genericbikedude

I'm in the market for a touring bike, and I had my eye on the BJ off-the-peg touring frame. Its a bit pricey though at around $700US approx. Is there anything similar (lugged, steel, similar geo) that you all can recommend?

NeezyDeezy

not to derail the conversation, but why are lugs important to people? aesthetics only? because the Surly LHT, even though tig-welded, is just as good and would completely solve your price dilemma... just my 2 cents.

genericbikedude

aesthetics only. I've got a lot of ugly, practical bikes and I want a pretty one.

zoltani

Lugs allow you to change a tube if you crack one, with a tig-welded frame you cannot do this. A nice lugged frame could last a lifetime if you replace tubes as needed. IMO that is practical and beautiful!

NeezyDeezy

between the cost difference for a lugged bike and the repairs for replacing the tube you could have had several tig-welded bikes... just another perspective.

genericbikedude

I've got a light and stiff al track bike with cottage cheese welds, a tigged track bike that gets beat to hell, and an ugly modern road bike. Is it so freaking wrong to want something a little nice??

Speedo

Nope. Lugged frames are really nice looking. The person you need to keep happy is you.

Speedo

Speedo

Oh, and regarding your original question: Since I'm also a person who goes for the lugged frame and fork look, I've been keeping an eye out for nice cheapish lugged frame/forks. The Bob Jackson off-the-peg frames are about the cheapest I've seen. With that frame you could probably build up a bike in the $2k range. That's not cheap, but if it's what you want, it's not too expensive. When you get into the I'm going to buy exactly what I want mode you can easily spend $3k.

Speedo

ronzorini

Not familiar with new lugged bikes, but there's still a lot of beautiful lugged 70s-80s touring frames out there...for a very reasonable price

nun

Ronzorini, as a maker of cotton duck and leather bicycle bags I'm amazed that you are not familiar with current retro lugged bikes. Surely you know about Rivendell, Waterford, Kogswell etc as the folks who buy these will probably be your best customers.

PS to the OP look at Mercian too.

jharte

I can tell by conversation some of you are 'old school', or just plain old! Lugged steel frames are a thing of beauty. I've had several. Old lugged steel has an awesome ride, to boot.

Don't get me wrong. I tour on a converted MTB (tigged) and have since '89. Never an issue. I wouldn't trade it.

If I was going on the cheap, I would look at old lugged steel. There are several to choose from. If I had the money, it would definitely be in the Rivendell field. Tough choice!

Since I always seem to be broke, I'll keep my trusty MTB and just keep adding miles.........

BTW, I am 'old school' AND old!

Camel

Lugged bikes are nice. I bought my Waterford from a seller on the touring@phred email list, and have been very happy with it (except for the wheel size...but that's anither issue).

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spokewrench55

Hello,

Before going too much further, I recommend you do some research into bicycle tubing. I love lugs, but there are some rather high priced lugged frames out there with really nice paint and cool retro websites, that are made from tubing that shouldn't command the price that is being asked. IMO.

Bob Jacksons are usually made from some of the best steel tubing for the job they are designed for.

Nicely priced Surly LHT frames are so functional and utilitarian they achieve a beauty in their plainess. But it is more then appearance in the difference between a lugged frame and a tigged frame, in my opinion. The tubes are usually different in their metullurgy, and in their joint thickness, and it makes them feel different too. They also feel different when loaded. What may be wrong unloaded changes when loaded.

I love the beauty of a fancy lugged frame. May I someday own a Hetchins. I have a very nice custom frame made with 531st tubing and Henry James stainless lugs that is all silver brazed. But the rigid aluminum of the Cannondale T2000 frame ended up being my tourer of choice. When heavily loaded speeding down a hill it doesn't seem to get so bouncy or occilating as the springier steel. On the other hand, the pounding aluminum can give with that rigidity makes others unhappy with it.

I think if you do some research into the whole tubing scene, (not to mention lugs, dropouts, brazeons and paint) I think you will find a Bob Jackson is actually a pretty good deal.

ronzorini

My personal taste happens to gravitate towards older tourers. But I love the newer bikes, too! Rivendell bikes...never rode one, but a few of their owners like our bags

zzzwillzzz

the problem is you want pretty and cheap. one or the other is easy, it the combination that's difficult

NoReg

How is 700 bucks pricey for a lugged frame. That sounds dead cheap. By the time you touch down at 500 bucks you are in Kogswell territory, which is a nice place to be not cutting them, but it's still asian tig welded. You add back in the price of lugs and anything at all for the higher cost of building with lugs and you are in the bargain basement at 700 bucks.

genericbikedude

Are any of you familiar with the recent panasonic touring bikes, or can comment on how they feel loaded/unloaded? Anybody know what tubeset is used?

Also the BJ is 360 + 90 shipping (GBP). That comes out the just over 900 US. Youch.

ronzorini

I'd be interested as well. Seems like a decent price if you're in the market for a travel bike, considering the price for S & S couplers. Includes the headset, fenders and a rando style front rack too. FWIW, their older bikes were highly regarded during the bike boom era.

BigBlueToe

Absolutely not! You're the one who'll be riding it, not us. If you have the money, get what you want, and listen to your heart. I love the look of lugs, especially really nice, artsy-fartsy ones. I don't have the money to pay for them when tig-welding will do, but if I did, who knows?

I bought my wife an older, lugged Schwinn road bike as a project. It was red, white, and blue, and she thought it was hideous-looking. Her favorite colors are black and red. She also loves the satin (not gloss) finish on her mountain bike. So I painted the frame satin black, and hand-painted shiny red outlines around all the lugs. She loves it! (and I think it looks pretty good myself!)

Don't discount aesthetics, especially when you can afford it!

jens5

What size are you looking for?

Richard

RalphP

Have had my Atlantis since July, '07. I'm insane in love with it. Heavier than a lot of good bikes but it feels sturdy and is excellent for fast downhill curves.

https://flickr.com/photos/20197891@N0...ool-rivendell/

paxtonm

I just located this thread. To the original poster, where are you finding a BJ touring frame for $700? I've got my sights set on one, since I need a 64 cm frame and Jackson is one of the few that can provide one. I love the look, the experience of the staff, the tubing, the options and the renewed reputation for quality.

Thanks,

Mark:

Now riding, all up for grabs:

XL Kona Dew Deluxe. Nearly perfect, still with original tires.
63 cm Litespeed Classic, mostly Ultegra.
63 cm Tom Ritchey -- classic built by Tom in the early 80s. Mostly Campy NR, Phil hubs. Lugless. Dark Blue Imron.

None of these bikes have ever been crashed. They're in great shape, and I love them well. I'm a very competent mechanic, and all are ready to go, except for the Ritchey. I would not ride on the tires now mounted.

If anyone's interested in details, please e-mail me directly.
paxtonm@sbcglobal.net

genericbikedude

55-56. got something?

late

Here is a beautiful frame that makes a fabulous tourer. One thing, if you get it, have it clearcoated before you build it up. I got one for my wife last year and she loves it to death. It uses 650b wheels, and rides like a cloud.
https://parts.spicercycles.com/page.c...nsearch=Search

johnopower

Where does this idea come from? I love lugs too, but ease of repair is not a reason to buy a lugged frame. Here's a quote from ANTs website (https://www.antbikemike.com/Q&A.html)

Q. I have heard that it is good to get a lugged frame, so that in the event that I crash, it can be repaired AND that a T.I.G. welded frame is impossible to repair.

A. I do not know why anyone would say that a T.I.G. welded frame can not be repaired. A T.I.G. Welded frame is much easier to repair than a lugged frame and definitely easier than a fillet brazed frame. I guess some think that a T.I.G. frame will be overheated when the tube is replaced. That may be true if you were using a very thin head tube or seat tube. Also, the affected tube is being replaced and the remaining one [head tube, bottom bracket shell, seat tube and dropouts] is a very thick tube or plate.

I can say that a whole lot less heat will be used in replacing one of my tubes over any brazed joint! When I need to replace a tube [usually a dented in top tube from crashing over on a rock] all I have to do is cut the tube out and file the weld down [no heat involved] and then cut a new tube and weld it in. All of my frames can have any of the tubes replaced in a short amount of time. I keep all of my customer frame programs on file and can cut any of the tubes in a one cut system [no guessing]. I believe that anyone who thinks a T.I.G. welded frame can not be repaired does not know what they are talking about. To replace a brazed tube you have to totally cook it to death to get the tubes to release and a lugged frame does not have a thick head tube or seat tube etc�so it seems to me that a brazed lugged frame is very hard to replace a tube on AND can be severely damaged by the heat. I would say that only have your lugged bike repaired by a very experienced lugged builder.