Brooks vs Selle SMP
 

So I used to ride a brooks saddle, but switched over to a Selle Respiro on account of paranoia about perenial pressure and damage to the sexual parts. After having done my first short tour on the respiro I've decided that I hate it now. It was fine when I first got it, doing short delivery runs during the winter. In the summer heat the gel becomes much softer, and this combined with increased distance makes it very uncomfortable.

I never had any discomfort with the brooks, but I did notice a bit of pressure on the perineum. It wasn't uncomfortable, and I wasn't experiencing any numbness, but being that I was riding my bike for a living I figured it wasn't worth taking any chances with doing permanent damage to my sexual health. Trying to read up on this kind of thing I find that there's very little scientific information.

Selle SMP has a scientific study about penile blood flow, but I have heard others argue that actually a saddle with a cutout can make this problem worse as some of the blood flow runs around the edge of the perineum. Given there's only the one study, I also wonder if it was funded by Selle SMP, or if they're methods have been peer reviewed and such.

Contrary to the SMP study there's a lot of people who talk of having been riding a brooks for decades without issue.

So anyway I'm trying to decide if I should buy a Selle SMP or a Brooks Flyer. The cheapest SMP is not much less than the Brooks, but it feels as though it would wear out much more quickly. I hesitate to drop $200 on the more expensive SMPs as I'm unable to try any of them before I buy. If I go with brooks I'd probably go for the sprung Brooks Flyer. None of the sprung brooks saddles have the cutout. The cutout of the imperial isn't very sizable anyway, so I wonder what if any affect it has. Some argue that a cutout on a leather saddle just increases the hammock effect and increases perenial pressure.

Anyone have any insights? I'm probably over thinking this yes?

I had numbness and eventually figured out it wasn't so much the saddle but my riding position. I started tilting my pelvis forward instead of sitting upright, also increasing saddle setback over 9cm and finding the longest possible stem set lower. I know it's counter-intuitive to suggest this more aggressive riding position could be more comfortable but it really is. Excellent thread on the subject: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...tion-Discovery

Hmm, a lot of that thread encourages rotating your pelvis forward, taking weight off of the sit bones to improve comfort. As I understand if you take weight off of the sit bones it either has to go to your hands or to the perineum between your sit bones. All that I've read indicates that putting weight onto the perineum can cause sexual health problems.

I'm also reluctant to lower my bars because I do a lot of inner city riding. I value peripheral vision over aerodynamics.

I never had any numbness or pain while riding, I just decided to switch to a saddle with a cutout for fear that I was doing damage to myself without noticing.

http://www.63xc.com/willm/bike_sexhealth.htm

After reading this article I'm leaning toward the brooks again.

I've put quite a few miles on a Selle SMP Lite 209 saddle, a Selle SMP Extra (the $99 one), and several hundred miles on a Brooks B17.

I thought the B17 was terrible! Hard as a rock, slippery and it seemed to put a ton of pressure on my perineum. The bars on my bikes are lower than the saddle, so I couldn't imagine a scenario where the B17, wouldn't be putting lots of pressure in areas where I didn't want pressure. I happily returned it to Wall Bike for a refund.

I thought the Selle SMP Extra was quite a nice saddle. The graphics tend to start wearing off in short order, but I'm still riding the saddle after 3-4 years of ownership. It definitely concentrates your weight on your sit bones. If you're not used to this, you may find the saddle uncomfortable initially. It also has quite a bit of padding. Enough so that you'll want to stand and pedal a couple of times an hour.

When I upgraded to the Selle SMP Lite 209, I was surprised at how much better it was than the Extra! It has less padding, which I generally find works better on longer rides. Again, there was a period of adjustment due to increased pressure on the sit bones. I don't know that either of the SMP saddles reduces the incidence of saddle-related problems. I've never experienced numbness while riding and didn't experience it with either of the SMP saddles.

My current favorite saddle is none of these, however! It's the ISM Adamo Road. I decided to give it a try after reading several, seemingly independent, articles about the benefits of no-nose saddles. It's the only saddle I've tried where every position was equally comfortable. With the Lite 209 and Extra, riding the bike with my hands on the drops always seemed a bit less comfortable than riding with my hands on the tops of the brake hoods. I could optimize one position of the other, but the setup was always a bit of a compromise. With the Adamo Road, every position on the bike is now equally comfortable! FYI, the Adamo Road puts even more pressure on your sit bones than the Lite 209; they do make saddles with more padding, however.

Insights: Well I ride Brooks B17, B17n, and a couple of Pros, and had a Selle SMP for two seasons, (though old iscaselles are personal favorites). I can't remember which model SMP, but it has some padding. I thought the SMP was a step up, but over time it's found its way to my MTB, I liked the bucket seat feel and cocked nose off road, but on distance ride I prefer to move fore and aft and the SMP restricted my natural movement. For distance, I seem to go back to leather saddles like a Pro, or vintage, and on a more upright casual tourer I'll use a B17. (The problem riding that way is pain in the lower back, tailbone after 80 miles or so from sitting upright.).


At the risk of sounding like a hundred other posts, it all goes back to riding position and fit (tilt). The B17 is fine for more upright riding, but terrible if you ride in a rotated pelvis, flat back position. Expect perenial pressure if you have a B17 and you ride in the drops or stretched out. The Pro is much better in that regard, and perhaps the N because you tend to slide back off the nose. But a Flyer? That's a huge saddle. I think you'll be riding fully upright on that thing, sort of townie or dutch bike style. If that's your style, I would stay away from the SMP line altogether, it's not what those saddles are designed for as I see it.

Isn't the flyer just a sprung B17? I used to have a Team Pro, and I found it very uncomfortable because with the narrower design and the wider rivets I found that my sit bones ended up on the metal frame and the rivets of the saddle rather than the leather. Perhaps that means I have somewhat wider sit bones than most.

My handlebars are currently just a few centimeters lower than the saddle.

Sit on both and see. its not my butt, that has to be comfortable, on them.

i chose different saddles when I moved to a wet place, put the leather ones
Aside, for 'summer'.. both weeks.. :lol:

Buy the one that you find more comfortable. For me that would definitely not be the Brooks, but that is me. I'd advise a firm saddle with no gel and not much padding. I guess I am lucky because I have found the original saddles that came with my bikes to all be something that I could adjust to and use even on multi month tours. If buying new I pick a racing saddle.

Maybe take a look at

http://www.selleanatomica.com/

They do have a trial period so you would have some time to evaluate it.

http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Categor...y=&searchTerm=

Nashbar's sales on Selle SMT varieties. I have the TRK on my Fargo and I think I'll order one for my Rocky Mountain as well. I like them but the farthest I've ridden in a day is only about 38 miles. Sheesh, I've run almost that far in a day before.

But I cant do that, because in this country I'm not able to test either of the saddles before buying. I'm also concerned that although one saddle might be comfortable, that I might unknowingly damage my sexual health by using it. So while I know that the brooks is comfortable from having owned one in the past, I'm not sure I entirely trust it with perenial pressure.

That Selle Anatomica is tempting, but $40 shipping is pretty steep.

I was very pleasantly surprised by the Planet Bike ARS Competition (http://ecom1.planetbike.com/5022.html). No health issues to report with stock saddles, but like you, read some stuff on non-cutout saddles and thought why risk it.

I was between the Planet Bike and some of the ISM saddles but went cheap and haven't regretted it. NO pressure up the middle from the first ride and now that my sit bones are used to it, very little thought about my saddle at all.

Disclaimer 1: I'm a short/moderate distance commuter (5 miles round trip) and utility rider, not long distance.

Disclaimer 2: It's your butt.

If you're not experiencing numbness and not riding a bike for a living, then chances are you can ride whatever saddle you want and not have a problem. If you do spend long hours in the saddle day after day, you should read the research then decide what sort of saddle is appropriate for the amount and type of riding you do. Reading the New York Times summary of this research was one of the things that got me interested in the ISM Adamo saddles...

Hmm, those articles are interesting. While I'm not riding a bike for a living right now I was for the last three years (Bike Patrol and then Delivery). There's a chance I might go back to doing delivery again for a while after my 1 year contract here expires.