TheDazed

Raleigh Sojourn https://www.raleighusa.com/bikes/steel-road/sojourn-11/

vs.

Fuji Touring https://2010.fujibikes.com/LifeStyle/...s/Touring.aspx

Discuss.

I was initially drawn to the long haul trucker, but there's 2 deal breakers there for me. First, the cost is massively overblown in Canada. I can't get a trucker for less than $1700 (inc. tax) anywhere in my province. Second, the size I need only comes with 26" wheels which is just... no. Maybe if I were biking through Guatemala, but I intend to stay well within North America.

I have a hookup for the raleigh sojourn here for $900 total (inc tax) for brand new, in the box. It is my understanding that the trucker and the sojourn both have an MSRP of $1100 in the US. So I don't feel like I'm being cheap about it, per se. Both bikes are worth about the same in a world without artificial, regional inflation I think. I found a local place retailing the fuji touring 2010 for $1100 +tax.

So I've done my research, but I'm still torn between the fuji touring and the sojourn. I would like to hear experienced tourists chime in on which bike they would prefer.

As I understand it the issues are thus:
Both bikes are kinda high geared for a touring bike.. but the raleigh, being $350 cheaper, leaves more budget room for swapping parts.

The raleigh weighs about 35 lbs whereas the fuji is around 27 lbs, from what I've read. Point for Fuji.

The raleigh has 32 spoke wheels as opposed to the 36 a touring bike should have.. but supposedly has bullet proof hubs and higher gauge spokes. Not sure how I feel about this. The fuji comes with 36, so point for fuji here.

Fuji has cantilever brakes whereas the sojourn has disc breaks.. I've never used disc breaks and I know many people hate them for touring cause of their weight and unfamiliar mechanics. I know theyre great for biking in wet weather though, which I'll certainly be doing through the rockies, so for me they might be good. I'll call this a tie.

sojourn's got bar end shifters while the fuji has those integrated brake ones.. Point for sojourn.

The raleigh has a problem with toe overlap, but has longer chainstays than the fuji. (460mm vs 440mm)

sojourn comes with some nice accessories, for a much lower price, point for sojourn.

I've heard the fuji touring is more of a "sport touring" frame and not really intended for fully loaded touring. Not sure how the sojourn compares in that respect.

I haven't actually ridden either bike yet to see how they feel. I'm supposed to go test ride the sojourn tomorrow, and may just grab it on the spot if it feels right. The place that sells the fuji is closed for renovation for a while, maybe a week or more and I'm itching to get my bike. So I'm trying to see if anyone thinks that maybe I should hold out for the fuji and test ride it, or if I should snap up this sojourn for 9 bills while i can.

Which bike would you grab?

Bearonabike

I'd consider a Jamis Aurora. Got one a few weeks ago. Pneumonia has meant no riding for a week but I really love the bike.

TheDazed

Have not seen one in these parts, but I read this review the other day that stopped me from looking very hard:
https://recklesscognition.wordpress.c...ycle-option-5/

Check the comment out too.

fietsbob

Higher gearing likely for Commuters . nose to the grind stone..

What's the nearest Dealer carry? I'd shop Dealers First,
service after the sale you know..

at point of sale you can have them make the changes , get trade-in
on the take offs , or buy the parts , some discount often, .. 10%,
then Ebay the other stuff..

CB HI

The 2010 and 2011 Raleigh Sojourn's have 36 spoke wheels. Prior to 2010 the wheels were 32 spoke.

CB HI

Fit would be my first consideration. Then deciding if you prefer STI or brifters and your feelings about disk brakes.

I did pick a Raleigh Sojourn for my touring bike and I also got a 2010 new last year for $900; it is a great deal.

CB HI

PS - If the Sojourn you are looking at really does have 32 spoke wheels, it is probably a 2009 model. I would offer to pay $700 for that year model.

Cyclebum

Go with the less expensive bike and use the savings to customize it to your preferences. You'll want to do that anyway with either. Sounds like the major issue is too high gearing on both.

LeeG

I'd pick the Fuji because it looks nicer and doesn't have that antiquated leather saddle. The Sojourn might be better because of the big tubes for carrying lots of weight. I'd pick the pretty one and pack light.

gorshkov

I own a 2009 Raleigh Sojourn, so I can comment on that, but I am not familiar with the Fuji. I use the Sojourn for commuting, touring, and general cargo hauling with a trailer. The tours I have done with it have involved a lot of dirt roads, which it handles really well.

As to each point: the gearing is high, but I swapped the small (30t) chainring for a 24t, and that caused no problems with shifting.

The 2009 model does come with 32 spoke wheels and a brand of hub I had never heard of, so I had a new wheelset (36 spokes, A719, XT) built by the shop where I bought it. I did use the stock wheels for about a month of commuting, and didn't have any problems with them; depending on how you ride, you might not need to get different wheels. I kind of like having an extra wheelset for my primary commuting bike anyway, just in case.

The disc brakes are nice in bad weather and when pulling a heavy trailer, but are kind of a pain, because they seem to go through pads about twice as fast as rim brakes I have used, and the pads are more expensive. It is also really hard to estimate pad wear without removing the pads from the calipers.

There is toe overlap, but that is only a problem at low speeds. A related issue is that the third water bottle mount on the underside of the down tube is too close to the wheel for a bottle. I currently have my frame pump there.

It is a really heavy bike, and handles very well with panniers. I actually think it handles better with 30 lbs of gear than unloaded, provided you get the weight distribution right. You definitely want to put as much of your load as possible on the front wheel.

Another somewhat unusual feature of the Sojourn are the handlebars, which flare out a lot. I like them now, but it did take a bit of getting used to. If you are the dodge-though-city-traffic type, you won't want those bars, since they end up being about 6-8cm wider than regular drops.

Overall, I am happy with the Sojourn as a general purpose utility bike, but would get something with rim brakes if it were a dedicated touring bike.

DW99

As a Fuji Touring rider, I am curious how it gets a "sport touring" label? Not being defensive, really, but if that label is to imply that it is not a "real" touring bike, I don't agree. While I'm thinking of it I must say, I would find out how flexible the LBS is on the price of the Fuji, especially if it is a 2010 model. I believe the 2011 comes with bar end shifters and a few other small differences.

Having said that, before I got the Fuji, I considered myself a Raleigh guy, and I used to drool over the Sojourn but at $1200 or so I just couldn't pull the trigger on it. With the price difference you are talking about I believe you could change out the 32's for 36's, other commenters could say for sure. If it fits, personally I would be all over it, but that is easy for me to say. Hopefully we will hear from other Fuji Touring and Sojourn riders.

tacomee

One of the great things about cycling in 2011 is how many lower priced touring bikes are out there. Both these bikes offer great value for money.

Test ride both and buy the one you like more. Stay with a LBS to get the service you need.

BigBlueToe

I weigh 200 lbs. and have broken spokes on previous bikes - lots of spokes. I've read that 32-spoke wheels are fine if they're properly built. Fine, but not for me. I wouldn't tour on less than 36. If you are small and light, and if the wheels are built right from good-quality components, maybe. If it was me and I bought a tourer with less than superior wheels, I'd replace them before going on tour.

kayakdiver

While I no longer have my 2008 Jamis Aurora... It was a pretty nice touring mount. Ridden approx 10K miles and that included many local tours and one across the Northern Tier States. I replaced it when a car decided it needed the space I was riding. After months of wrangling with the insurance company i was able to keep it. Installed a new fork and bar tape and it is now happily ridden by my brother in law.

The only real complaint if I ever had one and it was minor was the gearing... I swapped out the Crank soon after I purchased it. Never had heal strike issues and toe overlap has never been a concern of mine.

It is a fun bike to ride when not touring.... taken it on a few very fast group rides and it did fine. Much better than my Novara that does have the longer chainstays. It's just more fun to ride. For an all rounder it is a fine choice. I also consider STI shifters as a bonus.

degan

Of those two, based only on what I can gather from the websites, I would pick the Raleigh. It comes with a Brooks saddle, 20 cm longer chainstay, and bar ends. That being said, I have absolutely no experience with either of these two bikes.

TheDazed

I bought the sojourn. I'm pretty impressed with it so far.

DW99

Alright!! Congrats to you TheDazed! I'm sure you will enjoy it, really cool bike.

TheDazed

Thanks. I can post pictures or answers questions if anyone's interested. It's not as heavy as I expected it to be from what I'd heard. It really is a gorgeous bike.

There is a problem with toe overlap but I could get used to that. Just a matter of remembering to pedal to a vertical position before making sharp turns.

I feel a little "stretched out" with my hands on the brake levers, so I'm trying to figure out how to raise the stem a little. But with my hands on the top of the bars where I like to ride, it's pretty much perfect. If anyone could tell me how to raise the threadless stem I'd be grateful. I tried just unscrewing the obvious bolt thats runs vertically down the stem and yanking up on the stem but it didn't raise at all.

GeorgeBaby

Threadless stems can't be raised in the way a quill stem can. You'll need to replace the stem itself (the dog-bone shaped part that connects the fork to the handlebars) with one with more 'rise' (using a larger angle). Best bet is to simply drop by your LBS with the bike, and say how much you need the stem to go up (if it's a lot, you may need to use a stem extender). Typical stem price is $30-$60.

Typical stem

Stem Riser

TheDazed

I'm only looking to raise it a couple cms. There seems to be 5 spacers visible where the stem protrudes from the frame. I've heard you can swap these to be below the stem to gain some height.. Or even flip the stem over to gain some height. Ever heard of this method? I just found a little how-to here: https://www.performancebike.com/bikes...aiseHandlebars

But that makes it sound like something I'd want the LBS to do. I thought it might be simpler than that.

edit: I think I got mixed up.. That picture of a stem you posted is not what I thought the stem was. I guess that part protruding from the frame is the fork?




I guess what I'm looking for here is a bit shorter stem. I wanna bring the brakes in closer to my body.

Chris Pringle

Beautiful bike indeed! If you haven't done so, make sure to play around with the saddle. Maybe you can bring it forward a little. Otherwise, your stem should be changed to a shorter one.

Watch this youtube video which I hope will help you with a better fit on your bike. Remember that new bike geometries may feel a little strange in the beginning, especially if you're used to riding another bike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAl_5e7bIHk

TheDazed

Great point I hadn't considered. It looks like I can bring my saddle forward a few cms which might be just what I need.

AlanKHG

I have a 2005 Fuji Touring that I bought used for $300 this May. It had a claimed 300 miles on it; the claim seemed reasonable based on the condition. The 2010 doesn't look much different in spec though the aesthetic is more classic on the new model.

I rode it across the country this summer & have been using it as a near-daily commuter since them. A lot of the parts on the bike haven't seemed up to an actual loaded long-haul tour and daily commuting.

The tires & saddle that came on the 2005 both were unsuitable for touring & needed to be replaced before my tour.

The previous owner apparently had the rear wheel rebuilt due to spoke failures. I lost several spokes in the front wheel starting around a thousand miles into my tour; after my tour was done and a month or two of commuting, I discovered that a nipple had actually pulled through the rear rim.

The front fork also got bent at some point, probably when I had the bike packed up on a train at some point. I am not sure whether to blame the fork or Amtrak for this, but the Fuji has a pretty uncommon front-end geometry and finding a replacement fork was a bit of an ordeal. Fuji does not apparently keep many forks in stock, and wanted $75 for a nonmatching model from another year. I was lucky enough to find a reasonably similar stainless steel touring fork at a bike swap meet.

I've also needed to replace the chain and cassette after ~6,000 miles but my maintenance practices weren't the best on tour, and the drivetrain got pretty nasty after various dirt roads and such. I didn't have any problem with the stock gearing, even riding mountain passes fully loaded, but I am young and pretty strong.

So the Fuji has a lot of parts that have needed to be replaced to build a reasonably reliable bike. $1000 is too expensive for it, in my opinion. I feel OK about having paid $300 for it. And it is a great bike now that I've replaced the trashed parts on it.

The Windsor Tourist is essentially an uglier version of the pre-2010 Fuji Touring that sells for $600 shipped (in the US, at least) which is a reasonable price for a bike that needs a bit of upgrading for the serious tourist. You'd probably be OK if you bought that bike & had the wheels retensioned.

I replaced the stock saddle on my Fuji with a Brooks, with which I am very satisfied. Even if it's not to your taste you can probably resell it for ~$70.

I've never ridden the Raleigh but I wouldn't sweat a few pounds if you're going to use the bike for loaded touring. The accessory spec looks great, too.

TheDazed

To find a "touring bike" of any kind with a $300 tag is pretty epic and I would've snatched it up too. Sounds like your fuji had a lot of issues and I'm kinda glad I didn't get that one, though the aesthetics of it really really appealed to me.

And yeah, the sojourn accessories are definitely part of the appeal, I mean, the rack is really nice, I think I'll be doing my loaded touring with that, whereas if I had gone with the fuji I definitely would've swapped that rack out.

TheDazed

In the picture above you can sorta see that at the ends of the metal arms that hold the front fenders on there's some superficial black plastic nubs jutting out for whatever reason... turns out they get snapped off really easy when you pedal into them with the toe overlap.

Edit: they're not so superficial... they are actually what holds the fender arm there, now that its broken off i can push the fender closer to the wheel and the metal arm pops up through the hole. Luckily there seems to be enough friction to keep it from moving around.. somewhat poor design choice here though. There's little screws right there that might hold the arm tighter, but I don't have an allen key in that size to say for sure.

Another edit: So I realized that the fender could be much, much closer to the tire. The metal arm can go all the way into that black plastic peg thing, but the way I got it from the bike shop, it was only in the minimal amount to hold the fender on, I pressed on the fender till the arm came way through the now visible hole and its about an inch closer to the wheel. So I'm thinking this will make my toe strikes on the fender more rare with the bit of extra clearance. I wish I had realized this before kicking the nub off, but I wrapped the end of the arm in hockey tape and live and learn.