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Panniers - Calling All Pannier & Touring Experts (or anyone w/ opinions) Suggests?

Old 04-20-23, 12:04 PM
  #101  
indyfabz
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Originally Posted by staehpj1
FWIW, my BV450 (8.7" X 8.6") will probably fit in most panniers and if not it's little brother the BV425 (8.7" X 6") most likely will. Given that we can restock food often when road touring I find that we don't need to carry a lot of food. So if I were to use a canister on tour the 450 or even the 425 would suffice for a road tour.

That said the notion that touring without a canister is illegal anywhere. I have toured through quite a few of the national parks that require a canister for backcountry camping and did not use a canister for touring. It was quite legal since there were bear lockers in all the campgrounds and dispersed camping would have been illegal other than backcountry camping with a permit. When I backpack in these parks I use my canister, when I tour I use the provided lockers.

I did run into minor issues in a couple places where a state or other park said to put food and scented items "in the trunk of your vehicle". There always was some solution like in a state park outside Yosemite where we were able to make friends with a neighbor from a nearby campsite who let us put our stuff in their car trunk.

Where there aren't specific rules against it I hang food in areas with bear risks. I have a lot of experience camping in bear country touring, backpacking, and canoeing and have't had bears get into my stuff yet. Raccoons yes, bears no.
Glacier has lockers. Iíve stayed at a few Forest Service and state park campgrounds that have also had them. Even a state park in NJ bear country that I have spent a few nights at has one. Saw a very young cub there in 2018. Didnít see momma. There is no locker in the tent only area. One option is to store in the shower room located on that end of the park.
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Old 04-20-23, 12:58 PM
  #102  
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When I stayed in the Million Dollar Falls campground in Yukon territory (between Haines and Haines Junction), I was in bear country. I saw one bear (my guess grizzly) the day before I arrived and two days after I saw two black bears. I crossed the US/Canada border and the guards gave me mixed messages when they asked if I had bear spray with me. On the one hand, bear spray is controlled at the border and they knew I wasn't bringing it into the country. On the other hand, they way they asked questions suggested I might be foolish to cycle in that area without bear spray.

The campground had bear-proof trash receptacles, but not bear-proof containers. I ended up parking my bike some distance from my tent and slept soundly. However, the next morning something had torn open my rear pannier and made a concerted set of scratches on the plastic peanut butter container found inside. Also left some claw marks on an apple. I don't know 100% but assume it was a bear.
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Old 04-20-23, 02:18 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by PedalingWalrus
I can't imagine in what situation on a tour you will try to impress someone with 'german panniers' :-)
F'sure. To make that all-important first impression when you roll into camp, I'd suggest monogrammed French Gilles Berthoud



or Japanese Guu Watanabe panniers



preferably slung onto a Tout Terrain Blueridge Xplore GT with colour-matched racks.
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Old 04-20-23, 08:45 PM
  #104  
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Originally Posted by mev
When I stayed in the Million Dollar Falls campground in Yukon territory (between Haines and Haines Junction), I was in bear country. I saw one bear (my guess grizzly) the day before I arrived and two days after I saw two black bears. I crossed the US/Canada border and the guards gave me mixed messages when they asked if I had bear spray with me. On the one hand, bear spray is controlled at the border and they knew I wasn't bringing it into the country. On the other hand, they way they asked questions suggested I might be foolish to cycle in that area without bear spray.
From memory about a decade ago, Canadian bear spray had a legal spiciness limit that some US bear sprays breached, making them a weapon Up North. So it would be one of those things that would get checked entering Canada but less of an issue going the other way. And yes, I didnít camp etc up that way without bear spray.

On pannier related issues, I canít believe youíve 5 pages into this thread and no one has mentioned Carradice waxed canvas panniers. Easy to repair and reproof, and you can leave them in your will to your grandchildren as long as they donít get eaten by rodents in your shed.
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Old 04-20-23, 09:55 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by dvdwmth
A couple days after I posted to this thread I found some serratus panniers used twice for $40. Serratus was mountain equipment coops house brand and in my experience they were built crazy tough. I guess mostly only findable in Canada but point is used market has deals. The pic here is the model but not the ones I bought.

Serratus panniers
Similarly,I just got these lightly used bags on Ebay $50 w/shipping. Iím not familiar with the brand but they seem pretty solid. 10-12L iím guessing. Time to do some mock-ups before the real thing. Also waiting on a handlebar bag to (hopefully)complete my touring setup.

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Old 04-20-23, 10:39 PM
  #106  
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Originally Posted by Reddleman
On pannier related issues, I canít believe youíve 5 pages into this thread and no one has mentioned Carradice waxed canvas panniers. Easy to repair and reproof, and you can leave them in your will to your grandchildren as long as they donít get eaten by rodents in your shed.
Never get in a hurry reading BF. First time I skimmed this, my brain read it as "as long as they donít get eaten by grandchildren in your shed".
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Old 04-21-23, 05:52 AM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by Reddleman
...
On pannier related issues, I canít believe youíve 5 pages into this thread and no one has mentioned Carradice waxed canvas panniers. Easy to repair and reproof, and you can leave them in your will to your grandchildren as long as they donít get eaten by rodents in your shed.
Or the Carradry panniers from the same firm. I have both Ortlieb and Carradry, decide on a trip by trip basis which to bring.




Am unaware of any rodent issues, but if you left food in them, that could occur.

Happy Feet who used to post on this forum was very happy with his Carradry panniers and saddle bag too.
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Old 04-21-23, 06:20 AM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by Reddleman
From memory about a decade ago, Canadian bear spray had a legal spiciness limit that some US bear sprays breached, making them a weapon Up North. So it would be one of those things that would get checked entering Canada but less of an issue going the other way. And yes, I didnít camp etc up that way without bear spray.
Thank you for mentioning this. I checked a bit online and this is that it says in part from the Parks Canada website

" * Does it say bear spray or bear repellent? To be legal in Canada, the label must clearly show that it is intended for use on animals; the package volume cannot exceed 500 ml.
* Size and strength: a 225 ml can (about 10 seconds worth) with 0.75%-1% capsaicin is recommended."

Maybe Parks Canada did not know it, but they seem to display (both in a picture and a video) of a 2% capsaicin can from Frontiersman which seems to exceed Canada's 1% limit. I did notice that all the sprays made in Canada that I briefly looked for online had a 1% capsaicin and 0.75% "capsaicin related" ingredients. Most sprays made in the USA are 2%.

Do you remember the capsaicin percentage of the can you carried and were you able to cross the border (which direction with it) or did they confiscate the can? I can envision all the bears hanging out on the Canadian side and one says "Hey Smokey! Look! Here come's another cyclist and he got his bear spray taken by the shack people!. Let's eat."
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Old 04-21-23, 07:37 AM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by John N
I can envision all the bears hanging out on the Canadian side and one says "Hey Smokey! Look! Here come's another cyclist and he got his bear spray taken by the shack people!. Let's eat."
When the GF and I crossed at Roosville in 2009, the grumpy shack lady asked us if we had any bear spray. We did not because we werenít going to be camping anywhere remote during our planned 4 nights in the country. She also asked us what we did for livings and then fired off ďWhatís your next day back at work?Ē Good thing the GF was good with things like dates.
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Old 04-21-23, 08:15 AM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by Reddleman
...I canít believe youíve 5 pages into this thread and no one has mentioned Carradice waxed canvas panniers.
Speaking of, Carradice has reintroduced their kinda quirky, kinda cool Top Tube Panniers, "used extensively by the founders of bikepacking, the Rough Stuff Fellowship". Perhaps organizationally useful at 3.5L/pair.

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Old 04-21-23, 08:47 AM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by gmcjetpilot
There is German stuff a local bike store suggested but pricey...
Theory of Relativity: Pencil out the total cost of Robert Beckman Designs F/R racks and panniers for your bike. Relative to that, Ortliebs are blue-light-specials.
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Old 04-21-23, 02:22 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by John N
Thank you for mentioning this. I checked a bit online and this is that it says in part from the Parks Canada website

" * Does it say bear spray or bear repellent? To be legal in Canada, the label must clearly show that it is intended for use on animals; the package volume cannot exceed 500 ml.
* Size and strength: a 225 ml can (about 10 seconds worth) with 0.75%-1% capsaicin is recommended."

Maybe Parks Canada did not know it, but they seem to display (both in a picture and a video) of a 2% capsaicin can from Frontiersman which seems to exceed Canada's 1% limit. I did notice that all the sprays made in Canada that I briefly looked for online had a 1% capsaicin and 0.75% "capsaicin related" ingredients. Most sprays made in the USA are 2%.

Do you remember the capsaicin percentage of the can you carried and were you able to cross the border (which direction with it) or did they confiscate the can?
From memory, I think anything over 2% was probably considered pepper spray and an offensive weapon. Never had any issues with our Canadian bought stuff crossing the YK/AK border and back. From the looks of things online, as long as itís certified as a bear spray in the USA then itís bear spray in Canada. Best not to overthink it.
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Old 04-21-23, 02:24 PM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by Reddleman
From memory, I think anything over 2% was probably considered pepper spray and an offensive weapon. Never had any issues with our Canadian bought stuff crossing the YK/AK border and back. From the looks of things online, as long as itís certified as a bear spray in the USA then itís bear spray in Canada. Best not to overthink it.
Thanks. The only border crossing I have had troubles with is the Canadian border so wanted to ensure I was OK Thanks again, John
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Old 04-21-23, 04:04 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by gmcjetpilot
Price is right $40 each, roll up top, waterproof with additional flap.
Should anyone's lower cost/previously owned/older/gift panniers prove to be less than 100% waterproof, there are pannier rain covers. Multiple suppliers, styles, sizes, coverage, attachment, materials, colors, price points.

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Old 04-21-23, 04:30 PM
  #115  
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Originally Posted by tcs
Should anyone's lower cost/previously owned/older/gift panniers prove to be less than 100% waterproof, there are pannier rain covers. Multiple suppliers, styles, sizes, coverage, attachment, materials, colors, price points.

That's a great tip. Cheers
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Old 04-21-23, 07:05 PM
  #116  
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Couldn’t be happier with these new bags.They came with waterproof covers like shown above also.

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Old 04-22-23, 06:30 AM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by tcs
Should anyone's lower cost/previously owned/older/gift panniers prove to be less than 100% waterproof, there are pannier rain covers. Multiple suppliers, styles, sizes, coverage, attachment, materials, colors, price points.

Yep. My first set of panniers were made by Robert Beckman Designs. The rain covers were made to fit the bags. The one minor inconvenience was having to remove them and put them back on if you wanted to retrieve anything. Also stopping to put them on if rain popped up unexpectedly.

On the road to Red Willow Lake in ND on July 4th, 1999. I had put on the front covers preemptively because I had thousands of dollars worth of camera equipment up front. It ended up not raining that day.


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Old 04-22-23, 10:09 AM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz
Yep. My first set of panniers were made by Robert Beckman Designs. The rain covers were made to fit the bags. The one minor inconvenience was having to remove them and put them back on if you wanted to retrieve anything. Also stopping to put them on if rain popped up unexpectedly.

On the road to Red Willow Lake in ND on July 4th, 1999. I had put on the front covers preemptively because I had thousands of dollars worth of camera equipment up front. It ended up not raining that day.
...
A friend of mine has the big Arkel panniers in red. They look new because he puts his rain covers on them every day, the red is not faded at all. His panniers have been across the country a couple times, plus several shorter tours.

But, no rain cover for the handlebar bag that is very badly faded and not very red any more.

This photo is ten years old, his handlebar bag looks much worse now.

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Old 04-22-23, 10:24 AM
  #119  
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Is it just me? What benefit is there to having panniers that need a rain cover when you can buy waterproof panniers?.
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Old 04-22-23, 01:27 PM
  #120  
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Originally Posted by garryg
Is it just me? What benefit is there to having panniers that need a rain cover when you can buy waterproof panniers?.
Some people buy lower priced panniers that are not waterproof. Or that may have been waterproof at one time but no longer are.

And some people do not want waterproof panniers if they might be carrying damp clothing in a pannier in the hot sun all day on a hot day.

There are some really nice panniers that are not fully waterproof, such as some that have a multitude of pockets.
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Old 04-22-23, 01:43 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by garryg
Is it just me? What benefit is there to having panniers that need a rain cover when you can buy waterproof panniers?.
Maybe today, but my Beckman custom racks and bags (1999 vintage) were worth having to put rain covers on to make them waterproof. Without them, they were only water resistant.
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Old 04-22-23, 01:51 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
But, no rain cover for the handlebar bag that is very badly faded and not very red any more.
Yeah. The sun does a number on bags. My Beckman bags are faded. When you look under the compression straps you can see the original color. They have about 10,500 miles on them.

The tops of my Ortlieb Back Packers are faded. Fortunately, that doesnít affect their performance.
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Old 04-22-23, 08:07 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
Some people buy lower priced panniers that are not waterproof. Or that may have been waterproof at one time but no longer are.

And some people do not want waterproof panniers if they might be carrying damp clothing in a pannier in the hot sun all day on a hot day.

There are some really nice panniers that are not fully waterproof, such as some that have a multitude of pockets.

I guess its a geographic thing. I live in the Pacific Northwest,everything must be rainproof.
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Old 04-23-23, 05:17 AM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by garryg
I guess its a geographic thing. I live in the Pacific Northwest,everything must be rainproof.
Yeah. The last half of my Pacific Coast trip, rain was so unlikely that I took the risk of putting my raingear in the bottom of a pannier. And did not get wet from that, it did not rain then.

My Canadian Maritimes trip, I owned a pair of Carradry rear panniers and decided to try them instead of using the Ortliebs that I had been using. For the front, I matched the gray Carradry panniers with some gray Axiom ones up front that I got at a garage sale, the Axiom ones were coated nylon.



The Axioms leaked but my expectations for coated nylon was not high so the gear I had in the Axioms was gear that I could allow to get wet, like tent, cooking gear, etc.

There was a gal that contributed a lot to this forum on her multi-year trip with her husband and kids as they toured N and S America. I did a quick search and found a couple of her posts that explain it quite well:
Panniers: Brooks, Ortleib?
Are Ortlieb Panniers worth it?
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Old 04-23-23, 08:39 AM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
I matched the gray...
We haven't talked about aesthetics!

The preponderance of pics in the Loaded Touring Bike Gallery feature color-matched bags. I don't know if this is a stylistic choice or if it's an unintended consequence of folks buying their front and rear panniers, handlebar bag and rack-top bag at the same time at the same place.

I didn't see any images with mismatched left and right panniers. ( ! ) That's probably more of a Noah's Ark thing, though.
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