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Touring with One-By Drivetrain?

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Touring with One-By Drivetrain?

Old 08-20-23, 02:54 AM
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Pedal assisted descents are fun - if you like the rush from speed (and have good brakes & tyres).
Ascents aren't much fun, but they can be ameliorated with a granny gear.
So, this is where the triple comes into play for touring: a 20-26T for granny, a 30-40T for cruising, and a 48-52T for descending.
The only advantage I see to a one-by drive train is making it easy to electrify with a mid-drive motor.
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Old 08-20-23, 05:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Atlas Shrugged
How much momentum are you really able to maintain with a fully loaded touring rig pannier’s and all.
I rode the ST with an uncoventional setup that limited my range to 25.1 to 87.8 gear inches. I rode with a guy with typical endurance road bike gearing. I typically descended faster than him and maintained the speed to the start of the next climb. I just spun up to a really high cadence at the top of the descent to get going and then let it roll. I found that the limited top gear was never much of a limitation if any at all.

OTOH, Nothing to do with gearing, but I was always very easily out climbed by the guy I was riding with because he was young and strong (I had maybe 40 years on him). That was especially impressive since he was carrying way more than I was. I was a good bit faster on some types or rolling terrain that suited my body type and riding style though.
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Old 08-20-23, 07:47 AM
  #78  
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I just noticed that on my 3x touring bike that I rarely shift the front and rear to get a smaller change in gearing. Most of my time is spent in the middle chainring and running up and down the freewheel. Going on uphill? Into the granny, down the freewheel to adjust and then shift as needed. Downhill? Big ring and repeat.

I am rarely looking for that half step that can be achieved with a change in chainrings, likely because the bike has bar-end shifters.

On my roadbike with brifters, I much more likely to find that half step gear.

With all of this in mind, I'd consider 1x for touring if the gear range is big enough. I'd just live with the big steps. But my next tourer has 20" wheels with 2x, as 1x systems on 20" wheels can bring the long cage derailleur perilously close to the ground.

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Old 08-20-23, 09:36 AM
  #79  
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In the last few days, I've held 30kph+ for a good while with a stiff tailwind, probably using the 44/13 or 11 on my bike, so fun to have the MTB triple on my bike.
Also regularly hit 40, 50, 60k on downhills.

More importantly, I've had my ass kicked by steep hills and really glad I have my first gear of 22/34 when needed.
I've also had my ass kicked by relentless headwinds, riding on the flat in my 22t granny sometimes at 8, 9, 10kph.

But I suspect a good double and 11 speed could be close.
I'm in Scotland.
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Old 08-20-23, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Atlas Shrugged
How much momentum are you really able to maintain with a fully loaded touring rig pannier’s and all.
It is very similar to a pendulum, your momentum on the downhill, if you can maintain the speed at the bottom that gives you some help part way up the other side. Your work is measured in feet of elevation multiplied by pounds lifted.

But it does not help much if you go down a hill, have a sharp turn where you go across a narrow bridge, sharp turn again and back up the hill. I did a lot of hills like that on Pacific Coast, you need to brake at the bottom and that consumes a lot of your energy.
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Old 08-20-23, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by djb
...
I'm in Scotland.
When you get back, we need photos.
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Old 08-20-23, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
When you get back, we need photos.
I'm really doing more family visiting than serious riding, but that's okay.
Still some pretty awesome landscapes.
But damn challenging, plus I realize I'm getting old.....
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Old 08-20-23, 01:58 PM
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For a 1x, the limiting factor is the hardest gear. Are you satisfied with 11xY gear inches for your fastest gear, with the limiting factor the teeth on your chainring? (Or perhaps you have a 10 in the back?) But 10 or 11, the sky is almost the limit for the easiest, with the cassettes available today.

I run an 8 speed 11-32 with a 32 front on my do-everything rig. 1:1 is fine for accents, even with load. Descents ... Coasting

Or call coasting "recovery" if necessary
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Old 08-20-23, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Frkl
For a 1x, the limiting factor is the hardest gear. Are you satisfied with 11xY gear inches for your fastest gear, with the limiting factor the teeth on your chainring? (Or perhaps you have a 10 in the back?) But 10 or 11, the sky is almost the limit for the easiest, with the cassettes available today.

I run an 8 speed 11-32 with a 32 front on my do-everything rig. 1:1 is fine for accents, even with load. Descents ... Coasting

Or call coasting "recovery" if necessary
A 1:1 is usually somewhere around 25 or 30 gear inches.
That is nowhere fine for touring, not for steep hills, not for headwinds.
Depends on the hills, the total bike weight, but really though, that's not smart gearing for touring, imo, but your knees are your knees.
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Old 08-20-23, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Frkl
...
I run an 8 speed 11-32 with a 32 front on my do-everything rig. 1:1 is fine for accents, even with load. Descents ... Coasting
...
I run the same type of cassette for both touring and randonneuring. On my rando bike my smallest chainring is 30 which is similar to yours. But that bike is not used for carrying much of a load. If it was, I would want a lower gear. My derailleur touring bikes have a 24T chainring with that same rear cassette.
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Old 08-20-23, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by elcruxio
Now I'm willing to admit that I'm a cyclist first and a tourist second but the two are pretty close.
I think that pretty much sums it up. Some people are cyclists who tour so they can go on a bike ride. Some people are tourists who just happen to be riding a bike.

In the first case, a person is looking at the C&O, the Katy Trail, or the Great Divide and thinking, here's a famous bike ride. I'm going to do this bike ride. Maybe on top of the cycling aspect, you also have a time limit. You want to go fast.

Then you have someone like me who right now is in the middle of a one year tour. 20+ countries. I'm a tourist. The prioritization is different. 20 mph is fast enough for me. Above that I chill and coast. I do 60-80 miles a day, rarely centuries. For example today I did 75 miles. No real pressure for speed.
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Old 08-21-23, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Yan
... I do 60-80 miles a day, rarely centuries. For example today I did 75 miles. No real pressure for speed.
That is quite an accomplishment to maintain every traveling day on a long tour. Congrats.
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Old 08-21-23, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by djb
A 1:1 is usually somewhere around 25 or 30 gear inches.
That is nowhere fine for touring, not for steep hills, not for headwinds.
Depends on the hills, the total bike weight, but really though, that's not smart gearing for touring, imo, but your knees are your knees.
There is a pretty wide range of what is acceptable based on the rider, the load, and the terrain expected. There are quite a few folks that can get by fine with 25 gear inches. There are some that are okay with 30 gear inches.

I found 25 gi okay for me for the Southern Tier with a very light load. On the Sierra Cascades route or with a much heavier load I'd want a bit lower gearing.

I met a guy with a not especially light load and typical endurance bike oem 2X gearing. We were on the west coast and he couldn't understand how folks with triples and a lighter load were complaining about not having low enough granny gears. He had just ridden from Chicago and thought the standard road gearing was just fine. He was cranking out high mileage days crossing the mountains too.

At the other end of the scale I know folks who want really low gears and consider them an absolute requirement.
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Old 09-04-23, 11:22 AM
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You gotta just ride your own ride, I still have the opinion from lots of touring experience and from my riding friends experience, that lower is better. It's easy to shift up, but impossible to shift down when you can't, and that is a way more common occurrence.
Sure there are the hard ass strong riders, but I've never been one of those, and that's okay, I'm fine with that and figure I'm pretty average, especially now that I'm an old guy.
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Old 09-05-23, 04:09 AM
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If your low is only 30 gear inches when fully loaded, you are a very strong rider, and by no means average. And this comes from a flat lander that must deal with a lot of wind.
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Old 09-14-23, 01:40 PM
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I want as many gear choices as possible but with my first 20 years of touring all that existed were 10-speed bikes and I got by just fine. So an 11-speed 1x would not be a problem for touring with the right cluster in theory. I say in theory as it really depends on the two lowest gears being low enough for going up long steep grades with 100% certainty of making it to the top. Probably not too difficult to replace the two largest cogs on a cassette with larger ones if needed to get the low gears one wants.
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Old 09-15-23, 06:51 PM
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I’m only a weekend tourer and I run a 1x on my Ritchey Ascent, drop bars, barend shifters. Depending on the elevation profile I swap chainrings before each trip.
Running a 10-51, 12-speed cassette, my chainring choices are 28, 30, 32, & 34. On my off-road trips I usually run the 28 or 30 ring, with the 28 ring yielding about 15 GI. low gear. Sometimes a hassle swapping rings but it works for me.
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Old 09-16-23, 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by roadfix
I’m only a weekend tourer and I run a 1x on my Ritchey Ascent, drop bars, barend shifters. Depending on the elevation profile I swap chainrings before each trip.
Running a 10-51, 12-speed cassette, my chainring choices are 28, 30, 32, & 34. On my off-road trips I usually run the 28 or 30 ring, with the 28 ring yielding about 15 GI. low gear. Sometimes a hassle swapping rings but it works for me.
Swapping rings to suit the trip isn't an unreasonable solution if you find it necessary or just desirable.

Heck, swapping rings for a portion of a long tour might make sense in some cases. Doing it for a single long climb on a road tour wouldn't be completely out of the question. If you are going to be climbing several thousands of feet of elevation at a steep grade taking 5 minutes to swap rings wouldn't be a huge deal. Taking a second ring adds maybe a couple ounces and swapping takes a few minutes. Having one mailed from home when you got out of or to the mountains on a cross country tour would also be an option. I doubt I'd actually feel the need to do so on a road tour with a 10-51 unless I made a poor ring choice to start with, but if someone wanted to have that flexibility it would be easy to do.
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Old 09-16-23, 06:17 AM
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Stae, I suspect when you reread that even you will find how impractical that would be.
I guess because I find chain systems to be so reliable, a double with a tighter cassette is the answer here and a tighter cassette has nice riding advantages.
For off road stuff, sure I get 1x, and like you use it very happily, but not other riding.
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Old 09-16-23, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by djb
Stae, I suspect when you reread that even you will find how impractical that would be.
....
Swapping out a chainring can be really simple, or really hard depending on how the crankset is designed.

On my Rohloff bike (which is essentially a 1X system) I use a 44T ring for riding around near home where I am never hauling a heavy load up a steep hill. But for touring or difficult off road riding, I swap rings to a 36T. The rings are 110mm BCD five arm, so easy to swap out. Since I have no spring loaded chain tensioner like a derailleur, I also have to remove or add 4 chain links, plus adjust chain tension, not a big deal but not that fast.

I would never suggest it for changing during a tour, only at the start and finish. I can walk up a tall hill in the same amount of time that I can swap out a chainring and add or subtract some links.

I like to use a bash guard/chain guard in the outer position on a double crank on my Rohloff bike. Before I obtained a bashguard that fit my 36T ring, I used a 44T ring as a bashguard for it. So, for a couple trips, I had both rings on the bike and if I really had wanted to change the gearing that much, it would have only taken a few minutes to add or subtract a few links, and readjust the chain tension. But I never did it during a trip. Now that I have appropriately sized bash guards for both ring sizes, I never put both rings on the crank anymore.
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Old 09-22-23, 08:48 PM
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My other option is to add a smaller chainring (double chainring, 26/34, for example) without altering the original chain line. The smaller ring will only be used with the largest, say, two or three cogs. No front derailleur, manual “shifting” only.
But not sure that can be done on a 1x direct mount crankset…. Just a thought…
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Old 01-06-24, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by roadfix
I’m only a weekend tourer and I run a 1x on my Ritchey Ascent, drop bars, barend shifters. Depending on the elevation profile I swap chainrings before each trip.
Running a 10-51, 12-speed cassette, my chainring choices are 28, 30, 32, & 34. On my off-road trips I usually run the 28 or 30 ring, with the 28 ring yielding about 15 GI. low gear. Sometimes a hassle swapping rings but it works for me.
Good info Roadfix. I am considering a Ritchey Ascent for front and rear pannier loaded touring (mainly road - some gravel road) and require sub-20 inch gear, like say 17, so this info is helpful for the build. I could not find a touring geometry bike sold in USA that accommodates 2 inch tires with fenders, thus the Ritchey Ascent. (I already have a Surly Bridge Club that fits the bill, but I need a bike at a different geographic location and don't want 2 of the same). What is your experience with the Ascent under a heavy load. An shimmy? Thanks.
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Old 01-12-24, 04:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Atlas Shrugged
As with a majority of issues on these forums opinions are based on age demographics more than experience.

No point in arguing each point as the intermixing of facts and age old myths makes it silly. There is a reason that 3x systems have been abandoned by the cycling community is that they are no
longer needed. 11+ speed cassettes and large capacity indexed systems have replaced them.

As for big bike conspiracies denying people choice. I don’t think so.
)

I love my 38 front ring and 11-46 cassette .... and it's Di2!
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Old 01-17-24, 10:07 AM
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Of course you can tour on a 1x. You can tour on a tricycle if you want. I just did a 10,520 perimeter tour of the US on a Bombtrack Hook EXT_C gravel bike running 1x11 with a 10-42 cassette and a 38 tooth chainring and a 650b wheelset with 47mm WTB Byways. Worked just fine for me. I'm 58 by the way. Went through the Adirodacks, Rockies, and Cascades with no problem. Went through the plains and the deserts with no problem. 1x for me was great choice, never had any issues and super simple to maintain. I'm 58 and that was the first tour I ever did, never even did a weekend or a century before that.
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Old 01-17-24, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by chief9245
Of course you can tour on a 1x. You can tour on a tricycle if you want. I just did a 10,520 perimeter tour of the US on a Bombtrack Hook EXT_C gravel bike running 1x11 with a 10-42 cassette and a 38 tooth chainring and a 650b wheelset with 47mm WTB Byways. Worked just fine for me. I'm 58 by the way. Went through the Adirodacks, Rockies, and Cascades with no problem. Went through the plains and the deserts with no problem. 1x for me was great choice, never had any issues and super simple to maintain. I'm 58 and that was the first tour I ever did, never even did a weekend or a century before that.
23.5 gear inches. Curious which pass you took through the Rockies.
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