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Panniers - Calling All Pannier & Touring Experts (or anyone w/ opinions) Suggests?

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Panniers - Calling All Pannier & Touring Experts (or anyone w/ opinions) Suggests?

Old 04-23-23, 08:42 AM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by garryg
What benefit is there to having panniers that need a rain cover when you can buy waterproof panniers?
At the other end of the spectrum, there are pannier models with mesh pockets. This can be advantageous if you have a damp towel or something that 'could do with a bit of air'.

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Old 04-23-23, 11:13 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by tcs
We haven't talked about aesthetics!

The preponderance of pics in the Loaded Touring Bike Gallery feature color-matched bags. I don't know if this is a stylistic choice or if it's an unintended consequence of folks buying their front and rear panniers, handlebar bag and rack-top bag at the same time at the same place.

I didn't see any images with mismatched left and right panniers. ( ! ) That's probably more of a Noah's Ark thing, though.
You have to look good out there. Mismatched panniers would suggest you are a homeless person that stole what you could find. But, color coordination shows good taste and sophistication.

I could have mismatched my Axiom front panniers, I have one rain cover, but not a pair. Thus, could have both grey and yellow. But I would hate to bring shame on the entire bike touring community by displaying mismatched front pannier colors. If I had done so, I might have been banished from BikeForums for life.

And you might be correct, mismatched front panniers could have resulted in new little panniers of weird colors and defects, such as lacking waterproofness or inability to stay on the racks when you hit bumps.
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Old 04-23-23, 07:03 PM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by tcs
At the other end of the spectrum, there are pannier models with mesh pockets. This can be advantageous if you have a damp towel or something that 'could do with a bit of air'.
Yep. My front Beckman bags have them. Also handy for things like a pump and tube.
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Old 04-27-23, 12:33 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by tcs
.I didn't see any images with mismatched left and right panniers. ( ! ) That's probably more of a Noah's Ark thing, though.
On today's ride down to the bike co-op, I needed to haul a bunch of stuff. None of the bags matched one another, but they got the job done.

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Old 05-01-23, 02:27 PM
  #130  
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  • Does anyone make pannier bags out of dyneema, xpac, UltraPE 400 or something similar modern material?
  • Does anyone make like around 25L /5,5 gal (one bag) drybag style panniers?

I have a small front rack and a regular rear rack. I thought I could strap a regular whatever ~20-30L dry bag on top of the front rack, then I'd need like 40-50L total in rear. Front situation is easily solved, but rear bags are a problem.

My backpacking weighs around 6 kilograms / 13 lbs, but it takes some room. While backpacking my backpack has a 80L dry bag style bag where I just stuff in everything in the same bag and it's done. That is quite too big for bicycling, so I guess I need to divide the stuff in smaller bags.

There are a million ultra heavy badly designed bags with a million zippers, pouches, weird straps etc. Does anyone make "modern" panniers? It feels like someone invented a hard to use bag 100 years ago and then everyone just keeps copying them, instead of innovating.

Maybe someone makes uhh pannier "nets" where I can put in my own regular dry bags? Dry bag design and closure is so superior to anything else that I don't really want to change away from it. Dry bags always keep my gear dry in all conditions and I can close one in a few seconds without any fiddling at all, and they always stay closed. Access is fast, just unbuckle one buckle and you have everything inside at hand right away.

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Old 05-01-23, 06:41 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies
...
  • Does anyone make like around 25L /5,5 gal (one bag) drybag style panniers?
..., then I'd need like 40-50L total in rear.
Ortlieb Backrollers are rated at 20 liter each, roll top bags like standard drybags. Two versions, the city version is lighter, I prefer the classic version that uses a shoulder strap that hooks onto the side of the bag.

If you have two Backrollers (they usually are sold as pairs), it is easy to put another dry bag on top if you have excess volume that does not fit.

In the photo I have a large drybag duffle on top of the panniers. The panniers are the Backrollers that I cited.

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Old 05-02-23, 05:43 AM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies
  • Does anyone make pannier bags out of dyneema, xpac, UltraPE 400 or something similar modern material?
  • Does anyone make like around 25L /5,5 gal (one bag) drybag style panniers?
.
Mountain Laurel Design makes UL bikepacking/touring bags.
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Old 05-02-23, 05:48 AM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
Mismatched panniers would suggest you are a homeless person that stole what you could find. But, color coordination shows good taste and sophistication.
.
GASP! I have poor taste, then. I have purposely purchased mismatched fork packs (black/salsa). So it can easily tell where are my clothes vs stove.

​​​​
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Old 05-02-23, 07:52 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
Ortlieb Backrollers are rated at 20 liter each, roll top bags like standard drybags. Two versions, the city version is lighter, I prefer the classic version that uses a shoulder strap that hooks onto the side of the bag.

If you have two Backrollers (they usually are sold as pairs), it is easy to put another dry bag on top if you have excess volume that does not fit.
Yes, but they're made from old-fashioned, heavy materials, and they have heavy extra features I think I don't need. They are like 1kg each for 20L. Not very weight/space efficient. I'm not bicycling to war with my bags and I don't need to drag them over stones. I don't undestand why the bags are so heavy, of course my lack of practical touring experience might explain my lack of understanding.

Originally Posted by gauvins
Mountain Laurel Design makes UL bikepacking/touring bags.
Thanks. They're just quite small. I finally found out about Altura Ultralites. They don't have features, just stuff in your gear and roll it close:

https://www.altura.co.uk/luggage-c4/...g-pannier-p189

260g each, for 15 liters. I think I'll buy 4, two in front, two in rear, and see how they work. They should give 60L total. I have no practical experience with lightweight touring but I guess I'll figure out if these work or not. I've been trying to do UL/lightweight backpacking since 2016 and my gear has worked just fine, despite it being light and easy to carry. Maybe those bags will work too, maybe not.. couldn't find any reviews or experiences about them.

The market for lightweight touring bags doesn't seem to exist really.

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Old 05-02-23, 07:59 AM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies
Yes, but they're made from old-fashioned, heavy materials, and they have heavy extra features I think I don't need. They are like 1kg each for 20L. Not very weight/space efficient. I'm not bicycling to war with my bags and I don't need to drag them over stones. I don't undestand why the bags are so heavy, of course my lack of practical touring experience might explain my lack of understanding.
....
In the future, please be more specific with your questions so we do not waste time giving you information that you do not want.
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Old 05-02-23, 08:09 AM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies

The market for lightweight touring bags doesn't seem to exist really.
In part because tourers prefer large volume and if you carry a typical Ortlieb kit, it means 65Ls. So what's a couple of Kgs on top of that

Before you get a 4x15, perhaps consider 4x5 + a backpack on top of your rear rack. I'm just about to put that to the test, with MLD Core 25L as backpack. The (huge) benefit is that it makes overnight hikes much easier. And shopping as well. And it expands/contracts as your food supply requires.

On the downside you may regret the convenience of panniers (easy to clip on the rack, durable, easy to rummage in order to find that tool you remember having, etc )

4x5+25L provides incentives to limit the amount of gear you'll carry (bags always fill up) and the backpack is, already proven in my case, a great addition.

[Edit]
Or perhaps get 2x15 on a front low rider + 2x5 dry bags strapped vertically on your rear rack + *small* frameless backpack on top of the rear rack.
[/EDIT]
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Old 05-02-23, 11:39 AM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies

The market for lightweight touring bags doesn't seem to exist really.
Recognizing that you seem to have found something to try already, you might still be interested in checking this out: Robert Beckman Designs - Ultralight Panniers.

The last time I had checked, Robert Beckman's site was down but, happily, is back up. His stuff is very pricey and very good. I don't think one can find a more comprehensive website on panniers and it makes for an interesting read even if one can't afford his panniers or agree with his thoughts. I find it interesting reading his thoughts on ultra-light (I seem to recall his writing about cutting the pockets out of his clothing to save weight) while the panniers of his I have, and love, are hardly light weight.
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Old 05-02-23, 03:45 PM
  #138  
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Originally Posted by L134
Recognizing that you seem to have found something to try already, you might still be interested in checking this out: Robert Beckman Designs - Ultralight Panniers.

The last time I had checked, Robert Beckman's site was down but, happily, is back up. His stuff is very pricey and very good. I don't think one can find a more comprehensive website on panniers and it makes for an interesting read even if one can't afford his panniers or agree with his thoughts. I find it interesting reading his thoughts on ultra-light (I seem to recall his writing about cutting the pockets out of his clothing to save weight) while the panniers of his I have, and love, are hardly light weight.
I have a set from back in the day. Great stuff. Nearly $1,000 for racks and four bags. Thatís in 1999 dollars.

I tried dealing with him a couple of times some 9 years after I had bought my original bags and racks. The first time worked, but he gouged me for a replacement pivot mount to retrofit the rear rack to a new bike and took forever to send it. After my bike and racks were stolen a couple of years later, I lost patience with him. He basically wanted me to write him a blank check for new racks that would accommodate my old bags. I went with Nitto and Ortliebs instead.

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Old 05-03-23, 10:28 AM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
Ortlieb Backrollers are rated at 20 liter each, roll top bags like standard drybags. Two versions, the city version is lighter, I prefer the classic version that uses a shoulder strap that hooks onto the side of the bag.

If you have two Backrollers (they usually are sold as pairs), it is easy to put another dry bag on top if you have excess volume that does not fit.

In the photo I have a large drybag duffle on top of the panniers. The panniers are the Backrollers that I cited.


40L + another top SACK of approx 20L = 60L = LOTS OF WEIGHT )
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Old 05-03-23, 11:19 AM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by garryg
Is it just me? What benefit is there to having panniers that need a rain cover when you can buy waterproof panniers?.
I had a set of 4 Axiom panniers that came with the appropriate yellow rain covers. They could be a PIA to put on and take off at times and weren't as waterproof as my Ortliebs, in that the back side near the wheel was not completely covered. It made gaining entry into the bags more time consuming as well, all in all, I didn't care for them and passed them on.
BTW, Sun faded color worn panniers is a sign of honor and implies style points.
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Old 05-03-23, 04:04 PM
  #141  
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Originally Posted by robow
btw, sun faded color worn panniers is a sign of honor and implies style points.
+1.
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Old 05-03-23, 04:23 PM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by robow
BTW, Sun faded color worn panniers is a sign of honor and implies style points.
Welll... around here, the Land Where Polymers Go to Die, there's "sun faded" and there's "darn, I guess I should have noticed that disintegration before I lost all that stuff."

Edit: my primary pannier just might have seen a teeny bit of UV-induced color shift over the years, comparing the rolled-up flap to the rest of it...


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Old 05-03-23, 06:31 PM
  #143  
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Front load All day. And you can keep on eye on everything 🙃
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Old 05-04-23, 04:08 AM
  #144  
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Originally Posted by gauvins
GASP! I have poor taste, then. I have purposely purchased mismatched fork packs (black/salsa). So it can easily tell where are my clothes vs stove.
My travelling companions on the Trans America used mismatched front panniers. They each used one roll top pannier with one big compartment and one with a lot of compartments and pockets.
Edit: To be clear, that was with two matched rear panniers.

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Old 05-04-23, 10:11 AM
  #145  
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Originally Posted by gauvins
GASP! I have poor taste, then. I have purposely purchased mismatched fork packs (black/salsa). So it can easily tell where are my clothes vs stove.

​​​​
You seriously canít remember that without a crib sheet?

My kitchen stuff is always in the right front bag because its contents are the least likely Iíll need to access between camps, For the same reason, my sleeping bag and off-bike clothes are in the right rear?
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Old 05-04-23, 10:20 AM
  #146  
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Mountain Laurel Designs makes bags like that. I just tested them for the first time on a 6 day trip and they worked well. The only disadvantage is they are attached by straps and therefore not fun to take off and on. If You anticipate your tour needing to remove and attach often I would not recommend them. Otherwise they did great for me. https://mountainlaureldesigns.com/bikepacking/



Originally Posted by Ihmemies
  • Does anyone make pannier bags out of dyneema, xpac, UltraPE 400 or something similar modern material?
  • Does anyone make like around 25L /5,5 gal (one bag) drybag style panniers?





I have a small front rack and a regular rear rack. I thought I could strap a regular whatever ~20-30L dry bag on top of the front rack, then I'd need like 40-50L total in rear. Front situation is easily solved, but rear bags are a problem.

My backpacking weighs around 6 kilograms / 13 lbs, but it takes some room. While backpacking my backpack has a 80L dry bag style bag where I just stuff in everything in the same bag and it's done. That is quite too big for bicycling, so I guess I need to divide the stuff in smaller bags.

There are a million ultra heavy badly designed bags with a million zippers, pouches, weird straps etc. Does anyone make "modern" panniers? It feels like someone invented a hard to use bag 100 years ago and then everyone just keeps copying them, instead of innovating.

Maybe someone makes uhh pannier "nets" where I can put in my own regular dry bags? Dry bag design and closure is so superior to anything else that I don't really want to change away from it. Dry bags always keep my gear dry in all conditions and I can close one in a few seconds without any fiddling at all, and they always stay closed. Access is fast, just unbuckle one buckle and you have everything inside at hand right away.
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Old 05-04-23, 12:34 PM
  #147  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz
You seriously canít remember that without a crib sheet?
No, I am mentally impaired. Plus, I find it convenient to remove the bags from the bike once at destination. Side by side on the ground... I either put a zip tie or something on a bag so I can tell which is which, or I use bags from different color.
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Old 05-04-23, 02:00 PM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by Ihmemies
It feels like someone invented a hard-to-use bag 100 years ago...


Panniers show up in my cycle history photographic files in the 1930s, so not quite 100 years ago. A well-fitted French cycletourist in the early 1950s: Bonjour!



Panniers took a while to catch on in America. My photographic evidence indicates American cycletourists were mostly still piling all their gear on top of their rear racks up through the 1950s.



The modern rackless bikepacking style predates panniers by a good quarter century. On the road in 1900:


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Old 05-05-23, 06:06 AM
  #149  
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Originally Posted by gauvins
No, I am mentally impaired. Plus, I find it convenient to remove the bags from the bike once at destination. Side by side on the ground... I either put a zip tie or something on a bag so I can tell which is which, or I use bags from different color.
Panniers, I put a little piece of green tape on the side of the pannier facing the bike rack for right side, red tape for left side. But, I have been around boats long enough that the running light colors for port and starboard are second nature, so that is the easiest way for me to mark them in a way I recognize.

But for your dry bags in a cage where there is no dedicated side that always faces the rack, perhaps we can accept your mismatched colors.

Two of my touring bikes have kickstands, on those bikes the first pannier I take off the bike without the bike falling over is the front right side. So, that one has my tent which goes up first.
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Old 05-05-23, 08:36 AM
  #150  
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Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN
But for your dry bags in a cage where there is no dedicated side that always faces the rack, perhaps we can accept your mismatched colors.
But there are straps! Red voile for the tent, gray salsa for the sleeping bag. (And while they don't mind being lashed port or starboard, I'll try to spare the sensitivity of riding sailors
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