I caught this thread after the fact, but figured I’d throw in my 2c.

I spent 8 days on a tour with a Bivy, it worked so so. Was fine for the days where it was warm and nice, was an absolute nightmare for the couple days I hit rain.

-Changing is quite doable, not easy, but doable.
-Nice and light which is a plus.
-Super easy to set up/tear down, another plus.
-Not bad when it’s nice out and no bugs.
-Sucks to high heaven when it’s raining.
-No place to relax to get out of the weather.
-No place to put your gear if it’s raining. I had to toss my rain jacket over my stuff outside.

I’ll never use one again, I bought a BA UL1 tent which is much more comfortable and has enough head room to sit up. I also noticed that after a long day in the saddle it’s really nice to stretch out, touch your toes, side twists, etc. once in a while, all but impossible in a Bivy.

I've always used a small 1 man tent, right now it's the Eureka Spitfire 1. It's nice as it's spacious enough for me to sit up and change clothes and store some gear. However I'm thinking about trying out a bivy for it's simplicity. I tent to ride into the night and just want to get comfortable as fast as possible. A bivy seems appealing as it's as easy as unrolling it, maybe even with sleeping bag already inside, crawling in and bam, sleep time. The things holding me back are the odd day where it rains heavily, and the fact that my tent is only a few ounces heavier than many bivys I've looked at.

Some bivys are 5-7 ounces. Even if you add a sil-nylon tarp, a 2 ounce pole, some cord, and some needle stakes it still is pretty light. You need to go to cottage industry suppliers like Mountain Laurel Designs, Titanium Goat, or Borah gear for them though. I typically take a 7 ounce Integral Designs Siltarp 1 when bivy camping. I have weathered some pretty rainy days and nights with a bivy, but also don't mind getting a room now and then.

That said bivy camping isn't for everyone.

BTW, as tents go the Spitfire 1 is a great tent at a bargain price point. I like it better than a lot of tents that cost a lot more.

How would you compare the efficiency in time setting up bivy and tarp vs. tent? How about pack size?

And I agree about the Spitfire, it is a very economical tent. The poles are awkwardly shaped though, that's one thing I don't like.

I don't find the setup time of either to be all that big of a deal since I can pitch the tent in a few minutes. The tarp and tent is generally a bit faster, but it varies. A lot of the time I just throw the bivy down and don't bother with the tarp. That is super quick and easy. If unexpected rain comes I have managed to just pull the tarp over me and whatever gear is around me.

I find the only real drawback to this tent to be the fact that the poles remain a bit long when folded. Given the price and all of it's other great qualities I figure I can live with that. I have toyed with having a set of poles made that stored smaller, but never went ahead with that.

Tarp size.....a smaller tarp is lighter and more compact to carry. But from the looks of some of the tarp setups, can't rain be a problem sometimes? I can see how light rains would be okay. But sustained rains coupled with the splashing that often occurs when large drops hit the ground near the edge of the tarp -- this seems like it could get things pretty wet under or inside the tarp....

Or maybe there are solutions to this?

And what about slanting rains and wind?

Nothing is perfect, and everything has its limits (even the stronger, heavier four-eason tents have limits). I'm just trying to get a clearer or more accurate sense of where tarps reach their limits, or under what conditions.

It does seem as if highly rain resistant bivies could make up for some of the gaps in tarps' abilities. Even if the tarp failed.

But then again, most of the ultralight bivies probably aren't terribly stormproof without a tarp.

Do you just accept that things will get a little wet under the tarp, and that the bivy is enough protection for those mildly wet conditions under the tarp? And that your set of conditions (the set of conditions you will encounter on tour) are within the tarp's range (of what it can handle well, or handle well enough)?

Do you just accept a little leakage, or accept that you aren't always going to stay as dry as you would inside a tent?

What size tarps seem about right overall?

Anyone have experiences with any of this?

Or any clarifications of these sorts of issues or conditions? Or useful solutions or approaches?

Tarps seem great in some ways, but less than watertight in others.

First expect a bit of moisture in any waterproof bivy. I have generally found it manageable, a bit of ice or a few drops inside the bivy near the feet. I find that the few drops are generally either not on the sleeping bag or just on the outside of the shell and they brush/wipe off easily at least with a DWR sleeping bag.

The bivy might get some spray on the outside in the rain if under a tarp, but since the bivy is at very least water resistant that should be OK.

I have used a 5'x5' tarp with a waterproof bivy, the idea being to just keep rain off of the mesh window. I am now using a 5'x8' tarp. It is a bit on the skimpy side with a bug bivy, especially if you want to keep a lot of gear dry under it. Some folks like a big 8'x10' tarp.

That's helpful information. Thanks.

I have mainly used my bivy's in the winter for mountaineering, but have used one while mountain biking. I tested it out at a campground and didn't find it too bad, but wouldn't want to spend a day inside in the rain. You can easily read a book or look at a map inside it so it does have more room than a regular hooped bivy.

I have four bivy sacks, a North Face military camo Gore-Tex (GTX) for stealth sleeping and a GTX Outdoor Research one I usually lend to friends that come along, but both are pretty much just waterproof sleeping bag liners. I also have an Outdoor Research Advanced Bivy, but rarely use it since I found one I like much better. It's the Nemo GoGo, and it's sort of a cross between a bivy and an ultralight tent. There is more room inside it than the other bivy's, but not as much as a tent. It does have a screen entrance for those buggy nights and a storm flap, but if you're looking for no condensation when it's raining outside, you will be disappointed since it's just a single wall with little ventilation when buttoned up. The unique thing about it, however, is there are no poles. Instead it uses an air bladder that is easily blown up in seconds, and it's surprisingly rigid in the wind. The bladder itself is pretty tough (I always carry a spare but have never used one) but it's also sheathed inside a second skin, so it's protected against abrasions. It's very easy to change out due to the velcro system holding it in place. I stake it out with 5 stakes (this is mainly so there is more room inside) and inflate it, and it'll be up in literally under 60 seconds, ready to crawl into.

Here is a picture of it (this is not mine, but is identical, I can't find the picture of mine at a the moment and I ride a Salsa) and it weighs about 26 ounces, but my Advanced Bivy weighs just over 32 ounces (yes, I am a hiking weight weenie).

http://forums.mtbr.com/attachments/b...s-p1020244.jpg



So to answer your questions:

• Can you manage to dress and undress in your bivy?

Yes, it's no more or less difficult than getting dressed in any small space while laying on your back. The only issue is there is no vestibule to store gear, so make sure it's protected during inclement weather by some other means. You are not sleeping in this with a pack or a lot of other gear, but shoes and some clothing is OK.

• Do you have condensation problems?

Yes and no. The GoGo does not vent very well when the front flap is closed, but it is not raining inside or puddling up at the bottom. When it's open even part way I get no condensation inside. It's a common problem with single walled structures, and this has an integrated floor that is waterproof as well. So as you see, inside an impermeable tube, you need some way to vent the moisture even a little.

• If you have condensation how much and how do you manage it?

Not a lot and I just open the flap some to let it air out.

• What conditions do you use your bivy in?

I would use the GoGo in any weather, from storms to dry, it's very well protected.

Thanks for sharing that. What you are describing is quite different from what I use and do. I would consider the bivys you mention to be in an entirely different class. To me "hooped bivys" are really little tents more so that bivys. Not knocking them, just pointing out that they are a different animal.

The bivys I own range from 5.5 oz to 15 oz. With mine I usually need to carry a tarp that might be 5-7 ounces plus a couple ounces of stakes and cords. So I am usually at a pound total plus or minus a few ounces. If the whole setup is at or heavier than 2 pounds I am inclined to skip it and go to a tent so I have never tried the hooped bivys. Obviously that is only a personal preference though.

On the all day in the rain in a bivy thing... Even when I use a tent I have always hit the road by mid morning rain or not. Those who want to hang out in the tent on rainy days may not find a bivy acceptable.

That seems like a cool options. Interestingly it was used by the current record holder of the global circumnavigation (Mike Hall). http://road.cc/content/news/59716-in...rld-record-kit (see Camping Kit section)

Not me. Never sleeping on the ground again. It's hammocks for me. They are not for everybody but they work for me.

Tried the hammocks, they hurt my back. Some friends love and swear by them, but I just couldn't make them work.

a hooped bivy is the worst of both worlds. Both a mini tent with extremely limited ventilation, AND a sagging, small area bivy sack.

But they are nice enough to read a book in during a storm, but you can do that in almost any bivy bag if you adjust the fabric enough. My preferred bivy for fast and light was Black Diamonds standard Alpine bivy with tie-in. The head area was huge, the bag rectangular enough to fit a fair bit of gear inside. The hooped bivy added unecessarily with setup and weight, and didn't contribute significantly to any real increase in anything but headroom.

I considered it a fair bit when i was working at Marmot and testing gear for MSR.... had a lot of time to weigh the options.

I'd agree with staeph's opinion its far better to bring a mini tent if you start thinking about carrying the weight of a bivy. Any bivy that weighs more than a pound is replaceable with a mini tent , As per current UL/SUL standards, unless you are going into the alpine.

A tarp and a LW bivy (or piece of tyvek or plastic for the foot of your bag when really wet) provide far better accomodations for camping out if anything like a hooped bivy sack is being considered.

just ordered a 5 ounce TiGoat ptarmagin bivy to downscale and get away from ghetto shoving the foot of my sleeping bag into a garbage bag or wrapped in tyvek. looking forward to putting it thru its paces this summer on some fast and light bike trips.

Eureka Solitaire Tent


i used one very dri and it rained every day. It was refurbished at Eureka site for $30.

Bivy bag season is upon us! Love it!

Certainly cheap enough, but it has some drawbacks that I personally can't forgive.

1. It takes a bajillion (actually 12) stakes to pitch, they add weight and are a pain to deal with.
2. It has really cheapie poles. Again heavy and given the tight bend of the one at the foot end prone to breakage. When it was being sold more widely there were many reports of pole breakage. It can probably be avoided with really careful handling while pitching though.

IMO overall the Eureka Spitfire is a much nicer tent and is also available pretty cheap. The Spitfire can be pitched with only 4 stakes and is way roomier. The reported weights are close with the Spitfire listed as slightly heavier, but actual weight of the Solitaire is more than the listed weight and my Solitaire is heavier than my Spitfire 1 even before I leave out the extra 4 stakes that I don't use with the Spitfire.

There are some things I like about the Solitaire. I like that the top zips open. I like that the fly pulls back allowing a view of the night sky and can be quickly redeployed if the weather turns bad. I figure that it could have been a really awesome tent if it weren't for some fairly fatal flaws.

Anybody want my barely used Solitaire? I'd let it go way cheap.

I've been using the Eureka Solitaire for over 10 years now. I agree that the fiberglass poles are an issue. When I bought mine they offered aluminum poles for about $30 more but I opted for the cheaper fiberglass and they have since dropped the option. A few years ago the one at the back broke and I've replaced it with a lighter and stronger aluminum one. (Even when broken the tent was still usable with a piece of duct tape around the pole.)

I've never used 12 stakes with mine. Used to carry 7 stakes: 4 for the tent corners, one for the back of the fly and two for the front corners of the fly. I've since cut it down to 5 by tying some string between the two front corners of the tent and corresponding corners of the fly. So my Solitaire has gradually been losing weight by replacement of one of the fiberglass poles by Al, elimination of a couple stakes, and replacement of the steel stakes with Ti ones as I find them abandoned at campsites.

i think 8x10 is great for one person under some pretty foul weather. i feel 5x8 and 6x8s are a bit small. I've also enjoyed shaped tarp structures. one of my first homemade shelters i made in the late 70's was a modified lean-to tarp made out of an old tent. i've still got pieces of that tent patching the bottom of aduffel bag

yeah, i've done a lot of tarp camping, and the small sizes are a little small when it really starts coming down. 8x10 gives a user a nice dry patch in the middle in all but the most foul conditions.

Just right http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=314015

a tad too small for heavy weather http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=314016

and shaped http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=314017

I plan to sew some mosquito netting around the perimeter and front of the last tarp, and carry an added piece of silnylon as a foul weather block/small tarp for the front of it.

i might try a 5x8 again with the bivy, simply because the 5x8 tarp packs up so small - the size of a red bull can - that slight discomfort under heavy weather will be worth it simply for the packed size considerations.

It's like Mr. Bean taking off his pants after putting his swimsuit on: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3smh7055cTQ.