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-   -   Schwalbe Supreme 26x2 followup#3 roughly9000kms (https://www.bikeforums.net/touring/1221353-schwalbe-supreme-26x2-followup-3-roughly9000kms.html)

djb 01-11-21 02:18 PM

Schwalbe Supreme 26x2 followup#3 roughly9000kms
 
Finally got around to putting up this third followup of using the 26x2 Schwalbe Supremes. Have ridden about another 3000kms on the same set of tires since the last followup, and while they have started to look a bit tired, I've kept riding on them, other than replacing the rear with my spare that has gone unused all these years.
Covid meant not any big trips done, but did ride the bike a fair amount and I kind of figure the total of kms on the two tires shown here is somewhere around 8 or 9000kms / 5-5500miles.

I've still been impressed by how they have held up, but it is interesting over the last while how they both have developed a weird "wrinkly thing" going on. So while the tread is worn, but not terribly terribly so, it's like the rubber has started to break down and get all these little stress points in it. I have ridden a fair amount loaded up on a lot of gravel and even sharpish gravel at times, and while I've been careful, I wonder if this is a factor.

I guess the main thing to take from the photos is that for my riding style and weight, they have held up fairly well and I figure that on a super long trip, one could maybe estimate about this life out of them--although they are starting to look a bit sketchy now.
I still really like the 2 inch width, they can seem like overkill at 2inches/50mm--really 45mm on my rims, but again and again even in summer 2020 I was grateful for the width and cushion when coming upon loose surfaces or just really crappy paved areas, rough or potholes.
I've just put on a new pair of 1.6 in. versions, (again, measuring less on my rims, 1.6in should be 40mm but they measure about 37mm ) and I'm curious to see how I find riding my Troll on narrower tires after all the mileage on the wider ones.

I was impressed to see that there are still minimal tiny cuts, no real bad looking ones, so in that sense they've held up well.
When you look at the tread depth using the slight tread pattern as a reference, they certainly are not totally worn down. I'll try to find the shot from my first folowup of them showing the unused spare beside the used pair with about 4000km on them

first followup link, around 4000kms on them
https://www.bikeforums.net/touring/1...pressions.html

second follow up link, about 6000kms
https://www.bikeforums.net/touring/1...ly6000kms.html


https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1219d55a9e.jpg

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...88d83a4234.jpg

IPassGas 01-11-21 07:35 PM

A few comments which may be useful. We tour on tandem (26") with camping gear and wear is generally faster. For tours on mostly rail-trail, we use 2" Schwalbe Duremes. Strong, durable, wonderful for rail-trail surface and similar in weight to Supremes. For tours mostly on road for >1000 miles, 1.5" Marathon plus, because flats are a PITA on tour. We use 1.6" Supremes on day rides, a great relatively light tire, however, they do seem more prone to cuts than the M+ or Duremes. The rubber seems more supple on Supremes.

fishboat 01-11-21 09:22 PM

Thanks for posting (continuing to) the followups. They definitely look broken in, but not bad really, given the miles. I just ordered a pair of these yesterday...I'm stocking up on a couple-few sets of 26 inchers in case we continue to lose more models. I rode about 600 miles of 26x2 tires touring this last year..first time on this type/size of tire(Big Bens). I gotta say..I liked them & will continue to do so. Not a single complaint. Very comfortable, cushy ride and not at all slow. Also ordered some Continental Contact Speed in 26x2 as they were very inexpensive..thought I'd give them a spin..

robow 01-11-21 10:10 PM

Nice write up and thanks for sharing. I purchased a pair of the new Schwalbe Evolution Supremes in 700x32 this fall and had only a limited chance to ride with them, no touring. I do plan on touring with them in February and again in April as they seem pretty tough. They did measure a little thinner than 32mm on my Mavic Open Pro rims but we'll see what they measure at on my wider touring wheelset Mavic 719 rims. I wouldn't mind them being a little wider and maybe should have purchased the next size up 35mm.

djb 01-12-21 07:33 AM


Originally Posted by IPassGas (Post 21873758)
A few comments which may be useful. We tour on tandem (26") with camping gear and wear is generally faster. For tours on mostly rail-trail, we use 2" Schwalbe Duremes. Strong, durable, wonderful for rail-trail surface and similar in weight to Supremes. For tours mostly on road for >1000 miles, 1.5" Marathon plus, because flats are a PITA on tour. We use 1.6" Supremes on day rides, a great relatively light tire, however, they do seem more prone to cuts than the M+ or Duremes. The rubber seems more supple on Supremes.

thanks, yes it would appear that 26in options are getting less and less from Schwalbe unfortunately, and the newest models arent avail in 26 now, given the general popularity of 27.5" bikes.
I just put my new pair of 1.6" on my rims and was rather disappointed in how narrow they are. I'll post another thread about this and rim width effect, but while marked as 1.6" 42mm, they measure only 36mm on my rims, which is a drag, but there you go.
re the ride, I very much have gotten hooked on the feel of how Supremes ride, but aware of the thin sidewalls and having to keep this in mind in terms of not riding up against stuff....

djb 01-12-21 07:37 AM


Originally Posted by fishboat (Post 21873892)
Thanks for posting (continuing to) the followups. They definitely look broken in, but not bad really, given the miles. I just ordered a pair of these yesterday...I'm stocking up on a couple-few sets of 26 inchers in case we continue to lose more models. I rode about 600 miles of 26x2 tires touring this last year..first time on this type/size of tire(Big Bens). I gotta say..I liked them & will continue to do so. Not a single complaint. Very comfortable, cushy ride and not at all slow. Also ordered some Continental Contact Speed in 26x2 as they were very inexpensive..thought I'd give them a spin..

as you say, the 26" market does seem to be reducing, and stashing a few tires that one likes is probably a good idea. A drag, but a good idea.

I'm still amazed by how competently these 2" slicks work well enough over loose stuff, within reason, but with the awareness that they spend most of their life on pavement or reasonable dirt, and the ride really does make the bike faster due to the characteristics of the tires, not to mention more comfortable for the old fart above said tires.

djb 01-12-21 07:40 AM


Originally Posted by robow (Post 21873951)
Nice write up and thanks for sharing. I purchased a pair of the new Schwalbe Evolution Supremes in 700x32 this fall and had only a limited chance to ride with them, no touring. I do plan on touring with them in February and again in April as they seem pretty tough. They did measure a little thinner than 32mm on my Mavic Open Pro rims but we'll see what they measure at on my wider touring wheelset Mavic 719 rims. I wouldn't mind them being a little wider and maybe should have purchased the next size up 35mm.

hi robow, re width, ya I was pretty disappointed with the 1.6" ones measuring only at 36mm vs the stated 42. I know this will be fine on pavement, and they are really light, but I've gotten used to being able to ride over all kinds of stuff even loaded and still have confidence in the front end , even jumping off the road to avoid trucks or something and the 2" ers just eat it up safely.
like I said, I'll start another thread on rim width vs tire width etc etc.

robow 01-12-21 09:37 AM

My wife's Marathon Pluses also came in well below their stated width. May well be Schwalbe's desire to display lighter advertised weights for a specific tire width.

IPassGas 01-12-21 10:23 AM

Hopefully Schwalbe will support 26" for sometime, even if I have to order directly from Schwalbe. A couple of months back I noticed Marathon Almotion 26x2.15 (HS453, folding) were on sale, so bought a pair. Schwalbe is apparently discontinuing this make of Almotion in favor of a slightly knobby style (HS603) and not in 26". The HS453 are similar to the unavailable Duremes and like the large width for rail-trail (with Andra 35 rims). I hope that Schwalbe continues more styles in 26 than only M, M+. At least continue the Supremes, however, on extended road tours (hopefully this summer again), I am not sure about Supreme durability.

djb 01-12-21 11:20 AM


Originally Posted by robow (Post 21874363)
My wife's Marathon Pluses also came in well below their stated width. May well be Schwalbe's desire to display lighter advertised weights for a specific tire width.

my wifes regular marathons 1.5" on her slightly wider rims are pretty much spot on the 40mm stated (maybe 39) so last night I took them off and put my 1.6" 42mm on those rims, but they were still only 37, vs 36 on my narrower rims.
Now I understand that after some rides and time, tires will widen up a mm or two, and my narrower rims today show 37 vs 36mm, but thats still 5mm less than the stated 42, which I was really hoping they would be, especially coming from my realworld 45mm 2" inch supremes (supposed to be 50mm)

oh, my 2" ones at 45mm have very much stayed at 45mm real world width after all these years, so I suspect it partly due to my narrower rims and also partly due to them undersizing them slightly maybe (conjecture on my part)

not a huge difference, but Ive really come to like wider tires.

djb 01-12-21 11:30 AM


Originally Posted by IPassGas (Post 21874427)
Hopefully Schwalbe will support 26" for sometime, even if I have to order directly from Schwalbe. A couple of months back I noticed Marathon Almotion 26x2.15 (HS453, folding) were on sale, so bought a pair. Schwalbe is apparently discontinuing this make of Almotion in favor of a slightly knobby style (HS603) and not in 26". The HS453 are similar to the unavailable Duremes and like the large width for rail-trail (with Andra 35 rims). I hope that Schwalbe continues more styles in 26 than only M, M+. At least continue the Supremes, however, on extended road tours (hopefully this summer again), I am not sure about Supreme durability.

ya, I should have gooten some of those Almotions, they seem to be gone now on their site. I still may try to find some on some German websites.

re the Supreme durability---I can see a bit of concern if riding over really rocky roads, with big sharp stones/rocks, as the sidewall would be open to cuts more than a tough tire---BUT dont forget, I rode my set through half of Mexico and through Central America on two seperate trips, and ran over a crapload of glass and crap in places like Guatemala and Honduras (but was very good at stopping to brush out embedded stuff when I knew I had really ridden through bad looking stuff), so for me, they were really damn impressive.
Not getting a flat in 4500kms of Latin American roads was a big surprise to me, but I do acknowledge that all my riding life, I tend not to get flats, so rider behaviour plays a big part. Still the main body of the tread was really good with glass and stuff.
I'm a big fan, but just very aware of their weaknesses or what you shouldnt ride through, and or where you should be careful.

so it really depends on what you ride. I took a chance knowing that I'd be predominantly on paved and kinda "normal" reasonable dirt and gravel.

fishboat 01-12-21 11:50 AM


Originally Posted by djb (Post 21874573)
ya, I should have gotten some of those Almotions, they seem to be gone now on their site. I still may try to find some on some German websites.





I tried to find them 3-4 months ago..nada..Bike24 had/has them listed, but unavailable

IPassGas 01-12-21 05:05 PM


Originally Posted by djb (Post 21874573)
ya, I should have gooten some of those Almotions, they seem to be gone now on their site. I still may try to find some on some German websites.

re the Supreme durability---I can see a bit of concern if riding over really rocky roads, with big sharp stones/rocks, as the sidewall would be open to cuts more than a tough tire---BUT dont forget, I rode my set through half of Mexico and through Central America on two seperate trips, and ran over a crapload of glass and crap in places like Guatemala and Honduras (but was very good at stopping to brush out embedded stuff when I knew I had really ridden through bad looking stuff), so for me, they were really damn impressive.
Not getting a flat in 4500kms of Latin American roads was a big surprise to me, but I do acknowledge that all my riding life, I tend not to get flats, so rider behaviour plays a big part. Still the main body of the tread was really good with glass and stuff.
I'm a big fan, but just very aware of their weaknesses or what you shouldnt ride through, and or where you should be careful.

so it really depends on what you ride. I took a chance knowing that I'd be predominantly on paved and kinda "normal" reasonable dirt and gravel.

Thanks very much, so we will try the supremes on extended road tour this summer.

gauvins 01-12-21 05:07 PM

Great review. Thanks

Funny (or is it) that 26" were recommended because they are available everywhere around the world...

Tourist in MSN 01-13-21 06:40 AM

A couple years ago, SJS said that they got a batch of Duremes made on a special order. They still have them in stock.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/tyres/sc...50559/?geoc=US

At times their delivery fees have been reasonable, at times horrendously high priced to ship to USA. At this time the shipping fees are on the horrendous side of things. It looks like a minimum shipping fee is $49 USD. Not sure if that will get better or not, it is possible that Covid has caused these high shipping fees. And now with Brexit, maybe shipping fees will not get better?

Tourist in MSN 01-13-21 06:45 AM


Originally Posted by gauvins (Post 21875111)
Great review. Thanks

Funny (or is it) that 26" were recommended because they are available everywhere around the world...

I find the funny part to be that I retired a bike in the 1980s because I was unable to buy tires for the obscure obsolete tire size that the bike used. That was pre-internet, so shopping for something unusual was something you just did not want to do. But, now that the obscure obsolete size 650b is a thing again, every once in a while I consider getting that old three speed out of storage and putting new rubber on it.

fishboat 01-13-21 07:50 AM


Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN (Post 21875685)
...at times horrendously high priced to ship to USA...

FWIW for anyone looking for tires..Bike24 shipping for one tire or 9 tires(as I recently picked up) is 19.99 Euro. Seems pretty reasonable given their prices and distance/complexity. My last order a few months ago took about 10 days to get here. And they actually have tires in stock..which has been a struggle in recent months.

The vendor BikeInn (never ordered from them) had some decent prices, but their shipping was cumulative with each cart-add. I tried to order 3 sets of different tires a few months back and they wanted something like $64 for shipping..domestic..nuts.. I went to Germany..

gauvins 01-13-21 07:58 AM


Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN (Post 21875685)
A couple years ago, SJS said that they got a batch of Duremes made on a special order. They still have them in stock.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/tyres/sc...50559/?geoc=US

At times their delivery fees have been reasonable, at times horrendously high priced to ship to USA. At this time the shipping fees are on the horrendous side of things. It looks like a minimum shipping fee is $49 USD. Not sure if that will get better or not, it is possible that Covid has caused these high shipping fees. And now with Brexit, maybe shipping fees will not get better?

Great find. Note that shipping cost doesn't increase linearly with the number of tires. 36 pounds for 1 or 2, and roughly 6 pounds per additional tire. (Interestingly, it is almost as expensive to ship to Continental Europe)

djb 01-13-21 08:32 AM


Originally Posted by gauvins (Post 21875111)
Great review. Thanks

Funny (or is it) that 26" were recommended because they are available everywhere around the world...

Thanks, merci.
I figure that with the two other reviews I put up, I hope it gives at least my experience with the tires and some expectancy of how they will last etc.

and yes, the whole 26" everywhere around the world thing has certainly changed--to an extent--I think its still fair to say that it probably is more common to find any sort of 26" tire in little places in many developing countries, just because so many of the bikes are still being used. It's clear that any modern, more "fancy" bike store anywhere in the world will always be following trends and selling 27.5 tires or whatever simply because the newer bikes sold use them. Even in the bike stores we went into in Central American cities had mountain bikes being sold just as here in Canada, and no longer selling any 26" new bikes.

I still feel its important on a long far off trip, to take a spare of the tire you want to use, but really, todays tire technology is so good. I'm still amazed that these specific tires have held up so well over such a long time, and especially riding loaded so much and on so many surface types, and especially some of the really really rough and sharp that I've ridden over....

PS--it wouldnt surprise me to see 26 come back slightly again at some point. The industry seems to do this sort of thing.

djb 01-13-21 08:35 AM


Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN (Post 21875690)
I find the funny part to be that I retired a bike in the 1980s because I was unable to buy tires for the obscure obsolete tire size that the bike used. That was pre-internet, so shopping for something unusual was something you just did not want to do. But, now that the obscure obsolete size 650b is a thing again, every once in a while I consider getting that old three speed out of storage and putting new rubber on it.

we were lent a junior road bike many years ago, for my short wife to try out, and at the time, 650b was extremely rare. The big bike store I'd gone to for years had one model of tire, road tire, for it, but in the end, the bike just didnt fit her that well and I was glad that we eventually found a XS road frame that fit her well with 700s, so it was nice to be able to use the same tubes as spares on rides together. One less thing to remember.

djb 01-13-21 08:37 AM


Originally Posted by fishboat (Post 21875740)
FWIW for anyone looking for tires..Bike24 shipping for one tire or 9 tires(as I recently picked up) is 19.99 Euro. Seems pretty reasonable given their prices and distance/complexity. My last order a few months ago took about 10 days to get here. And they actually have tires in stock..which has been a struggle in recent months.

The vendor BikeInn (never ordered from them) had some decent prices, but their shipping was cumulative with each cart-add. I tried to order 3 sets of different tires a few months back and they wanted something like $64 for shipping..domestic..nuts.. I went to Germany..

i agree on bike24, a friend ordered a batch of tires and the 20 euro cost was for all of the tires he ordered. A little slow in coming, but covid related for sure.

djb 01-13-21 08:50 AM


Originally Posted by IPassGas (Post 21875109)
Thanks very much, so we will try the supremes on extended road tour this summer.

if you do, keep track on pre tour test rides of pressures. I found that you don't need to have too high pressures to get really good rolling resistance. The psi obviously depends on total bike weight, so dependant on everyones diff situation. On my long trips, it gave me something to do, to try different pressures, and to adjust in small amounts and go by feel. Spending all day on a bike day after day after week gave me lots of opportunities to try out diff pressures, and often would just "burp" out a bit, just to take out the overly harshness, and still had good rolling.
If attentive, you quickly get attuned to what is that psi that is good for comfort, yet still rolls well.
I sometimes adjusted for road surfaces, and going just a bit lower often made a huge difference for my comfort on rough or loose stuff, well worth it for the days worth of feeling tired and less beat up.

Less beat up = less tired = more energy over the day = faster overall

Tourist in MSN 01-13-21 10:45 AM


Originally Posted by fishboat (Post 21875740)
FWIW for anyone looking for tires..Bike24 shipping for one tire or 9 tires(as I recently picked up) is 19.99 Euro. .....

Never bought any tires from them, but I have bought a few things in the past, including my Rohloff hub eight years ago. I think I saved about $500 USD by buying that hub from Germany instead of within USA. A bike parts seller in USA would have to pay customs fees to import that but that is about 4 percent, does not justify how big their markup is.

Right now I am waiting for a order from Bike24 to be filled, a couple things in my basket were out of stock with weeks long lead time. But I can wait a few months, do not need the parts right away.



Originally Posted by fishboat (Post 21875740)
...The vendor BikeInn (never ordered from them) had some decent prices, but their shipping was cumulative with each cart-add. I tried to order 3 sets of different tires a few months back and they wanted something like $64 for shipping..domestic..nuts.. I went to Germany..

I did buy a few things from Bike Inn, one order took forever to arrive but the other was very fast. I would buy from them again if they had something I wanted.

IPassGas 01-13-21 11:00 AM

European touring bikes were sold with 26" wheels, but perhaps that has also changed. Is Europe also moving away from anything 26"?

djb 01-13-21 12:02 PM


Originally Posted by IPassGas (Post 21876041)
European touring bikes were sold with 26" wheels, but perhaps that has also changed. Is Europe also moving away from anything 26"?

thats a good question, but I really dont know. Even though I have friends in France, they arent bike people, and I don't keep track of European market.
I suspect however, that 27.5 is getting more common, simply because there are more and more bikes with it.
I do get the logic, 29er stuff was designed because it rolls easier over bumps, and then they figured out that inbetween 700 and 26 is a good compromise, so I'm not even against getting a 27.5 bike at some point.
I suspect also that my 26" designed Surly Troll would work well with 27.5 , within reason of tire size, as the outer diameter of tires I would use could be similarish to the 26 wheel/tires combos I've used. I just mention that without checking the details, thinking of perhaps a future wheelset choice (thinking wider rims that would work with 2.5-2.8" tires better)

I still feel that no matter, gazillions of 26" bikes are going to be around for ages, and good tires will always be able to be sold, so companies should keep making good tires.
We'll see....


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