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Touring Bike (rim brake) for Allroad Riding

Old 01-22-22, 06:10 AM
  #26  
ted_major
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Handsome XOXO?
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Old 01-22-22, 09:39 AM
  #27  
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This topic interests me. I broke my old Madone rim brake bike last year and instead of taking the rim brake Elmonda frame offered used for the credit for a Domane SL6. Love it but should have gotten a Checkpoint. Did not want to wait 6 month.

So looked for a rim brake calliper frame. Wanted for the trainer mainly but to run to the store and light rail trail touring. Found a Trek 1000C frame on eBay and built it up. Works well but needs a new fork for more tire clearance. I fit a 32mm on the rear but 25 is max up front. Really should get another frame.

This brings up the question which may help the OP. Any disk frames that will accept calliper rim brakes? I saw the Poseidon X is standard dropouts and reached out and asked about it I can fit calliper brakes. Edit: The X does not have a hole in the rear for a rim brake calliper.

Hereís my current all road build. Needs a fork. And yes Iím crazy running the carbon wheels. But they have held up better than any aluminum wheels Iíve had. Including 36 spoke. Never touched a spoke. And they look cool.


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Old 01-22-22, 01:14 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Noonievut View Post
Iím looking for a steel bike, rim brakes (mini V perhaps), clearance for 40mm tires. ...
Originally Posted by biker128pedal View Post
...
This brings up the question which may help the OP. Any disk frames that will accept calliper rim brakes? I saw the Poseidon X is standard dropouts and reached out and asked about it I can fit calliper brakes. ...
...
When you say caliper brakes, which I would assume you mean side pull brakes. Or since center pull brakes fit on the same frame mounting point if you can add a cable hanger, I am sure that a lot of disc brake frames and forks would be able to have one fitted. (I think some people call a center pull brake a U brake.)

But, the OP is asking about 40mm tire clearance. You would be looking for brakes with unusually long arms. I assume they exist, but your standard brakes probably will not fit.

And a front fork that does not have the conventional crown might not work. I am pretty confident that a carbon fork that was not designed for a sidepull brake would not be a good fork to experiment with.
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Old 01-22-22, 03:36 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
When you say caliper brakes, which I would assume you mean side pull brakes. Or since center pull brakes fit on the same frame mounting point if you can add a cable hanger, I am sure that a lot of disc brake frames and forks would be able to have one fitted. (I think some people call a center pull brake a U brake.)

But, the OP is asking about 40mm tire clearance. You would be looking for brakes with unusually long arms. I assume they exist, but your standard brakes probably will not fit.

And a front fork that does not have the conventional crown might not work. I am pretty confident that a carbon fork that was not designed for a sidepull brake would not be a good fork to experiment with.
Yes side pull. 40mm is pushing it for side pulls. ​With what I know now Iíd have gone V or cantilever frame and used those adapters to change the pull ratio for the brakes if needed. Lesson is donít do what I did.

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Old 01-22-22, 04:10 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by biker128pedal View Post
Yes side pull. 40mm is pushing it for side pulls. ​With what I know now Iíd have gone V or cantilever frame and used those adapters to change the pull ratio for the brakes if needed. Lesson is donít do what I did.
Yeah, the photo of the rear brake that was posted by TCS in post number 20 above looks like a centerpull brake with really long reach.

Photo below is the only bike I have that has sidepull brakes, this is my road bike. The tires are 28mm. Manufacturer said that the bike can take 28mm tires but I suspect I might be able to fit 32mm. But those brakes clearly do not have the arm length needed for a fork that has enough clearance for a 40mm tire.

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Old 01-22-22, 07:37 PM
  #31  
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The Ultegra side pull was too short for the 1000 frame. I had to switch to mid reach Shimano brakes. There are longer reach. Now in the rear with the mid reach brake the 1000 frame will fit a 32mm tire. There is more room on the sides. A 38mm will fit to the sides but the seat stay bridge is too close. Maybe a low profile tire if that exists or tread on the sides. Spare bike for now.

Is that a Soma?
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Old 01-23-22, 04:38 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by biker128pedal View Post
...
Is that a Soma?
If you asked me on my road bike photo in post 30, that is a 2017 or 2018 Raleigh Grand Prix. It was an odd model, not sure how many years they sold it. It had a Campy drivetrain on a Ritchie Break Away frame.
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Old 01-23-22, 07:58 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
Yeah, the photo of the rear brake that was posted by TCS in post number 20 above looks like a centerpull brake with really long reach.
It's a 650 conversion. This undoubtedly voided my warranty as the Disc Trucker is strictly an ISO559 or ISO622 bike.
I wouldn't have put a caliper brake on it but I got a rrreeeaaalllyyy good deal on a non-disc Rohloff hub. Perhaps somewhat shockingly, my group has not gotten more cavities.

OP:
1) There must be a gazillion existing bikes out in the world built over the last decades that meet your stated requirements. Check craigslist in your local market.
2) Soma New Albion Privateer, perhaps? Mini-Vs, sure, but Paul cantis would be the cat's pajamas.
3) You want what you want. I get that. I certainly want you to be happy with your new bike. I did the 'roll your eyes at yet more new whizzbangs the bike industry is trying to sell us' thing with discs. Anyway, to combat lockdown ennui I built up a new bike and fitted TRP HY-RD cable-actuated hydraulic disc brakes with Shimano ICE discs. WOW. Massive power but with minute modulation. I'd suggest not investing in a new rim braked bike without at least taking a ride on a modern spec bike with quality discs.
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Old 01-23-22, 08:44 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by tcs View Post
It's a 650 conversion. This undoubtedly voided my warranty as the Disc Trucker is strictly an ISO559 or ISO622 bike.
I wouldn't have put a caliper brake on it but I got a rrreeeaaalllyyy good deal on a non-disc Rohloff hub. Perhaps somewhat shockingly, my group has not gotten more cavities.
....
I do not know if the Surly warranty is worth anything anyway. I bought a 2004 LHT frame and fork, Surly refused to warranty it. I eventually put the frame in the recycle bin. The frame was such a wet noodle that I did not want anyone else to suffer, so did not sell or donate to charity. A frame builder told me in excruciating detail how the welder had their heat settings messed up and that was the reason that my bottom bracket shell was badly warped and how that could be the reason the frame flex was so bad.

Surly had a big batch of red LHT bikes over a decade ago, that is the only time I have heard of Surly actually doing a warranty on one of their frames, but when the paint (or powdercoat) falls off, it is rather evident that something is wrong. They can't pretend that it did not happen.

Congrats on the Rohloff. I have no clue how much the disc conversion costs, but it is not cheap. And Rohloff discs are four bolt so that is an expensive rotor. My Rohloff is staying on a frame designed for rim brakes, although that frame can also handle disc.
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Old 01-24-22, 01:07 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Mooree View Post
A front hub dynamo provides a consistent power source that is not reliant on mains energy on some touring cycles. The line can be routed through the forkís leg to keep the dynamo cable out of serious trouble.
I'm curious. I've ridden tens of thousands of miles with dynamo cables wrapped around the forks without issues. What kind of serious trouble can I expect, and when will it start?
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Old 01-24-22, 01:14 PM
  #36  
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I use mini-Vs on my touring bike but I think they would be a very tight fit for 40mm wide tires. I currently have 35mm tires and there is not a whole lot of room left. IT might work but I wouldn't make the assumption without trying it first.
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Old 01-25-22, 10:54 PM
  #37  
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Cross-Check. I’ve ridden it with light 28mm to tough 42 mm tires. Decent all around bike.
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Old 01-26-22, 05:26 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by ClydeClydeson View Post
I use mini-Vs on my touring bike but I think they would be a very tight fit for 40mm wide tires. I currently have 35mm tires and there is not a whole lot of room left. IT might work but I wouldn't make the assumption without trying it first.
Iíve talked to a shop about this and it depends on the length of the arms on the brakes. 90mm arms are on a bike in the shop and clear a 41mm tire.
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Old 01-26-22, 02:55 PM
  #39  
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I have these particular mini v's on 3 of my bikes including my touring bike. These are 85mm length arms and you're looking at a 33mm tire. Obviously if you're not going to be using fenders, a 40mm would be no problem and you might be able to squeeze in a 45mm.

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Old 01-26-22, 03:23 PM
  #40  
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My folding bike uses 85mm length Tektro mini-V brakes and has 40mm Schwalbe tires. No fenders.

I think it depends on exact placement of the canti posts on the frame.



If you needed longer V brakes, you could use Travel Agents (not sure if they are still made) to allow you to use longer full size V brakes with road bike brake levers.

I think these V brakes in the photo below are 110mm long Tektro, I use road brakes, note the Travel Agent in place of a noodle.



If you are not familiar with Travel Agents,
https://www.parktool.com/blog/repair...and-adjustment
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Old 01-27-22, 07:28 AM
  #41  
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Cross Check
700x44, rim brake, racks
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Old 01-30-22, 08:55 PM
  #42  
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I'd suggest checking out the Bianchi Volpe. It is a very good all-purpose bike. If you have feet the are size 10 or smaller, you can get most panniers on it without heel strike.

It does fully loaded well, and holds it own on gravel and club rides. Our son started his cyclocross racing career on a Volpe. I have 2 other touring bikes, a Surly LHT and a Cannondale T2, but the Volpe has been my choice for a ride across the U.S., and 3 months riding through 7 European countries It is my go-to bike.


My first Volpe (with 28 mm tires), riding across the U.S.

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Old 01-30-22, 11:21 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
My folding bike uses 85mm length Tektro mini-V brakes and has 40mm Schwalbe tires. No fenders.

I think it depends on exact placement of the canti posts on the frame.



If you needed longer V brakes, you could use Travel Agents (not sure if they are still made) to allow you to use longer full size V brakes with road bike brake levers.

I think these V brakes in the photo below are 110mm long Tektro, I use road brakes, note the Travel Agent in place of a noodle.



If you are not familiar with Travel Agents,
https://www.parktool.com/blog/repair...and-adjustment
Another picture of a Travel Agent. My wife has over 26,000 miles on the original Travel Agents without any problems. I bought a couple of spares when I put these on her bike 10 years ago, because I did not trust them. Some day I might use those spares on one of my bikes

Last edited by Doug64; 02-03-22 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 01-31-22, 04:41 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Doug64 View Post
... My wife has over 26,000 miles on the original Travel Agents without any problems. I bought a couple of spares when I put these on her bike 10 years ago, because I did not trust them. Some day I might use those spares on one of my bikes
I am not sure if Travel Agents are still made. I saw some copies on Ebay that were sold from Asia, bought one to have a spare. But all things associated with rim brakes are getting harder to find these days.

My heavy touring bike, I can't fit the fenders in the S&S case when I travel, so the brakes will catch a lot of mud on rainy days on dirt and gravel roads or trails. I had so much mud on my rear brake one day that the springs in the brakes were not strong enough to open up the V brakes. Thus, if I used my rear brake, I had to get off the bike and use my hands to pull the V brakes apart. Once I cleaned the mud off in the campsite, they worked fine again. That is the only time I had trouble with travel agents.
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Old 02-02-22, 07:07 AM
  #45  
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OP here. I decided to build up a Surly Cross Check frameset. I have boxes of parts Iíll be putting to use in this fun project. And I may even do a light tour on her! Thanks for the replies
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Old 02-02-22, 01:37 PM
  #46  
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Please post up some photos when completed
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Old 02-06-22, 11:54 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by tcs View Post
Or not so strict. You can put caliper brakes on a Disc Trucker, and I'm guessing at least some other disc bikes.
There are no canit bosses on the new Disc Trucker, so you cannot put them on that frame.

Interestingly, Surly still lists the original LHT on its website, finding one is a different story altogether.
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Old 02-06-22, 11:59 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
Yeah, the photo of the rear brake that was posted by TCS in post number 20 above looks like a centerpull brake with really long reach.

Photo below is the only bike I have that has sidepull brakes, this is my road bike. The tires are 28mm. Manufacturer said that the bike can take 28mm tires but I suspect I might be able to fit 32mm. But those brakes clearly do not have the arm length needed for a fork that has enough clearance for a 40mm tire.

That's what I saw too, and there is no way I would mount a long reach brake on the Disc Trucker seat stay bridge. It doesn't look substantial enough for the job, especially the added leverage from a long pull brake.

On the other hand, your brake and headlight looks like a work of art. Nice.
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Old 02-06-22, 12:35 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by phughes View Post
...
On the other hand, your brake and headlight looks like a work of art. Nice.
Thank you. And it works too.

I really did not think this bracket would work, but you do not know until you try it.
https://www.bumm.de/en/products/mehr...kt/475du.html?

And it worked perfectly, the bolt through the fork crown is long enough that there still are plenty of threads holding the brake to the fork, the brake arms do not touch the light bracket, I was just lucky.

The light I have is 70 lux, they apparently upped it to 80 lux now.
https://www.bumm.de/de/produkte/dyna...di-silber.html
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Old 02-06-22, 01:56 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN View Post
Thank you. And it works too.

I really did not think this bracket would work, but you do not know until you try it.
https://www.bumm.de/en/products/mehr...kt/475du.html?

And it worked perfectly, the bolt through the fork crown is long enough that there still are plenty of threads holding the brake to the fork, the brake arms do not touch the light bracket, I was just lucky.

The light I have is 70 lux, they apparently upped it to 80 lux now.
https://www.bumm.de/de/produkte/dyna...di-silber.html
Very nice. I like their products. I use one of their large taillights on my rear rack. Very visible.
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