX to organise compensation.

My wheel builder gave me a call and the Chukker rims he got to build my wheels with were not round enough to build my wheelset with so I am currently trying to source new rims.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Update 6th November 2016:
Wheels have been built, and I now have all the components, for the bike.
The last task I have to get completed before I can assemble the bike, is getting the frame/fork painted satin black, with red decals.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Update 2nd Feb 2017:
After so many delays with this bike build it is finally complete.

The only exceptions are:
Stem, I currently have an adjustable stem, until I figure out what length/angle I need.
Rotors, Currently have installed the stock TRP rotors, but I will switch them for the Shimano RT86 ice tech rotors in the coming months.
Tyres, I am just using an old set for now.

Now for the BAD NEWS, as much as I loved the concept of using the Jtek Shiftmates, to match my STI road shifters to the MTB gearing, sadly the shifting is very poor as a result, I took it to my LBS, they had a fiddle with it but couldn’t get it any better either. So as a result, I have ordered some ever faithful bar end shifters (Microshift BS-M10 the same one on the Surly LHT)

Also the braking is not the greatest, I will wait until I have install the bar end shifters and take the bike for a few more rides, and see if I can fiddle with the brakes a bit more, but if I can’t get the brakes to work well enough, I will unfortunately have to give up on my idea of having brakes on the hoods, and interrupter levers on the tops. Instead I will just buy a set of TRP Hylex hydraulic brakes.

Once I get the bike working well, I will be doing a Dynamo USB power test to see how much USB power I can get out of it at different speeds.

Also with regards to the bar end shifters on the ends of the drops, I am thinking of routing the cable all the way up the drops, and have it come out on the tops, where a STI cable would, does anyone think this will cause any major degradation in shifting performance?

I have added some photos of the bike in its current configuration further down in this thread.

Last edited by azza_333; 02-02-17 at 04:15 AM. Reason: Update
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Old 10-02-16, 04:34 AM
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azza_333, The rims, nipples, and spokes are what I nearly bought earlier this year, but the bits they were to replace tested much better than they look. Other than some personal preference items that aren't even worth mentioning, it looks like a good build.

Brad
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Old 10-02-16, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
azza_333, The rims, nipples, and spokes are what I nearly bought earlier this year, but the bits they were to replace tested much better than they look. Other than some personal preference items that aren't even worth mentioning, it looks like a good build.

Brad
Yeah im pretty excited to out all the parts together when they arrive. What personal preference items are you talking about?
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Old 10-02-16, 09:26 AM
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Looks good. On a tool note, get yourself a Park SW-42 spoke wrench. This is one that grasps the spoke on all 4 sides rather than the normal 3 sided spoke wrench. It doesn't slip off and round the spokes as easily. I've found recently that splined spokes are far superior to normal square ones but this wrench levels the field a little.
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Old 10-02-16, 01:51 PM
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When I had my wheelset built for my 16 Kona Sutra LTD, I used Velocity Cliffhangers on a SP PD-8 Dyno for the front wheel. I did use TRP Spyre for my brakes and installed both front and rear with 160mm rotors. After installation, I spun the front wheel and noticed the inside arm of the brake was hitting the spokes. I had to change the front to a 180 rotor to allow clearance.

Not sure if you will have this problem with the Chukkers, but just thought I'd throw that out there. Mechanically, that was the only issue I encountered in my build which is pretty similar to yours vice the STI shifters. I opted for the Microshift bar ends for mountain derailleurs and Jagwire Elite Link cable housing to augment the shallow curve of my Cowbell.

I wish they had the newer T-8000 groupset when I built mine, but unfortunately it's not available in the states. I would have outsourced it in a heartbeat if it were out when I did my build. I did opt for the T786 crankset (I had to order from Germany) and the M786 Shadow+ RD.

I do have a question though, what are the TRP Spyre brake covers? I googled it and couldn't them anywhere.

*Found them after I posted...Definitely going to get some of those.

Last edited by 36Oly_Rider; 10-02-16 at 01:58 PM. Reason: Answered my own question.
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Old 10-02-16, 03:21 PM
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Though its called '4 sided' , it's really 3 .. since you have to have an open side to get it over the spoke..
The spoke Nip has 4 sides and 4 corners.. and it's not a Box wrench.

they do Grip the corners and the sides, comes around 2 corners slightly, but an open side wrench..

R&K Spokey offers the same advantage.. and has for decades.. Light,as its mostly plastic...
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Old 10-02-16, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by azza_333 View Post
I have just spent a large portion of my weekend online ordering components for my new touring bike builds.
LOOKS like a interesting, pricey, modern take on a trad-touring rig. Fine for that. Personally I'm not into it. Sitting in the drops and STI shifting all-day-long to maintain-proper-cadence is b-o-r-i-n-g to me. Would not ride, but will look at your progress-pics

I'M MORE INTERESTED in what happened with your carbon-tourer? Did you get it out on tour? If it didn't fly, which I'm thinking now with your forking toward traditional, what transpired?
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Old 10-02-16, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by BigAura View Post
LOOKS like a interesting, pricey, modern take on a trad-touring rig. Fine for that. Personally I'm not into it. Sitting in the drops and STI shifting all-day-long to maintain-proper-cadence is b-o-r-i-n-g to me. Would not ride, but will look at your progress-pics

I'M MORE INTERESTED in what happened with your carbon-tourer? Did you get it out on tour? If it didn't fly, which I'm thinking now with your forking toward traditional, what transpired?
I've still got my carbon touring bike, I still ride it everyday to and from work, and group rides on weekends, I havent had a chance to take it on any long tours yet, but I have riden it on a few 3-4 day tours, it worked great. I really want to take it for a two week tour around South Korea's new bicycle path network, but that may have to wait a couple of years.
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Old 10-02-16, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by azza_333 View Post
I've still got my carbon touring bike, I still ride it everyday to and from work, and group rides on weekends, I havent had a chance to take it on any long tours yet, but I have riden it on a few 3-4 day tours, it worked great. I really want to take it for a two week tour around South Korea's new bicycle path network, but that may have to wait a couple of years.
Sorry but you let me down, millions commute on carbon, so no break-though there

If I remember correctly you're a new dad, so I'll give you a pass. I'm a new grandpa, so I get to enjoy a little one AND tour...ha!

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Old 10-02-16, 05:11 PM
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I know that costs add up quickly, but you seem to be spending a small fortune on the build.

I'm surprised you can't source M9000 parts for that price.

Photos will be nice as you start gathering stuff together, and building.
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Old 10-02-16, 05:19 PM
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After carrying on about recharging a Di2, so to tour on a carbonfiber wunder Bike.


He went on and on about how all he could find was a complete bike not a frame set
so must have Money to Burn that hole in the pocket..
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Old 10-03-16, 03:54 AM
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Originally Posted by azza_333 View Post
Yeah im pretty excited to out all the parts together when they arrive. What personal preference items are you talking about?
I don't see much use for the interrupter brake levers, I've been leaning towards some Vittoria Rando Hyper tires or maybe Gayorskins, and I'm not comfy on Brooks saddles for three items. Like I wrote, simply trivial personal preference items that don't mean anything for your build.

While we all have read about the short chain life of 10S drive trains, the larger cassette and the larger chain rings may actually help. I'm one who does not quite understand how a 10S chain is so much more likely to stretch than a 9S chain, but if this is so, wrapping more chain onto the higher tooth count might be the answer.

Brad
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Old 10-03-16, 04:18 AM
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Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
.... I'm one who does not quite understand how a 10S chain is so much more likely to stretch than a 9S chain....
i's guessing it's 'cause the roller pins are shorter for narrower chains,
but still have the same diameter.

ever'thing else being equal....you'd be applying the same force to a
much smaller area, so makes sense the roller pins would wear faster.

logistically, you'd assume 11-speed and 12-speed chains would
stretch even faster.
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Old 10-03-16, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
I'm surprised you can't source M9000 parts for that price.
Photos will be nice as you start gathering stuff together, and building.
I would have loved to get XTR M9000 parts especially M9000 Di2, but the gearing for M9000 is too low, at least with XT T8000 I am able to get a 48/36/26 crankset, and a 11-36 cassette.
Yeah I intend to upload plenty of photos in this thread as the build progresses, I received my first parcel today(rear hub, handle bars, headset), Once its built I also want to do a bunch of testing on the SON28 hub, to see how much USB amps I can get out of the socket at different speeds. I will post the results as well.


Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
After carrying on about recharging a Di2, so to tour on a carbonfiber wunder Bike.
He went on and on about how all he could find was a complete bike not a frame set
so must have Money to Burn that hole in the pocket..
Yep you’re probably right I do have way too much money to burn, but my carbon bike has a very different purpose to my new bike build. Carbon bike is so I can be fast and light when I am supporting just myself, the new Cro-mo bike is for when I am supporting not only myself, but also my family, or friends

Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
I don't see much use for the interrupter brake levers, I've been leaning towards some Vittoria Rando Hyper tires or maybe Gayorskins, and I'm not comfy on Brooks saddles for three items. Like I wrote, simply trivial personal preference items that don't mean anything for your build.
While we all have read about the short chain life of 10S drive trains, the larger cassette and the larger chain rings may actually help. I'm one who does not quite understand how a 10S chain is so much more likely to stretch than a 9S chain, but if this is so, wrapping more chain onto the higher tooth count might be the answer.
Brad
This will be my first bike with interrupter levers, I really wanted high end hydraulic disc brakes on bike, but had to rule them out because I wanted the interrupter levers, I find I spend a lot of time on the tops, and I like the ability to brake from the tops in an emergency.

Yeah I have heard that 10 and 11 speed chains don’t last as long as the 7/8/9 speed chains, on my other bike I have 11 speed, and it is still going quite strong after probably about 3000-4000km on it. So I am not overly concerned about it.
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Old 10-03-16, 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by saddlesores View Post
i's guessing it's 'cause the roller pins are shorter for narrower chains,
but still have the same diameter.

ever'thing else being equal....you'd be applying the same force to a
much smaller area, so makes sense the roller pins would wear faster.

logistically, you'd assume 11-speed and 12-speed chains would
stretch even faster.
Interesting, I was just wondering why that was, I guess now I know the answer.
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Old 10-03-16, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Though its called '4 sided' , it's really 3 .. since you have to have an open side to get it over the spoke..
The spoke Nip has 4 sides and 4 corners.. and it's not a Box wrench.
Park Tool calls it a "four sided" spoke wrench...and with good reason. It may have an open side to get it on the spoke but that's only a partially open side compared to a regular spoke wrench. Since it engages all 4 corners of the spoke nipple, it's closer to having 4 sides than a regular spoke wrench.
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Old 10-03-16, 09:21 AM
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Brake line fitting wrenches do a similar thing, on the Hex fitting that secures the Hydraulic lines on your Cars.
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Old 10-21-16, 07:55 PM
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Update 22nd October 2016:
The bike build has been delayed a bit, due to 2 strokes of bad luck.

The Kona Sutra LTD frameset arrived, but was very damaged(a lot of rust inside the bottom bracket, and a little on the steerer tube, bend rear dropouts, bent mech hanger, quite a few paint chips. Currently the shop I ordered it from is looking into getting me a replacement from Kona, and I am currently also in contact with FEDEX to organise compensation.

My wheel builder gave me a call and the Chukker rims he got to build my wheels with were not round enough to build my wheelset with so I am currently trying to source new rims.
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Old 10-22-16, 04:40 AM
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not a great start to a bike build rust on new frame sounds bad to me i think i would be looking for a different frame ,dodgy rims back to the drawing board me thinks.not trying to be a smart arse i hope all works out fantastic for u.
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Old 10-22-16, 06:13 AM
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What is the advantage of using Shimano XT FC-T8000 vs the Suginos XD2 with similar gear ratio? I am building one touring bike as well and still debate between the 2.
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Old 10-22-16, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by bikelovers View Post
What is the advantage of using Shimano XT FC-T8000 vs the Suginos XD2 with similar gear ratio? I am building one touring bike as well and still debate between the 2.
I know nothing about the Suginos XD2 so I cant really comment.
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Old 10-22-16, 02:37 PM
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I did not see this when originally posted, I was on a trip away from the internet for over a week.

I am quite happy with Halo bolt on skewers. Any 5mm allen wrench will open them. My assumption is that a typical thief is an opportunist and will not be carrying around a multi-tool. This way I do not have to worry about losing my special skewer key. If you decide to try the Halo skewers, they take a bit of getting used to, only one spring instead of two and the nut has a tab that fits in the drop out slot. If you stick with the Pitlocks, make sure you do not lose the key.

With your wide gearing (48/36/26 and 11/36 cassette) you might find that your rear derailleur cage will not take up all the slack. As long as you avoid a few gears using the smallest chainring and smallest sprockets, that is not a problem. I only mention it so you are not surprised later if you get some odd noises when in those gears, but since those are cross chained gears I suspect you would not be using those gears anyway. After you install your chain, you could check to see if you lost any gears and if so, how many.

I have interrupter brake levers on my drop bar bikes, very happy with them.

I think I get about 600 milliamps out of my USB port at normal touring speeds, but with the Sinewave Revolution USB charger I could get a full amp down hills. Your Luxos U however has a small cache battery so you will not be able to tell how different speeds affect output because the battery would buffer the output variation from different speeds. I use the SP PV8 hub, I think the SON 28 puts out about the same power as mine.

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Old 10-22-16, 04:25 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
With your wide gearing (48/36/26 and 11/36 cassette) you might find that your rear derailleur cage will not take up all the slack. As long as you avoid a few gears using the smallest chainring and smallest sprockets, that is not a problem. I only mention it so you are not surprised later if you get some odd noises when in those gears, but since those are cross chained gears I suspect you would not be using those gears anyway. After you install your chain, you could check to see if you lost any gears and if so, how many.
Why wouldn't the rear derailleur cage not take up all the slack, by my calculations it should (47t capacity)

Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
I think I get about 600 milliamps out of my USB port at normal touring speeds, but with the Sinewave Revolution USB charger I could get a full amp down hills. Your Luxos U however has a small cache battery so you will not be able to tell how different speeds affect output because the battery would buffer the output variation from different speeds. I use the SP PV8 hub, I think the SON 28 puts out about the same power as mine.
I ask B & M already about the battery, when they say small they really do mean small only 100mah. Its supposed to get fully charged after the first 10-15min of riding. I don't see how a variation in output will effect my results, since I can look at the total mah output over 1 hour.
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Old 10-22-16, 08:22 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by azza_333 View Post
Why wouldn't the rear derailleur cage not take up all the slack, by my calculations it should (47t capacity)
...
I ask B & M already about the battery, when they say small they really do mean small only 100mah. Its supposed to get fully charged after the first 10-15min of riding. I don't see how a variation in output will effect my results, since I can look at the total mah output over 1 hour.
I made the comment on the derailleur cage possibly not taking up the slack because I use an older XT rear derailleur. With a 52/42/24 crank and 11/32 cassette, when I used the 24T chainring the 11 or 12T sprockets on the cassette did not work as the derailleur cage did not take up enough slack. With a little bit of chain stretch, the 14T sprocket also became problematic. Maybe your derailleur which is newer will have a longer cage and take up more slack. But since those gears are quite cross-chained, I would not use those gears anyway so it was a non-issue to me. If yours works, great.

Your comment on USB output was: "Once its built I also want to do a bunch of testing on the SON28 hub, to see how much USB amps I can get out of the socket at different speeds. I will post the results as well." I took that to mean that you planned to ride at several different speeds and note what your USB output measured at at those different speeds. And my point was that if you change your speed your USB port output would not immediately change because your battery would buffer short term variations. My USB charger has no battery to buffer variation, thus I get instantaneous change in output at different speeds. I can't predict how your battery system will affect output with different speeds. Will an hour at a different speed be enough to come to a new equilibrium? I do not know.

I am not trying to start any arguments here, I was just trying to alert you to a couple possible minor issues.
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Old 10-22-16, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by azza_333 View Post
This will be my first bike with interrupter levers, I really wanted high end hydraulic disc brakes on bike, but had to rule them out because I wanted the interrupter levers, I find I spend a lot of time on the tops, and I like the ability to brake from the tops in an emergency.
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I think a better move is to use 3 brakes. use the drop levers, either hydro or mechanical, and then have a small Paul lever on the top for a second front brake. That way you have redundancy in your braking, more heat distribution, you can run hydro, you have two levels for the levers, probably weighs about the same if you do something simple like run the lever on the top to either your front disk or a pederson self energizing canti front only. You have the one lever that maters on the top, and have a brake instead of the other lever.
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